Mitch Wagner <wagner@utoday.com> (08/30/90)
I have my full name on my home answering machine messages, "Hi. This is Mitch Wagner. I can't come to the phone just now... " etc. etc. etc. I notice most people have just their first name, or even just "You have reached 555-1212." This is, I think, so people don't give out information that can be used to take advantage of them. But, what information is that? "Gosh, you know my full name! Here's my car keys!" Is there an actual reason for withholding this information? Or is it just one of those paranoid, half-baked Krimestopper Tips that makes just enough sense on he surface to keep people from questioning it? Mitch Wagner VOICE: 516/562-5758 GEnie: UNIX-TODAY UUCP: wagner@utoday.com ...uunet!utoday!wagner
Randal Schwartz <merlyn@iwarp.intel.com> (09/01/90)
In article <11589@accuvax.nwu.edu>, wagner@utoday (Mitch Wagner) writes: | I notice most people have just their first name, or even just "You | have reached 555-1212." This is, I think, so people don't give out | information that can be used to take advantage of them. | But, what information is that? "Gosh, you know my full name! Here's my | car keys!" Is there an actual reason for withholding this information? | Or is it just one of those paranoid, half-baked Krimestopper Tips that | makes just enough sense on he surface to keep people from questioning | it? Presume I'm a bad guy (I've been called that before, but you probably shouldn't know that :-). I am calling my friend. I misdial. I hear your message. If you're female, and I'm into harrassing, I wanna know what number I dialed so I can look it up again, and harrass you later when you are home (sexist comment intended ... there are probably other combinations too). If I'm a thief, I now know you probably aren't home, so I can look up your address in the book, and rob you. Basically, if I've looked you up in the book in the first place (or I'm already in an ongoing interaction with you), I *know* who I've called, so your message should just confirm it (with the minimum information possible). If I *don't* know who I've called, there's no point in filling me in, from a security standpoint. (Are there any other uses for ID besides these two? Write me if there are ... I'm trying to keep up on pop security issues.) Just another security weenie, Randal L. Schwartz, Stonehenge Consulting Services (503)777-0095 on contract to Intel's iWarp project, Beaverton, Oregon, USA, Sol III merlyn@iwarp.intel.com ...!any-MX-mailer-like-uunet!iwarp.intel.com!merlyn
wagner@utoday.com (Mitch Wagner) (09/03/90)
In article <11620@accuvax.nwu.edu> Randal Schwartz <merlyn@iwarp. intel.com> writes: # If you're female, and I'm into harrassing, I wanna know what number # I dialed so I can look it up again, and harrass you later when you are home # (sexist comment intended ... there are probably other combinations too). Okay, good point. Still, I'm *not* female, and, as a matter of fact, I ain't getting enough "harassment" lately, ha-ha. # If I'm a thief, I now know you probably aren't home, so I can # look up your address in the book, and rob you. VERY good point. I am changing my answering-machine message forthwith. Mitch Wagner VOICE: 516/562-5758 GEnie: UNIX-TODAY UUCP: wagner@utoday.com ...uunet!utoday!wagner
nam2254%dsacg2.dsac.dla.mil@dsac.dla.mil (Tom Ohmer) (09/06/90)
From article <11671@accuvax.nwu.edu>, by wagner@utoday.com (Mitch
Wagner):
< In article <11620@accuvax.nwu.edu> Randal Schwartz <merlyn@iwarp.
< intel.com> writes:
< # If I'm a thief, I now know you probably aren't home, so I can
< # look up your address in the book, and rob you.
< VERY good point. I am changing my answering-machine message forthwith.
I did this, just the other day. I NEVER pick up my phone when it
rings. At home, that is. My outgoing message used to be:
"Hello, you have reached 239-9519. I'm either screening my calls, or
I just can't come to the phone right now. After you hear the tone,
please leave your name, day and time of your call, and a message. You
will have about 30 seconds. Thank you."
Now it is:
"Hello, you have reached Tom at 9519 in Columbus. When trying to get
me to answer your call if I am able, or when leaving a message,
include your name, as voices are not easy to identify on the answering
machine speaker. Also, include the day and time. Thank you."
I realize that you don't have to be a rocket scientist to spend a
little time and figure out what my full number is. I'm just not
handing it out anymore. Any comp.dcom.telecom.outgoing.message.gurus
care to improve on this?
Tom Ohmer @ Defense Logistics Agency Systems Automation Center,
DSAC-AMB, Bldg. 27-6, P.O. Box 1605, Columbus, OH 43216-5002
UUCP: ...osu-cis!dsac!tohmer INTERNET: tohmer@dsac.dla.mil
Phone: (614) 238-8059 AutoVoN: 850-8059 Disclaimer claimed
[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point
announcement: "This is a recorded announcement. For your convenience,
this line is answered at all times by an answering machine. You will
never reach anyone direct at this number. At the tone, leave your
name, telephone number, a brief message and the time of day that you
called. If it is convenient for me, and I wish to do so, I will return
your call." Nothing left to the imagination, is there! Another
machine here in Chicago I've called comes right to the point. It
answers, "You know what this is, what it is used for, and what to do
next." (Beep) PAT]
oplinger@minerva.crd.ge.com (B. S. Oplinger) (09/06/90)
>[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point >announcement: "This is a recorded announcement. For your convenience, I rather like my friend's: 'Eric not home. Leave message.' brian oplinger@crd.ge.com <#include standard.disclaimer>
ebh@argon.uucp (Ed Horch) (09/06/90)
From Charles Bukowski's _Hollywood_:
I decided to phone Francois Racine to see how he was doing.
