fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (RICE DON D) (08/04/90)
I've seen many references to DEC shipping delays recently here and in the press, mostly concerning DAT drives and newer VAX configurations. I haven't seen mention of delays in the DECstation line, other than the problems getting Ultrix 4.0 out. But now suddenly our salesguys are saying there is a terrible shortage of DS5000's and delivery dates are anybody's guess. I'm getting increasingly disimpressed by DEC's performance...am I just seeing them at a bad point in their history or what? Here's the deal: 1. Early May: put in PO for DS5000's. Purchasing sent out request for quotes. DEC failed to get their quote in on time even though they had a couple of weeks to respond and had already drawn up the quote. It is now early June. 2. Early July: after repeating the request for quotes, DEC wins and PO is sent to them. Their quote says 30 day lead time, and PO calls for early August delivery. We are behind schedule due to (1) but things seem to be under control finally. 3. Early August: no hardware. Call to DEC gets a revised ship date in late August, with warning that it could slip further. Reason given is "heavy demand." A 3rd party supplier says the real reason is that DEC hasn't ramped up production of the DS5000 yet. Now perhaps this is a little simplistic, but it seems to me that if DEC had not screwed up the original quotation request and had delivered per its quotation that we would have had hardware by early July, and that their current (shakey) ship date puts them at least 60 days behind schedule. It certainly puts us way behind schedule and could make it necessary for us to change brands. We can get more work done on a slower machine that is on the desk than on a faster machine that is still at the factory. So, are people seeing big delays in their orders for the DS5000? I'd really like to know if this is a genuine production problem or yet another kink in our distribution pipeline. (Perhaps I should have guessed that "Digital has it now" implies that the customers DON'T have it now...) Please e-mail responses, no point clogging up the net with this topic if it turns out to be a local problem. Disgruntledly yours, :^P >^( Don Rice Internet: fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu Geophysical Institute E-mail: fnddr@alaska.bitnet University of Alaska Phone: (907) 474-7569 Fairbanks, AK 99775 Loran: 64.86N 212.16E
fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (Rice Don D) (08/07/90)
In article <1990Aug4.013555.11650@hayes.fai.alaska.edu>, fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (RICE DON D) writes... >So, are people seeing big delays in their orders for the DS5000? I'd really >like to know if this is a genuine production problem or yet another kink in >our distribution pipeline. (Perhaps I should have guessed that "Digital has >it now" implies that the customers DON'T have it now...) Judging by the number and distribution of responses, this is a genuine problem, with a lot of overdue systems being promised for September. The delays appear to have hit people ordering after May, with later orders getting the longest shipping delays. Other comments: ..delays also experienced in hard disks and DS3100 orders this summer. ..some who received DS5000's felt the number of DOA or terminally ill units was unusually high, and thought replacements may have eaten into the production. ..notes from DEC and resellers indicate that demand was substantially higher than expected, but that the September timeframe for catching up is credible. ..several people noted that other new systems announced this spring and summer by other vendors were experiencing delays comparable to or longer than what we are seeing on the DS5000. Thanks to all who replied, I guess misery does love company. Don Rice Internet: fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu Geophysical Institute E-mail: fnddr@alaska.bitnet University of Alaska Phone: (907) 474-7569 Fairbanks, AK 99775 Loran: 64.86N 212.16E
dhc@lanl.gov (Dave Carter) (08/07/90)
In article <1990Aug4.013555.11650@hayes.fai.alaska.edu>, fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (RICE DON D) writes: > I've seen many references to DEC shipping delays recently here and in the > press, mostly concerning DAT drives and newer VAX configurations. I haven't > seen mention of delays in the DECstation line, other than the problems getting > Ultrix 4.0 out. But now suddenly our salesguys are saying there is a terrible > shortage of DS5000's and delivery dates are anybody's guess. I'm getting > increasingly disimpressed by DEC's performance...am I just seeing them at > a bad point in their history or what? Here's the deal: boy, you've hit a sore spot. we placed an order for *one* 5000 late may or early june. (i think the order finally got placed on june 5th.) our sales rep told us then that we'd get it in no more than 4 weeks. well, he came back later with a different story: a ship date in mid-september!! we had a major program which we could have lost without a 5000, so i said this was unacceptable. our sales rep finally came up with a "loaner" 3100 until september. this is proving inadequate for the jobs that we have to run, however. > 3. Early August: no hardware. Call to DEC gets a revised ship date in late > August, with warning that it could slip further. Reason given is "heavy > demand." A 3rd party supplier says the real reason is that DEC hasn't > ramped up production of the DS5000 yet. late august?!! how did you get this good of a ship date?! they're still telling us mid-to-late september. > Now perhaps this is a little simplistic, but it seems to me that if DEC had > not screwed up the original quotation request and had delivered per its > quotation that we would have had hardware by early July, and that their > current (shakey) ship date puts them at least 60 days behind schedule. It > certainly puts us way behind schedule and could make it necessary for us > to change brands. We can get more work done on a slower machine that is > on the desk than on a faster machine that is still at the factory. yes, people here are pretty pissed at the whole thing, and are considering a massive changeover to (heaven forbid) suns, only because they are available. - dave dhc@lanl.gov
