[comp.sys.dec] More RSX questions

news@udenva.cair.du.edu (netnews) (02/11/88)

Well, I have received an encouraging response to my inquiry into whether
there is sufficient interest in PDPs to have a special newsgroup. In addition
some DEC people are asking for this as evidence to their management to prove
that DEC needs to get agressive again in the PDP market. Therefore I am asking
that anyone who wishes to see a PDP newsgroup send me email stating that fact.

While you are thinking about that, on the 24th Feb. we are having a meeting with
some of DEC's upper management in both the PDP and realtime areas (for example 
the manager of all PDP software development). We want to ask sharp questions,
raise serious issues and give praise where praise is due. Therefore please
consider sending me your thoughts on the following questions and anything else
that you would like to see asked.

	1> Would a PDP Ada be of interest? Of what type - a run-time only
Micropower Pascal type system, a layered product, a straight cross-compiler?

	2> Would you like to see development tools for VAXELN ported to the
Ultrix environment?

	3> Should DEC resume its multiprocessor PDP project? We where told that 
the J-11 chip has 4 (?) pins that where implemented purposely for 
multiprocessing and that it would be relatively easy to put several J-11s on
one board. RSX already has multiprocessing hooks built in (for M-Plus at least).
Imagine a parallel F77 on the PDP!!!!!

	4> DEC informed us that the KXJ-11 coprocessor board will be released
in 4-6 months. This board will contain a J-11, 512 kb local memory, 128 kb
shared memory, 2 serial ports configurable as asyn. or sync., one 20 bit
parallel port and 3 counter-timers. The board has no bus master capability.
What else do you the user want? We suggested a 4 channel 12-bit A/D. Remember
that the I/O devices on the KXJ are local, involving no bus traffic and that
the KXJ will need to go through the host CPU, either a MVII or a bus master PDP,
to use off-board devices. How about 1 Mb as an option? What about software 
support? Currently RT-11 and RSX will be supported. Do we want any extensions,
drivers, etc. to allow near multiprocessor operation? A CSR and interrupt lines
to get the host's attension?

	5> Is there interest in making a KXJ-11 clone that is a bus master? 
The board would be something like this:
			J-11 CPU with optional FPU
			2 serial ports
			1 parallel port
			512 kb, 1Mb, 2 Mb memory options
			4 channel 12-bit A/D
			2 channel 12-bit D/A
This would be a full stand-alone SBC.

	This a chance to funnel user wants back to Maynard, so please send
me email with your thoughts. I will try to post a summation of DEC's responses
but remember that some of the items may be covered by non-disclosure agreements.

The PDP is alive and well, so let's keeping pushing DEC in the right direction!
Remember that I need your responses no later then 23 Feb. AM to use them.

			rneitzel@udenva

			Richard Neitzel
			Rockwell International
			Computer Aided Manufacturing and Control
			Box 464 M/S T881A
			Golden, CO 80402

			303-966-7203

beadel@oswego.UUCP (Edward F. Beadel Jr.) (02/12/88)

In article <9780@udenva.cair.du.edu> news@udenva.cair.du.edu (netnews) writes:
>Well, I have received an encouraging response to my inquiry into whether
>there is sufficient interest in PDPs to have a special newsgroup. In addition

good!

>some DEC people are asking for this as evidence to their management to prove
>that DEC needs to get agressive again in the PDP market. Therefore I am asking

Hummmm .... Which DEC people? If it's people in MSD, then their management
knows that there is interest. The DECUS PDP-11 Working Group has been
meeting with the top guns in MSD, *but* we (the PDP-11 Working Group)
NEED YOUR SUPPORT! Please keep following your oun leads, but I ask that
you also keep the members of the WG informed of the "good, the bad, and
the ugly". What we need is information, case histories, war stories, etc.
to make our case, and be listened to by MSD and the V.P.'s of DEC.
	Please include Ed Cetron (Chairman of the DECUS PDP-11 Working Group)
in your mailings. His Internet address is:
		cetron@cs.utah.edu
If you want to include me fine, I'll forward it to Ed. My address is a bit of
a mess right, and I'm only reachable by UUCP at:
		....!rutgers!sunybcs!oswego!beadel
NYSERNet says that we should be back on the Internet by Monday evening
15-FEB-88. When we are back on line my address will be:
		beadel@oswego.oswego.edu

>that anyone who wishes to see a PDP newsgroup send me email stating that fact.