I got his answering machine:
"Do not speak to me. Speak to this machine. I am nowhere
and you are also nowhere. Death comes with his little hands
to grip us. I do not wish to speak. Speak to this machine."
The beep sounded.
-Edmalloy@nprdc.navy.mil (Sean Malloy) (09/06/90)
>[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point >announcement: "This is a recorded announcement. For your convenience, >this line is answered at all times by an answering machine. You will >never reach anyone direct at this number. At the tone, leave your >name, telephone number, a brief message and the time of day that you >called. If it is convenient for me, and I wish to do so, I will return >your call." Nothing left to the imagination, is there! Another >machine here in Chicago I've called comes right to the point. It >answers, "You know what this is, what it is used for, and what to do >next." (Beep) PAT] I fell in love with an answering machine message from a recent 'Shoe' comic strip, and adapted it for my machine. It's arrogant, it's honest, and since putting it on my answering machine, the number of telephone solicitations has dropped off almost completely (one call in two months, when the previous rate was two or three every week): "Hello. You've reached Sean Malloy and Richard Campbell. We can't come to the phone right now, because we're listening intently to this machine to decide whether you're someone we want to talk with. So, at the beep, start talking. If we want to talk to you, we'll probably come on the line with some lame excuse, such as 'I was just on my way out the door when the phone rang.' If you get all the way through your message, and we don't pick up, it's because we don't want to talk to you." Sean Malloy Navy Personnel Research & Development Center San Diego, CA 92152-6800 malloy@nprdc.navy.mil [Moderator's Note: Actually, I reprinted that Shoe cartoon here several months ago, but it is worth a repeat. Thanks for sending it in! PAT]
browns@uunet.uu.net (BROWN, STAN) (09/06/90)
>[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point >announcement: "This is a recorded announcement. For your convenience, ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Arrgh! This sort of thing really ticks me off -- being INconvenienced is bad enough, but told that it's for my convenience goes beyond the pale! Why not be honest and say "For MY convenience"! Otherwise, I like this message. Thank you, I feel better now! Just for the record -- I am _not_ against answering machines. All I am saying is, don't pretend that it's for someone else's convenience. Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Cleveland, Ohio, U.S.A. (216) 371-0043 The opinions expressed are mine. Mine alone! Nobody else is responsible for them or even endorses them -- except my cat Dexter, and he signed the power of attorney only under my threat to cut off his Cat Chow!
wagner@utoday.com (Mitch Wagner) (09/07/90)
In article <11763@accuvax.nwu.edu> nam2254%dsacg2.dsac.dla.mil@ dsac.dla.mil (Tom Ohmer) writes: # [Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point # announcement: "This is a recorded announcement. For your convenience, # this line is answered at all times by an answering machine. You will # never reach anyone direct at this number. At the tone, leave your # name, telephone number, a brief message and the time of day that you # called. If it is convenient for me, and I wish to do so, I will return # your call." Nothing left to the imagination, is there! This is called "surrendering to the criminals." My friends may have to get a tape message when the call me -- at least they can have a friendly, cheerful tape message. # Another machine here in Chicago I've called comes right to the point. It # answers, "You know what this is, what it is used for, and what to do # next." (Beep) PAT] I used to have one that said, "Hi, you know who I am, what this is, what it's used for, what to do, what to put in it, when to do it, and why. So do it. Bye." Mitch Wagner VOICE: 516/562-5758 GEnie: UNIX-TODAY UUCP: wagner@utoday.com ...uunet!utoday!wagner
John.Pettitt@specialix.co.uk (09/07/90)
Oh well, since we are on this subject: Our machine at home has the follwoing message: <meeeeeoooowwwww> [sound of rather dim British Blue cat being squeezed] As you can hear we haven't trained the cats to answer the phone so you will have to talk to this thing instead <beep> We have had several people leave "I seem to have the wrong number but I like the message" plus one threat to call the RSPCA !
king@uunet.uu.net (Steven King) (09/07/90)
Then there's my friend's machine, which is really annoying the first time you call it. "Hello? ... Yeah ... Who is this? ... Uh-huh ... This is a machine. Leave a message. *BEEP*" Of course, if you're REALLY anti-social just record fast busy on your outgoing tape... Steve King, Motorola Cellular (...uunet!motcid!king)
MCMAHON%GRIN1.BITNET@cunyvm.cuny.edu (McMahon,Brian D) (09/08/90)
In TELECOM Digest V10 #624, Sean Malloy <malloy@nprdc.navy.mil> writes: >I fell in love with an answering machine message from a recent 'Shoe' >comic strip, and adapted it for my machine. Shoe had an even better one a few moons ago. The phone rings on the Perfesser's desk, and picks up with "Hello, this is Perfesser Fishhawk. No one can find the phone right now..." To appreciate this one, you'd have to know what the Perfesser's desk looks like. Or mine. I *know* there's a desk here somewhere, because something must be holding up all these printouts. "The paperless office" -- the BIG lie! Brian McMahon <MCMAHON@GRIN1.BITNET> Grinnell College Computer Services Grinnell, Iowa 50112 USA Voice: +1 515 269 4901 Fax: +1 515 269 4936
peter@ficc.ferranti.com (Peter da Silva) (09/08/90)
In article <11810@accuvax.nwu.edu> abvax!iccgcc.decnet.ab.com! browns@uunet.uu.net (BROWN, STAN) writes: > Just for the record -- I am _not_ against answering machines. All I > am saying is, don't pretend that it's for someone else's convenience. I don't know. Seems more convenient to leave a message than to keep ringing back at random periods in the hopes of catching someone at a phone. Peter da Silva. +1 713 274 5180. peter@ferranti.com
"Peter M. Weiss" <PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu> (09/08/90)
For the sake of your associates/friends who call you over toll facilities, I would think it appropriate to have your OGM be as short as possible. Pete
gillett@ceomax.enet.dec.com (Christopher Gillett) (09/09/90)
Thus spaketh the Moderator: >[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point >announcement Hmmm. Let's cut through all this and get to the absolute bare essentials: "When it beeps...speak!" :-) Christopher Gillett gillett@ceomax.enet.dec.com Digital Equipment Corporation Hudson, Taxachusetts (508) 568-7172 Semiconductor Engineering Group/Logic Simulation Group Disclaimer: Ken Olsen speaks for Digital...I speak for me!
