dce@smsc.sony.com (David Elliott) (02/24/90)
In article <2450@se-sd.NCR.COM> lowery@se-sd.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Tim Lowery) writes: >I wanted to add that another thing that bugs me about many musical instrument >dealers is that they refuse to give you a straight answer on the price they >will sell merchandise. You ask them for a price, and all they'll give you >is list. They insist on playing games with you, trying to see how much >they can get out of you (shades of used car salesmen). As I see it, you have two choices: mail order and playing hardball with the dealer. Mail order will generally get you the lowest price with the least hassle, and if you buy from out of state, there's no sales tax. The problems come when you need assistance, but most of the mail order places are pretty good about this, as they want your repeat business and don't want a bad rep. Playing hardball with a dealer requires some research and practice. First, you have to find out what a "reasonable" price is. Call up mail order places or ask on the net and find out what the going price for the item is. When the salesman asks how much you want to pay, use this as your starting point. Allow for a profit, but if the salesman comes back and wants a lot more, be prepared to walk. If the salesman asks "Are you going to let 50 dollars keep you from buying this item?", be prepared to say "yes". Of course, this is much easier to do in a populated area with lots of music stores. There are at least 8 music stores in the South Bay Area, so getting deals is often just a matter of driving to the other stores. -- David Elliott dce@smsc.sony.com | ...!{uunet,mips}!sonyusa!dce (408)944-4073 "...it becomes natural, like a third sense." -- Homer Simpson
lowery@se-sd.NCR.COM (Tim Lowery) (02/27/90)
I've heard from several sources that the typical dealer cost on "big ticket" items (like keyboards, amps, mixers, etc.) is 60% of list price. I thought this might be good ammunition to have for price comparison when you go into a music store to buy one of these items. Good luck Tim lowery@se-sd.SanDiego.NCR.COM
djh@dragon.metaphor.com (Dallas J. Hodgson) (02/27/90)
In my experience, there are only two types of music stores: 1) The small-town, "local" music store, that's been in the area for years, sells/repairs band instruments, & carries a lot of older/less desirable no-name equipment at name-brand prices 2) The big-city "zoo" music store, which carries the latest-model equipment, advertises heavily, has a sale every month, and is crammed with teenage guitar hopefuls & commission-hungry salespeople. Music stores in the first category aren't very exciting unless you want a relaxed purchasing atmosphere and are looking to establish a relationship with the proprietor. Music stores in the second category have such a high turn-around of salespeople that you're not likely to see the guy who sold you your instrument the next time you walk into the store. These guys keep their ear to the street and can be quite knowledgeable, but by and large they bias their information to steer you in the direction of the purchase they'd like you to buy. If they can play on your emotions, they will; and it's really not any different from car shopping. I don't get enjoyment out of haggling at all; unless you've done your homework, it's very difficult to decide whether this "good deal" is really good or not. The mail-order stores are an excellent starting point, my favorite being a company called Musician's Friend. It's really unfortunate that musical equipment is sold in such a competitive commision-sales environment, but that's the way it is. Here's a few tips I've found, and I welcome those from others... 1) List prices mean nothing. Really. As a rule of thumb, expect at least 30% off list, although your ability to bargain depends as much on the perceived "hotness" of a product as does your skill in bargaining. 2) Salesman's quotes regarding competitors mean little. Expect to hear stuff like : "You don't want to buy that, company XYZ filing Chapter 11 this week" ... Or, "This item is really the same as that item - the engineers from company ABC split off and formed their own company and created item x" 3) Don't expect music salespeople to get panicky when you walk out the door, and don't expect them to quote prices over the phone. They won't - unless it's an advertised special or a mail-order firm. 4) If negotiations are going nowhere, see if you can arrive at a deal by having the sales guy toss in "something extra" - for free or at least cheap. 5) Expect salespeople to have to "get the deal approved" by the manager regardless of what you've negotiated thus far. If the manager takes your offer without making a counter-offer, you probably bid too high! Lastly, you HAVE A RIGHT to be treated fairly and not pushed around. Salespeople are not doing you any favors by selling you their merchandise, so take this attitude to heart. If you have any problems, ALWAYS deal with the manager him/herself; it doesn't pay to get worked up over people who don't have the authority to commit to anything. -djh
jack@tsnews.Convergent.COM (Jack Van Breen) (02/28/90)
lowery@se-sd.NCR.COM (Tim Lowery) writes: >I've heard from several sources that the typical dealer cost on "big ticket" >items (like keyboards, amps, mixers, etc.) is 60% of list price. I thought >this might be good ammunition to have for price comparison when you go into >a music store to buy one of these items. >Good luck >Tim >lowery@se-sd.SanDiego.NCR.COM Having spent 10+ years in the music retail business, I can say that the above is ABSOLUTLEY FALSE!!!! Here is how it generally falls out: Guitars and Amps: ~50% of list Keyboards: ~40% of list Pro-Sound & Recording: ~30-33% of list Accessories: Anywhere from 30 to 60% of list Strings: from 50 to 90% of list depending on volume Now, some of the low-end PA gear is priced like guitars and amps, and rackmount effects can either go as Accesories or Pro-Sound, so it's kindof hard to tell just what is going on. Also, you have to remember to leave the store a reason to be in business, ie they are there to make a profit, not to supply you with the latest & greatest toy;-). Also they do need to make enough money to cover any problems that you may have. When the fix a DOA box for you, or give you a loaner to use in the meantime, that expense comes immediately out of their pocket, and maybe some where down the line, they will get it back. But, if they don't meet their basic overhead they won't be there the next time you need that extra bit of service. Another thing to realise, is that time is money to these guys. Another poster's aritcle was right on the money (except for the concept that every thing can be had for 30% off;-) in terms of how to get the deals. Be a human to the sales person, and he/she will probably be human back. On the standard items where the margin is 50%, at 30% discount is now big deal to the stores that are doing any volume at all. At that point, the store makes enough to cover their overhead, any serivce you may require, and continued growth, so you can continue to go try out the new latest&greatest. Obviously, the shorter markup items will allow less of a discount. So don't waste your's and the Salespersons time trying to get a 40% discount on something that the stor only got 30% on. (enough of this rambling, see the other posters comment, he obviously knows how toget honest deals. I would have loved to have him as a customer.) Later on. -- ------------------ Jack Van Breen, wk: 408/435-5361, jack@CONVERGENT.COMM