[comp.sys.dec] Sendmail 5.64 IDA 1.3.4 / DEC mail11v3 problem

Andy.Linton@comp.vuw.ac.nz (Andy Linton) (09/13/90)

I need to be able to use Sendmail 5.64 IDA to talk to DEC's mail11v3
mailer on an Ultrix box which has DECnet-Ultrix installed.

I've got the sendmail built but when I try to invoke mail11v3 it just
hangs as though it was waiting for something else on stdin e.g. 

#  /usr/lib/sendmail -ba -t -v
From: asjl@golem.wcc.govt.nz
To: brockie@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz
Subject: test

hello
.
050 brockie@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz... Connecting to kosmos (DECNET)...
050 220 Mail-11_V3.0 DECnet-ULTRIX Mail-11 Mailer
050 >>> HELO golem.wcc.govt.nz
050 250 Mail-11_V3.0 DECnet-ULTRIX Mail-11 Mailer
050 >>> MAIL From:<golem::asjl>
451 brockie@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz... timeout waiting for input
050 brockie@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz... Deferred


I note that the DECnet-Ultrix Release Notes say:

You can use the new mail11v3 mailer only with the supported sendmail
that comes with ULTRIX-32 V3.0a due to modifications that were necessary
for the mailer to be compatible with the DECnet MAIL-11 protocol.

I interpret this to mean that that they changed the internals of
sendmail so that it behaves differently when talking to this particular
mailer. This sounds like VERY BAD practice to me - the task of
converting to the DECnet MAIL-11 protocol is one that should be
undertaken by the mail11v3 program.

What I need is either a replacement for mail11v3 which behaves correctly
or as a very poor second choice details of what I need to do sendmail.

DEC: please don't do this sort of thing to us - it really sucks!

 

jenst@dxcsjr.cern.ch (Jens Trier Rasmussen) (09/13/90)

DEC has implemented an extended version of SMTP, which includes two
new commands MULT and HEAD. MULT gives multiple statuses for
recipients and HEAD lets mail11v3 have a peak on the message headers.
This is necessary because of the way MAIL-11 handle Cc.

If you want to use another mail11 program try the one on
gatekeeper.dec.com, which is the one DECWRL uses as the gateway
between Internet and DEC's Easynet. I can't remeber the path, but
look for something like wrl-mail11.

regards
	Jens Trier Rasmussen
	CERN-CN/CS
	jenst@cernvax.cern.ch

mcneill@eplrx7.uucp (Keith McNeill) (09/14/90)

From article <1990Sep13.021422.22907@comp.vuw.ac.nz>, by Andy.Linton@comp.vuw.ac.nz (Andy Linton):
> 
> I need to be able to use Sendmail 5.64 IDA to talk to DEC's mail11v3
> mailer on an Ultrix box which has DECnet-Ultrix installed.
> 
...
> 
> What I need is either a replacement for mail11v3 which behaves correctly
> or as a very poor second choice details of what I need to do sendmail.
> 
> DEC: please don't do this sort of thing to us - it really sucks!
> 
>  

Try mail11 from Keith Moore at the U of Tenn.  We've been very happy with it
here in our little corner of Du Pont.  You can ftp it from cs.utk.edu in the
directory readonly/mail11.

Keith



-- 
    Keith D. McNeill              |    E.I. du Pont de Nemours & Co.
    eplrx7!mcneill@uunet.uu.net   |    Engineering Physics Laboratory
    (302) 695-9353/7395           |    P.O. Box 80357
                                  |    Wilmington, Delaware 19880-0357
--
The UUCP Mailer

moore@betelgeuse.cs.utk.edu (Keith Moore) (09/15/90)

In article <1990Sep13.021422.22907@comp.vuw.ac.nz> Andy.Linton@comp.vuw.ac.nz writes:

>I need to be able to use Sendmail 5.64 IDA to talk to DEC's mail11v3
>mailer on an Ultrix box which has DECnet-Ultrix installed.

Sorry.  You can't do it without modifying sendmail to speak DEC's 
undocumented extensions to SMTP.  Mail-11 sends the message header 
before the recipient list, but SMTP does things in the opposite order.
Furthermore, most remote mail-11 objects do not mail back error messages
in the case of failed delivery; instead, the messages are delivered 
immediately and delivery status is reported back to the sender before
the end of the conversation.  Vanilla SMTP has no provision for this.

I had to address the same problem when writing my mail-11 gateway, but
I decided that modifying SMTP was a bad idea.  For now, recipients are
passed on the command line, and you get best results if you omit the
'm' flag (send to multiple recipients at once) in the mailer description.
I have improvements for this problem in the works, so you can have the
efficiency win of sending a message to multiple recipients in one
transaction, but avoid the problems that occur if delivery for some of 
them fails.

You can get the current version by anonymous ftp to cs.utk.edu (128.169.201.1),
directory readonly/mail11, files mail11.tar and mail11d.tar.  I'll mail out 
shar files on request for those that don't have ftp access.

Keith Moore			Internet: moore@cs.utk.edu
University of Tenn. CS Dept.	BITNET: moore@utkvx
107 Ayres Hall, UT Campus	Telephone: +1 615 974 0822
Knoxville Tennessee 37996-1301	``Friends don't let friends use YP (or NIS)''
Keith Moore			Internet: moore@cs.utk.edu
University of Tenn. CS Dept.	BITNET: moore@utkvx
107 Ayres Hall, UT Campus	Telephone: +1 615 974 0822
Knoxville Tennessee 37996-1301	``Friends don't let friends use YP (or NIS)''