SYSMATT@ukcc.uky.edu (Matt Simpson) (09/10/90)
The most succinct answering machine recording I have heard is: "You have reached nnn-nnnn. Why?"
HAMER524@ruby.vcu.edu (Robert M. Hamer) (09/11/90)
>[Moderator's Note: How about this one for a succinct, to-the-point >announcement: (text omitted) Since the day I got my answering machine, its outgoing message has been: "This is an answering machine. Please leave your message. Thank you."
barrey@ka (Barrey Jewall) (09/11/90)
In article <11877@accuvax.nwu.edu> motcid!king@uunet.uu.net (Steven King) writes: >Then there's my friend's machine, which is really annoying the first >time you call it. >Hello? ... Yeah ... Who is this? ... Uh-huh ... This is a machine. >Leave a message. *BEEP*" Not to run this topic into the ground, here's a couple of my favorites, which my roommates and I have used in the past: (soft, sultry, female voice) "You know what this is, and you know what to do, so do it at the beep." ******* Same voice, a little louder: (Sound of erotic moaning in background) Uhh, we can't get the phone now, oooh!, but leave a number and we'll (BEEP!) ******* I think the best one was when a friend of ours who works in a recording studio let us mess around one night: "Hello, this is the rock doctor, you're on the air." (Extremely wasted-sounding individual) " Uhh, I'm going to the Ted Nugent concert, and , uhh, I'm going to take some pot, and some Acid, and a quart of rum, and some uppers man, and ,uhh, I was wondering if there was anything else I should take?" "Yeah, an ambulance!" Normal voice- "We can't get to the phone now, so leave a message." We had to take these off our machines when we sent out resumes with our numbers on 'em... 8-( Another friend's machine answers: "This is the Wichita National Weapons Laboratory, please leave a message." + Barrey Jewall ++ "My opinions are my opinions" + + barrey@novell.com ++ (rather self-evident, eh?) + + Novell, Inc.- San Jose, Calif.++ +
lemke@apple.com (Steve Lemke) (09/11/90)
PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu (Peter M. Weiss) writes: >For the sake of your associates/friends who call you over toll >facilities, I would think it appropriate to have your OGM be as short >as possible. Or, just get a machine that lets you punch in the "#" key to skip the outgoing message altogether. Many machines will do this (and voicemail systems, too), even if the person who's machine it is doesn't _realize_ that it can do this. Try it next time you talk to an answering machine. In addition, date and time stamp is becoming quite popular these days, and most people who call my machine now know that I have it and that they no longer have to tell me what time they're calling. And again, most voicemail systems also time stamp incoming messages. When I first got my present machine (the Panasonic one that someone mentioned also functions as a room "bug"), my message said something like "Hi, this is Steve. Although my new machine will tell me what day and time you called, it doesn't know your name or number so please leave that at the tone." Steve Lemke, Engineering Quality Assurance, Radius Inc., San Jose Reply to: lemke@radius.com (Note: NEW domain-style address!!)