GEOMAGIC@kcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu (Daniel OConnell) (08/07/90)
>I've seen many references to DEC shipping delays recently here and in the >press, mostly concerning DAT drives and newer VAX configurations. I haven't >seen mention of delays in the DECstation line, other than the problems getting >Ultrix 4.0 out. But now suddenly our salesguys are saying there is a terrible >shortage of DS5000's and delivery dates are anybody's guess. I'm getting >increasingly disimpressed by DEC's performance...am I just seeing them at >a bad point in their history or what? Here's the deal: >1. Early May: put in PO for DS5000's. Purchasing sent out request for quotes. > DEC failed to get their quote in on time even though they had a couple of > weeks to respond and had already drawn up the quote. It is now early June. We placed our order in December, 1989 by specing a 3100 and a bunch of TK50's to approx. equal the estimated purchase price of a DS5000 with 24 bit graphics. THEY HAVE A PURCHASE ORDER IN DEC. 1989!!!!!!! >2. Early July: after repeating the request for quotes, DEC wins and PO is > sent to them. Their quote says 30 day lead time, and PO calls for early > August delivery. We are behind schedule due to (1) but things seem to be > under control finally. We meet with the sales idiot, a week after the official DS5000 anouncement to initiate the change order to the DS5000 from the DS3100. Late June, we get a DS3100 and 4 TK50's #&$&$%&^$&^. They want to get credit for shipping something in 1989, so they ship the old order. >3. Early August: no hardware. Call to DEC gets a revised ship date in late > August, with warning that it could slip further. Reason given is "heavy > demand." A 3rd party supplier says the real reason is that DEC hasn't > ramped up production of the DS5000 yet. We are now told we won't see it until "late Sept.". >So, are people seeing big delays in their orders for the DS5000? YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Oh, yea dbx doesn't work with fortran, reported in April. Response to date: "yea, we know." Our 5400 has blown 2 power supplies. They suggest our power is unreliable and propose to install a monitor. Nothing happens. No response, i.e. action w.r.t. any of our Ultrix bug reports, NONE. BTW, we are doing a port for DEC, I shudder to think how the average sucker is treated. Daniel R.H. O'Connell Department of Geology and Mineralogy An Ohio State University Columbus, Ohio 45213 geomagic@geo1s.mps.ohio-state.edu (Riscy, dead at the moment) geomagic@kcgl1.eng.ohio-state.edu (a VAX, funny it actually works!?). P.S. DEC probably didn't tell you that you had to purchase a VAX to debug code on the RISC machines, did they?
MELTSNE@gecrdvm1.crd.ge.com (08/07/90)
Our new DECStation came in, after being ordered in late May. The DEC salesman
had to "escalate" the order to get this sort of response after slipping from a
mid-July delivery date.
He told me the longest delays are for machines with the new 1 GB drives which
appear to be in short supply.
Kenmathisen@dali.cs.montana.edu (Jaye Mathisen) (08/07/90)
In article <90219.083603MELTSNE@GECRDVM1.BITNET> MELTSNE@gecrdvm1.crd.ge.com writes: >Our new DECStation came in, after being ordered in late May. The DEC salesman >had to "escalate" the order to get this sort of response after slipping from a >mid-July delivery date. Same here, we ordered 5000's, 2100's, etc end of May, and everything showed up on July 10th or 11th.
bb@wjh12.harvard.edu (Brent Byer) (08/07/90)
In article <59277@lanl.gov> dhc@lanl.gov (Dave Carter) writes: > >boy, you've hit a sore spot. we placed an order for *one* 5000 late >may or early june. (i think the order finally got placed on june >5th.) our sales rep told us then that we'd get it in no more than 4 >weeks. Gee, that would be right around the end of June, which would be the end of the 'quarter' (quarter-annual financial report). >well, he came back later with a different story: a ship date >in mid-september!! Aha, that is near the end of the next 'quarter'. And, remember, as far as the financial bozos are concerned, "shipping" means it is on the loading dock. You ought to see how many (empty?) crates are crowding the loading docks at the ends of financial periods. [ And, speaking of Bozos, "He's just jiving you, man." ] >yes, people here are pretty pissed at the whole thing, and are >considering a massive changeover to (heaven forbid) suns ... If one of your organization's "suits" had made this crystal clear to the vendor, *at the time you placed your order* (even writing it on the order), then your order would have been the bumpER instead of the bumpEE. Standing on yellow rubber line, Brent Byer ( DEC PDP-10 Marketing, 1968 )
hascall@cs.iastate.edu (John Hascall) (08/11/90)
In article <90219.083603MELTSNE@GECRDVM1.BITNET> MELTSNE@gecrdvm1.crd.ge.com writes: }Our new DECStation came in, after being ordered in late May. The DEC salesman }had to "escalate" the order to get this sort of response after slipping from a }mid-July delivery date. }He told me the longest delays are for machines with the new 1 GB drives which }appear to be in short supply. Hmmm,... we got ~60 of those drives (I guess it helps to spend $4M ;-)
thompson@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu (Steve Thompson) (09/05/90)
In article <1990Aug4.013555.11650@hayes.fai.alaska.edu> fnddr@acad3.fai.alaska.edu writes: >So, are people seeing big delays in their orders for the DS5000? I'd really >like to know if this is a genuine production problem or yet another kink in >our distribution pipeline. (Perhaps I should have guessed that "Digital has >it now" implies that the customers DON'T have it now...) We ordered six DS5000's in early June. The time between DEC getting the order and the machines arriving was almost exactly 4 weeks. A futher DS5000 that was ordered a week later also arrived in 4 weeks. Steve