	From my commentary above you can take that as a yes. I will be mailing
you my YES vote. For other readers, look at the proceedures for forming
a new newsgroup in news.admin (I think). Basically, someone has to anounce
the desire to form a news group. (There {is | are} special newsgroup{s}
that one should use plus it dosn't hurt to use existing groups that are
closely related to the proposed group). The person *POSTING* the notice
has to collect the mail vote for one month, tabulate it, and forward
the results to the netnews "keepers-of-the-order" at one of the backbone
sites. (Names and addresses listed in the article in news.admin). 
	It takes 100 more "yes" votes than "no" votes to form a "main"
group (eg. comp.sys.dec.pdp). However a "secondary" newsgroup can be
formed with fewer numbers (eg. alt.sys.dec.pdp).

	SO MAIL IN YOUR BALLOT!

>	1> Would a PDP Ada be of interest? Of what type - a run-time only
>Micropower Pascal type system, a layered product, a straight cross-compiler?
>
	You *must* have government contracts! (sorry I couldn't resist)

>	2> Would you like to see development tools for VAXELN ported to the
>Ultrix environment?
>
	
How does this relate to the PDP-11? There are to be no more releases (or
sales) of ULTRIX-11. 

>	3> Should DEC resume its multiprocessor PDP project? We where told that 

There are some people who would like to see it, but from what we've seen 
it's *very* unlikely for DEC to do it. There are some third parties
that have "PDP-11 clusters", "PDP-11 coupled processors", etc either
in production or in the planning (dreaming) stages.

>the J-11 chip has 4 (?) pins that where implemented purposely for 
>multiprocessing and that it would be relatively easy to put several J-11s on
>one board. RSX already has multiprocessing hooks built in (for M-Plus at least).
By who? Or does this come along with the story of a semi-conductor maker
who has redesigned the J-11 and has gotten a 40MHz clock on it. 
BTW. DEC denies this story.

>Imagine a parallel F77 on the PDP!!!!!
>
Would be interesting!

>	4> DEC informed us that the KXJ-11 coprocessor board will be released
>in 4-6 months. This board will contain a J-11, 512 kb local memory, 128 kb

Is this for "public consumption" or were you under a DEC "nondisclosure"
aggreement when you were so informed? If under the latter and you are
putting this on the net, you may well have spoiled your chances of getting
any other future plans out of DEC. 

>shared memory, 2 serial ports configurable as asyn. or sync., one 20 bit
>parallel port and 3 counter-timers. The board has no bus master capability.
>What else do you the user want? We suggested a 4 channel 12-bit A/D. Remember

If the board is as far along in it's production schedual as you suggest,
then it is highly unlikely that you will see anything else added to it.
Your input *may* influence the next (if there one, or even a first), but
of course what you hear "should not be construed as a commitment by
DIGITAL Equipment Corporation" for anything. {:-)

>	This a chance to funnel user wants back to Maynard, so please send
>me email with your thoughts. I will try to post a summation of DEC's responses
>but remember that some of the items may be covered by non-disclosure agreements.
>
>The PDP is alive and well, so let's keeping pushing DEC in the right direction!
>Remember that I need your responses no later then 23 Feb. AM to use them.
>
	AND REMEMBER THAT THE DECUS PDP-11 WORKING GROUP NEEDS YOUR THOUGHTS
AS WELL. So please keep the old cards and letters comming.

-ed

-- 
Edward F. Beadel, Jr., Assoc. Dir.	...rutgers!sunybcs!oswego!beadel
Instructional Computing Center               SOON TO BE (AGAIN???)
SUNY College at Oswego                 beadel@oswego.oswego.edu
Oswego, NY  13126 (315)-341-3055