ted@eslvcr.wimsey.bc.ca (Ted Powell) (09/11/90)
In article <11888@accuvax.nwu.edu> PMW1@psuvm.psu.edu (Peter M. Weiss) writes: >For the sake of your associates/friends who call you over toll >facilities, I would think it appropriate to have your OGM be as short >as possible. After confirming that it works on your make/model, tell your associates and friends to press the * key as soon as they're sure they have the right number, and they will get an immediate beep. ted@eslvcr.wimsey.bc.ca ...!ubc-cs!van-bc!eslvcr!ted (Ted Powell)
mpd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) (09/11/90)
motcid!king@uunet.uu.net (Steven King) writes: >Of course, if you're REALLY anti-social just record fast busy on your >outgoing tape... This reminds me of what I generally do the first time I get a new number: I call the number and record the "<beep> The number you have reached ... <number> has been disconnected..." on a special outgoing message tape, which I save for later use. Then, when the time comes when the telemarketers are rabid (or it is primary season, where candidates' staff members are calling you for your support) I leave the "special" OGM tape in. Michael P. Deignan, President -- Small Business Systems, Inc. Domain: mpd@anomaly.sbs.com -- Box 17220, Esmond, RI 02917 UUCP: ...uunet!rayssd!anomaly!mpd -- Telebit: +1 401 455 0347 XENIX Archives: login: xxcp, password: xenix Index: ~/SOFTLIST
carroll@beaver.cs.washington.edu (Jeff Carroll) (09/13/90)
In article <11810@accuvax.nwu.edu> abvax!iccgcc.decnet.ab.com!browns (BROWN, STAN) writes: >Arrgh! This sort of thing really ticks me off -- being INconvenienced >is bad enough, but told that it's for my convenience goes beyond the >pale! Why not be honest and say "For MY convenience"! Otherwise, I >like this message. >Thank you, I feel better now! >Just for the record -- I am _not_ against answering machines. All I >am saying is, don't pretend that it's for someone else's convenience. If you were one of the people who has tried to reach me at what we here at Boeing euphemistically describe as an "office", you would understand what a convenience the answering machine on my home line is. I admit that the answering machine is something of a convenience to me, but I think that it's likely much more convenient to the caller, who no longer has to try to track me down and/or guess what time I will be home. Store-and-forward (or forward-and-store) messaging is quite a concept. Until universal email comes along, the answering machine is probably the nicest thing I can do for the unfortunate souls who have to be able to find me. Jeff Carroll carroll@atc.boeing.com
korenek@ficc.ferranti.com (Gary Korenek) (09/14/90)
Every great once-in-a-while, I make a call, and the phone on the other end is answered with "Hello". I say "Hello, this Gary, (etc.). Then I notice that there was no pause on the other end while I said "Hello". What I got was an answering machine whose owner undeliberately left a OGM that fooled me. This happens to me maybe once or twice a year. When it does, for a brief moment I feel like a clod. So on my own OGM, the first word is something other than "Hello". IMHO this is being cordial to whoever is calling me. When I first got my machine and recorded an OGM, my wife (girl friend at the time) said my OGM was so long that she fell asleep when listening to it. I learned from that to make OGM's clear, short, and sweet. I think it's appreciated. Gary Korenek (korenek@ficc.ferranti.com) Ferranti International Controls Corp. Sugar Land, Texas (713)274-5357
jbaltz@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu (Jerry B. Altzman) (09/14/90)
>"You know what this is, and you know what to do, so do it at the >beep." Uh oh. Creative answering machine messages were what we spent our copious free time doing at Columbia :-) Our message (in my suite) for a while was me, in my best bass, saying: "SPEAK!" (I think that's pretty much to the point) For those Talmudic scholars out there: "Hello, this is the law offices of Hillel and Shammai. Please leave your name, number and brief message at the beep. These are the words of Hillel. Shammai says, leave your message first, and then your name and number, but both are the words of the living God." (Hillel and Shammai were Rabbis who almost always disagreed.) DISCLAIMER: This isn't Columbia. This is me. Columbia is them. jerry b. altzman 212 854 8058 jbaltz@columbia.edu jauus@cuvmb (bitnet) NEVIS::jbaltz (HEPNET) ...!rutgers!columbia!jbaltz (bang!)
tad@ssc.UUCP (Tad Cook) (09/14/90)
In article <12012@accuvax.nwu.edu>, barrey@ka (Barrey Jewall) writes: > I think the best one was when a friend of ours who works in a > recording studio let us mess around one night: > "Hello, this is the rock doctor, you're on the air." My pal Norm was doing a promotion on his afternoon show on KOMO AM, which is a 50KW clear channel station in Seattle. He was giving away $5,000, and he kept saying on the air live and in commercials: "FIVE thousand dollars CASH!" During this time, I cajoled him (it wasn't easy!) to make a tape for my answering machine, which I still have. It says: "Oooooooo this may be YOUR LUCKY DAY! You may have WON FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS CASH!! Just leave your credit card number and expiration date, and we'll get right back to ya! THANKS for the call!" Reading it doesn't do it justice. You have to hear it. Maybe someday I can arrange to put it on for a weekend, just so Digest readers can call and hear it! Tad Cook Seattle, WA Packet: KT7H @ N7HFZ.WA.USA.NA Phone: 206/527-4089 MCI Mail: 3288544 Telex: 6503288544 MCI UW USENET:...uw-beaver!sumax!amc-gw!ssc!tad or, tad@ssc.UUCP
appell@hou2d.att.com (David Appell) (09/15/90)
mpd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) writes: >This reminds me of what I generally do the first time I get a new >number: I call the number and record the "<beep> The number you have >reached ... <number> has been disconnected..." on a special outgoing >message tape, which I save for later use. Then, when the time comes >when the telemarketers are rabid (or it is primary season, where >candidates' staff members are calling you for your support) I leave >the "special" OGM tape in. My housemate did this once, and the confusion it caused among callers, and their queries to the phone company, ultimately caused NJ Bell to call him and tell him, "Hey, just cut it out, OK." David Appell ...att!cbnewsh!david david@cbnewsh.att.com
friedl@mtndew.tustin.ca.us (Steve Friedl) (09/17/90)
Michael P. Deignan tells of his "special" answering machine tape that sounds like "<beep> The number you have reached ... <number> has been disconnected..." David Appell responds: > My housemate did this once, and the confusion it caused among > callers, and their queries to the phone company, ultimately caused NJ > Bell to call him and tell him, "Hey, just cut it out, OK." What *legal* authority does the telco have to stop this kind of thing? I believe that "cut it out please" is entirely reasonable for them, and I am not looking to pick a fight with my local telco, I am just curious what basis they have for recourse, if any. Stephen J. Friedl, KA8CMY / I speak for me only / Tustin, CA / 3B2-kind-of-guy +1 714 544 6561 / friedl@mtndew.Tustin.CA.US / {uunet,attmail}!mtndew!friedl [Moderator's Note: What *legal* authority they have to stop such a message resides in the tariffs which address the problem of subscribers who cause interference with the service given to other subscribers. Since most subscribers -- relatively unsophisticated in telephony -- would associate the tones and message text with an 'official' announcement regards the status of the line, it is reasonable to assume the other subscribers would be confused by what they heard, causing them to expend money (on additional calls to Enquiries) and time (in consulting with the operator and the business office) to detirmine what was going on. While the operator attempted to place the call for the subscriber, she would be unavailable to assist other subscribers. Thus a degradation in the service provided to other subscribers. And since most subscribers would reasonably associate the tones and message text with telco, telco could claim that the person making such an announcement over the phone was falsely claiming to represent, or speak for the company. PAT]
dittman@skbat.csc.ti.com (Eric Dittman) (09/18/90)
In article <12188@accuvax.nwu.edu>, appell@hou2d.att.com (David Appell) writes: > mpd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) writes: >>This reminds me of what I generally do the first time I get a new >>number: I call the number and record the "<beep> The number you have >>reached ... <number> has been disconnected..." on a special outgoing >>message tape, which I save for later use. > My housemate did this once, and the confusion it caused among > callers, and their queries to the phone company, ultimately caused NJ > Bell to call him and tell him, "Hey, just cut it out, OK." I was playing with my answering machine one day and accidentally changed the message to dead silence followed by the "If you'd like to make a call, please hang up ...". My sister called to talk to me and got that message. She hung up and tried again, and got the same message (obviously). She tried a few more times with no luck, and the dead space before the actual beep was long enough that she wasn't waiting for the beep. She had the operator put the call through, same message. She had the operator stay on the line. They tried to figure out what was going on with no luck, but this time they stayed on long enough that I got some of their dis- cussion recorded. Finally she called me at work and told me that my phone line at home was messed up and told me to call the local office. I called my home first and figured out what was going on, which was good, since upon calling the local company I found out that they were ready to disconnect the line until they could isolate the problem. I explained what had happened, and fixed the OGM. My question is, shouldn't the local company (Southwestern Bell) have been able to tell that everything was okay and the problem was just a bad OGM? Or would the disconnect have been to simply prevent a lot of calls from people calling my home and encountering this message? Eric Dittman Texas Instruments - Component Test Facility dittman@skitzo.csc.ti.com dittman@skbat.csc.ti.com Disclaimer: I don't speak for Texas Instruments or the Component Test Facility. I don't even speak for myself. [Moderator's Note: When you do something which causes a disruption or degradation in the service of other subscribers, then telco can cut you off if necessary. Although in your case it was an accident that the message was played out, it did cause some wasted network resources to say nothing of wasted operator's time. PAT]
dittman@skbat.csc.ti.com (Eric Dittman) (09/18/90)
In article <12188@accuvax.nwu.edu>, appell@hou2d.att.com (David Appell) writes: > mpd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) writes: >>This reminds me of what I generally do the first time I get a new >>number: I call the number and record the "<beep> The number you have >>reached ... <number> has been disconnected..." on a special outgoing >>message tape, which I save for later use. > My housemate did this once, and the confusion it caused among > callers, and their queries to the phone company, ultimately caused NJ > Bell to call him and tell him, "Hey, just cut it out, OK." I was playing with my answering machine one day and accidentally changed the message to dead silence followed by the "If you'd like to make a call, please hang up ...". My sister called to talk to me and got that message. She hung up and tried again, and got the same message (obviously). She tried a few more times with no luck, and the dead space before the actual beep was long enough that she wasn't waiting for the beep. She had the operator put the call through, same message. She had the operator stay on the line. They tried to figure out what was going on with no luck, but this time they stayed on long enough that I got some of their discussion recorded. Finally she called me at work and told me that my phone line at home was messed up and told me to call the local office. I called my home first and figured out what was going on, which was good, since upon calling the local company I found out that they were ready to disconnect the line until they could isolate the problem. I explained what had happened, and fixed the OGM. My question is, shouldn't the local company (Southwestern Bell) have been able to tell that everything was okay and the problem was just a bad OGM? Or would the disconnect have been to simply prevent a lot of calls from people calling my home and encountering this message? Eric Dittman Texas Instruments - Component Test Facility dittman@skitzo.csc.ti.com dittman@skbat.csc.ti.com Disclaimer: I don't speak for Texas Instruments or the Component Test Facility. I don't even speak for myself. [Moderator's Note: When you do something which causes a disruption or degradation in the service of other subscribers, then telco can cut you off if necessary. Although in your case it was an accident that the message was played out, it did cause some wasted network resources to say nothing of wasted operator's time. PAT]
dave@uunet.uu.net (Dave Levenson) (09/18/90)
A friend of mine's answering machine announcement says:
This is xxxx xxxx.
If you don't leave a message, I won't call you back.
Dave Levenson Voice: 908 647 0900 Fax: 908 647 6857
Westmark, Inc. UUCP: {uunet | rutgers | att}!westmark!dave
Warren, NJ, USA AT&T Mail: !westmark!davempd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) (09/18/90)
tad@ssc.UUCP (Tad Cook) writes: >During this time, I cajoled him (it wasn't easy!) to make a tape for >my answering machine, which I still have. It says: >"Oooooooo this may be YOUR LUCKY DAY! You may have WON FIVE THOUSAND >DOLLARS CASH!! Just leave your credit card number and expiration >date, and we'll get right back to ya! THANKS for the call!" Hey! I know this guy! He keeps calling my answering machine, telling me to call him back IMMEDIATELY at 1-900-some-num. Then he grumbles something about "only $9.95 per call..." Michael P. Deignan, President -- Small Business Systems, Inc. Domain: mpd@anomaly.sbs.com -- Box 17220, Esmond, RI 02917 UUCP: ...uunet!rayssd!anomaly!mpd -- Telebit: +1 401 455 0347 XENIX Archives: login: xxcp, password: xenix Index: ~/SOFTLIST
wb8foz@mthvax.cs.miami.edu (David Lesher) (09/19/90)
|Michael P. Deignan tells of his "special" answering machine tape that |sounds like | | "<beep> The number you have reached ... | <number> has been disconnected..." | I guess it is time to tell the best telco_tale I have ever heard. I hope Mr. Moderator will keep his flames in check. First, it's not MY story, and secondly, it comes from his Pax Belliphonis era, i.e. recorded history. A long long time ago, in a CO far, far away ... A friend of mine named Phil opened a service business. Since, at that time, he lived with his mother, he needed a second line for the enterprise. The only problem was that the LAST sub on that assignment was a woman who led, shall we say, an active social life. Men (LOTS of MEN) called at ALL hours of the day and night. Some implied that they were paying for the phone, and her apartment, and ... They tended to be upset with Phil's mother (much less Phil!) when she answered the phone. They got very abusive and DEMANDED to talk to Jane, who it seems, had left town in a manner imitated years later by the Baltimore Colts. Now Phil knew that his mother would not tolerate much of this. But short of getting a new assignment, and reprinting all his cards and stationary, AND telling all his customers, what could he do? Clearly an answering machine was the solution. The only problem was: In those pre-Carterphone days, you could not buy such. (After all, it was FOREIGN EQUIPMENT.) So Phil called up his friends in the {deleted} stockroom (guess where he worked BEFORE he opened his business) and he soon had a used (oops -- remanufactured) 1B answering machine at home. The only problem was: Only those folks willing to rent one were supposed to have same. So Phil recorded the standard panel office message "I'm sorry, the number you have reached is not a working number" as an OGM. He also futzed with the box (more like a M1 tank, really -- have you ever seen a 1B?) so that it answered with a flash of supervision, then played the message, the way the CO did. (Alas, it did NOT cut through to an intercept operator afterwards -- the way a real disconnected number did.) All was fine for months. Most of the men gave up on Jane, and Phil's customers all knew enough to talk to the box. Besides, if you called from a coin slot, you got your nickel back! Then the machine started to take LOTS of calls. No messages, but there were many click-click-click sounds in the background, along with some words later heard on tapes made in the Oval Office. This kept up for about a week. One day, Phil got back in a little early (1900) and sat down to do paperwork. The phone went crazy. Ring, "I'm sorry.." Click. Ring "I'm", click, etc. After about 20 rounds of this, Phil reached over and answered the phone: "Hello?" "Oh my god, mister ... whatever you do, don't hang up," the voice said. "Oh, why is that?" Phil asked. "This is the telephone company, and you have REAL PROBLEMS on your phone." Then the poor switchman went on to explain what had happened. It seems that Ma had botched his bill, and claimed that he was three months behind on his local service. So the business office called to chew him out. But ... "the number you have reached" ... So of course the Business Office asked Accounting why THEY were still billing this guy whose line was not in service. They, of course, said it WAS in service. This filtered on down to the CO, where they checked his pair. Nope, it is NOT tied to intercept at the frame. "Ring, I'm sorry" ... But IT MUST BE! So they traced the pair out through the cable vault. "Ring, I'm sorry" still came through. So The Boss told Joe Frame to "CLEAR THIS TROUBLE before you leave today" and that's what Joe was doing. At first, Joe thought it must be crossed with another pair in the switch. So he unplugged the old intercept announcment machine. "Ring, I'm sorry" ... So Joe's NEXT thought was that the pair was SOMEHOW crossed with one ending up in another CO. So, one after another, Joe was calling the night man at the other CO's, having each one unplug HIS announcer, and trying again. Even in those days, that was a lot of CO's -- hence a lot of calls. Joe had worked his way through about 60% of the list when Phil answered. Joe asked Phil's indulgence, and said he would call back. Phil answered, but as he said years later: "I really should have let it ring through ONE more time." Joe proclaimed the trouble cleared, and went home. Phil disconnected the 1B, and got a friend to help him move it to the basement. Oh, BTW. Phil got a refund for three months service. He would have sent it back, but HOW could he explain it? wb8foz@mthvax.cs.miami.edu (305) 255-RTFM pob 570-335 33257-0335
BRUCE@ccavax.camb.com (Barton F. Bruce) (09/19/90)
PAT said: > And since most subscribers would reasonably > associate the tones and message text with telco, telco could claim > that the person making such an announcement over the phone was > falsely claiming to represent, or speak for the company. PAT] I always thought any random SIT tones were a great idea to thwart telemarketers. The really good ones are using predictive dialers that use DSP chips to monitor the call and can switch to an idle agent (assuming one is free) so fast that MOST of your "Hello" will be heard. Who you are, etc. also pops up on the agent's screen at the same time. The trunk to agent ratios can be 1.5:1 or higher. They DON'T want idle agents. That same DSP chip also listens for things other than human voice, and SIT tones immediately indicate the called party is NOT going to be answering, or so they think. If telco complains, say you will stop using SIT tones when they provide free telemarketer blocking for your phone. If you are a regular at DPU hearings, and send a few letters a week to various legislators about Telecom issues, I doubt telco would find cutting you off worth while, even though they would like to.
DREUBEN@eagle.wesleyan.edu (DOUGLAS SCOTT REUBEN)) (09/20/90)
Pat- While I agree with you that making use of a Telco recording MAY rightfully get you in trouble with said Telco due to false representation, I find it hard to believe that the tariff(s) which specify degradation of service were intended towards callers leaving "confusing" outgoing messages. For example, what if I had an Outgoing Message (OGM) on my machine that said: "We're sorry, the number you have reached is being checked for trouble. Please try your call again later. Thank you. 508-221." Now this may SOUND like a NETel recording, yet nowhere is NETel mentioned, and NO reference is made to the phone company at all. Simply because something SOUNDS similar doesn't mean it is the same thing, and in this case the entire OGM can be quite "legitimate" (ie, everything said in there is true, as I may be checking the phone for trouble and using the machine for my own purposes to see if I can call in or not, and I don't want anyone else to call.) It may very well sound a LOT like a NETel recording, but as long as I don't mention "NETel" or the "phone company" etc., ie, I don't try to pass my number off as one of theirs, then I doubt they can legally do anything about it. If you insist that they CAN do something about a message like this, then where do we draw the line? Must I put a disclaimer in ANY message which sounds SOMEWHAT similar to the Telco's saying "This is not XXX Bell Co., but my own message!"? That is to say, if I had a carphone set *71 (no answer transfer) to my answering machine, and the OGM said: "The mobile customer you have reached is not in the vehicle. Please call 702-741-7626. Thank you. 415-3E.", can the telco tell me to get rid of that message? If your argument is followed to its conclusion, the answer seems to be "yes, they can." For example, someone calls my car number, hears that I am not in, and then calls 702-741-7626. The caller gets a dial tone (from the ROAM port). The caller hangs up, and dials again. Same thing. After 10 calls, the caller calls Directory Assistance in 702 and asks for me. No listing. The caller then calls the operator, who if she isn't aware that "7626" is a Roam port and/or it doesn't show on her screen (which HAS happened - I've managed to make COLLECT call attempts to Roam ports a few years ago!), will keep trying to get a non-dial tone answer, may talk to her supervisor, and may then put in a trouble report. Clearly, a LOT of time is taken up. And one could argue that I SHOULD have said "Hi, I'm not around now ... if you are calling my mobile #, try calling me at the Reno Roam port, 702-741-7626. Thanks. 415-3E.". Yet what if that one answering machine served a group of mobile phones, and we all wanted the same generic OGM? Then what? Do we have to structure OUR OGM so that it is acceptable to the phone company? How innocuous does a message have to get before no "disclaimer" is necessary? I can think of numerous other OGMs that would cause similar trouble. How about my brother, who sometimes has 30 seconds of a guitar solo on his OGM? Too confusing? Too many people will call operators asking "Why am I getting KZAP-FM on my phone line?". Or how about some of my old college roomates, who were too busy to leave a message and just left the OGM blank, and had an answering machine that picked up so quickly sometimes you wouldn't even hear a ring? What if someone called and claimed "I called 346-9999 and no one answered and nothing happened at all." Should the Telco then call my roomates and say "Look, we don't like your answering machine because it picks up too quickly, and for that matter, we don't like the lack of a message on your machine - put one on there or we will bother you." And while I'm at it, what if my phone line is used as a data line for five days out of a week? Now lots of people try to call me during the week, but they keep getting this busy signal. So one guy who thinks he is particularly clever calls the operator and asks for a "Verification" (which is free in my area.) The op. tests the line, says "It's in use", and hangs up. But the guy is very curious, so he does this every day until he can get through - AND, he goes to payphones each time so that the telco never knows it is really the same person calling. Should the telco be able to tell me: "Hey, this guy keeps calling you, and your line is always busy, and he is bothering our operators,so we don't want you using the phone line so much so that he can get through!"? Of course not! I am using my phone for a legitimate purpose, and although the telco derives no revenue from my usage (let's say it's a local call), it is certainly not my fault that someone keeps calling the operators for a verification every day. Moreover, this is analogous to the answering machine situation: I have a message which creates some confusion, so people call the operators all the time, and this takes up the operators' time. SO WHAT? The Telco is getting revenue from the calls to my machine, and I am in good faith leaving messages which *I* like to leave and which in no way represent myself as an agent of the Telco. I am not trying to hurt the telco, and I am using my phone line in the way which I see fit, which doesn't actively cause trouble for anyone. Although the tariff may indeed have implications for customers who cause harm to the network (such as using line current to charge batteries! :-)), I doubt that it was the intent of those who drafted the tariff to prevent customers from leaving ambiguous or confusing messages. Although an OGM may cause a higher degree of use of telco faclities than would have otherwise been necessary, this is one of the costs of being in the phone business, the same way that not EVERY phone will be answered when it is called, wasting Telco (and possibly LD) facilities on the attempt. The intent of the tariff more probably lies in efforts to reduce the use of non-Bell or non FCC certified equipment which the telco previously feared would damage the network, to reduce the amount of fraud committed by use of Telco facilites, to prevent customers from using their lines to annoy other customers or to make it impossible or more difficult for other customers to use their line(s) (as in a prty line), etc. Rather than put the burden of having an "acceptable" message on the customer, it seems more realistic to expect the Telco to have people well qualified enough to realize that they are getting a machine, and can thus inform the customer. Simply because some customers are too stupid to try to figure it out for themselves, or some operators too lazy to listen to see what happens at the end of the message (or whatever else..these are only examples) doesn't validate the phone company in trying to prevent me from leaving whatever message I choose, as long as I don't pass myself off as being their agent. As noted above, there are so many other examples of instances where the Telco's time is "wasted", that singling out answering machines and allowing the telco to control the content of my OGM defies logic. If they can't tell me to stop using my phone/keeping the line busy, why should they be able to tell me that they don't like my message and I have to remove it? Both circumstances may cause the Telco a lot of trouble, yet simply ecuase it is the EASIEST thing for the telco to do doesn't mean it is the right thing, and pesonally, I don't like the idea of the Telco being able to censor or control the content of my messages when it only tangentally may affect them. Thus, I would say that since the message "<ALERT TONES> The number you have reached XXX-XXXX is not in service." is not specific to the Bells (Bell Canada uses it, as well as other telcos around the world, BT for example...), one could have such a message on their line and not violate any specific tariffs. As long as the Alert Tones and the message were not copies of a Bell recording (ie, you made them up yourself or something) I can't see how Bell could get you on the tariffs issue ... they may be able to on "impersonating the telco", but that's a different story...! :-) Doug dreuben@eagle.wesleyan.edu dreuben@wesleyan.bitnet [Moderator's Note: Here is an example of how someone can send an 8000 + byte message to rationalize the use of a misleading OGM for the purpose of doing what they are apparently unable to do in person: Say NO to a telemarketer and replace the reciever graciously. Even if your peculiar traffic patterns as described above were in fact real -- and I doubt *anyone* could have such bizzare requirements as you note in your message -- there would still be no legitimate reason to add the identification code on the end. PAT]
watcher@ndmath.math.nd.edu (watcher) (09/21/90)
I had a friend that used MacRecorder and SoundEdit to digitize several of PcaBell's "the number you have called..." recordings and then patch them together into an OGM that, while resembling the telco's recordings, could not possibly have been same; this was done with reverb and echo effects. Unfortunately, when most people hear the tri-tones, they fear the worst and hang up; hence the next revision of this message was preceded by him saying "WAIT! don't hang up...", then the tri-tones, etc. thus it is obviously NOT the telco's message, even though it is made up of the same component parts. Could this really be considered copyright infringement, much the same way copying records or CD's or photocopying copyright protected books at the library is considered infringement (as per the statement in most books about unauthorized reproduction, etc) ? I was thinking (as I sometimes do) that a neato-keen OGM would be the tri-tones, followed by "the person you have reached <name> is currently out of service. Please hang up and try again later, or leave a message for their convenience." This way people's OGMs would follow the same general format, making the interface "standard". Perhaps this is silly. My message? Right now it's "we're sorry, we have lost the picture portion of our picture-mission, however we will continue with the sound..." I'm sure somebody out there in netland will be able to guess where I got that little snippet of audio ... (there isn't a newsgroup for that stuff, is there?) James Watcher (yes, that's what it says on my driver's license) nstar!watcher@ndmath.math.nd.edu (fast) PO Box 875 Notre Dame, IN 46556 (slow)
peter@ficc.ferranti.com (Peter da Silva) (09/22/90)
In article <12141@accuvax.nwu.edu> tad@ssc.UUCP (Tad Cook) writes: > Reading it doesn't do it justice. You have to hear it. Maybe someday > I can arrange to put it on for a weekend, just so Digest readers can > call and hear it! Digitize it and send it in to Pat. I'm sure he'd LOVE to ship binaries with TELECOM Digest. Actually, now that I think of it, an FTP site for answering-machine messages might not be a bad idea. They're certainly more *useful* than the dirty pictures group. Peter da Silva. +1 713 274 5180. peter@ferranti.com
Donald E. Kimberlin <0004133373@mcimail.com> (09/24/90)
The story so far (in Digest v10, Iss648>: >mpd@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) writes: >>...l record the "<beep> The number you have >reached ... <number> >>has been disconnected..." which I save for later use. Then, when >>the time comes ... I leave >the "special" OGM tape in. David responded: >My housemate did this once, and the confusion it caused among >callers, and their queries to the phone company, ultimately caused NJ >Bell to call him and tell him, "Hey, just cut it out, OK." Gee, I'm surprised some minion of NJ Bell didn't swoop down with intimidation that threatened disconnecting the phone for real, because you were "violating the LAW" by transmitting a false message! (They really would be right, you know.) Anyhow, must have been one of the "new heads" in the business. Refreshing in that regard. Maybe we are making some progress toward humanized relations in the public telecommunications sector.