larry@nstar.UUCP (Larry Snyder) (12/05/89)
The Saga of my dealings with ISC continues.. The beginning - My introduction to multitasking/multiuser operating systems was using on OS called QNX last year. QNX worked but lacked applications and the file system was rather slow. QNX also suffered from a poor compiler which was pure K&R. I was running a multiline (all high speed modems) Fidonet mail hub feeding the midwestern US mail - with bundles averaging around 1.3 megs a day and producing transfers of around 1650 cps on the lines with the new HST modems - and 1450 cps on the PEP+ lines (all modems were using hardware flow control and locked at 19,200). I wanted to run a news site - and wanted an OS to make my machine shine (25mhz '386). After looking through Unix Today!, Unix Review and Unix World - I decided on ISC - primarily due to the speed of the file system. At the time (6 months ago) SCO wasn't producing their Unix product and I wasn't interested in Xenix - since it wasn't Unix - so my first introduction to ?NIX was with ISC. ISC arrived in a rather large box - and contained LOTS of manuals and disks. I followed the installation procedure and everything was going well so far. After I got news up and running - I started running into problems with high speed serial IO (this was before the X5 kernel configuration upgrade modification was released) - more specifically - bi-directional communications. I was disappointed. I received some feedback from other users experiencing the same problem and ISC support in Hollis didn't have an answer for me. <negative comments removed - since everyone has seen them in previous messages, and it is quite possible that some of the mistakes were due to the fact that I had expected manuals of the same quality of many of the DOS products which contained answers to my questions, and some of my problems could have been due to my lack of experience with the ?NIX operating system> ISC wasn't working for me - so I called an ordered SCO Xenix 2.3.2. I installed Xenix - and everything overall ran quite well. I never needed to call SCO for technical support - since the manuals were well written and combined with the information here on usenet - all of my questions were answered. My Xenix news machine is running too well - and I am bored and miss the fast Unix file system (I also heard about how neat rn is as a news reader - and want to run rfmail which is a fidonet compatible package written for Unix system V). The Xenix machine runs so well, that if I died the machine would keep running as long as the bills were paid. I went on vacation and the machine rebooted, checked the file systems and was back on-line within a short period of time re-distributing news. This is December - and I have been reading about others who have positive experiences with ISC 2.02 and the X5 mod. I also have heard from others for whom the X5 modification didn't do any good. I guess I'm willing to be brave - and am considering doing a complete backup of my machine - and re-installing ISC 2.02 with the X5 mod (and my Hostess drivers). I also am interested in X-Windows now that I have an enhanced VGA graphics sub- system. I talked with Brian at ISC and he has ageed to help me get ISC back up and running. What more could I ask? Maybe I was un-fair to ISC in my previous messages - or maybe I wasn't? Hopefully the Hostess drivers and/or X5 mod will work for for this site nstar.. Comments, suggestions, and/or flames to larry@nstar -- Larry Snyder uucp:iuvax!ndcheg!ndmath!nstar!larry
davidsen@sungod.crd.ge.com (William Davidsen) (12/05/89)
In article <111059@nstar.UUCP> larry@nstar.UUCP (Larry Snyder) writes: | ISC wasn't working for me - so I called an ordered SCO Xenix 2.3.2. I | installed Xenix - and everything overall ran quite well. I never needed | to call SCO for technical support - since the manuals were well written | and combined with the information here on usenet - all of my questions | were answered. My Xenix news machine is running too well - and I am bored | and miss the fast Unix file system (I also heard about how neat rn is as a | news reader - and want to run rfmail which is a fidonet compatible package | written for Unix system V). The Xenix machine runs so well, that if I died | the machine would keep running as long as the bills were paid. I went on | vacation and the machine rebooted, checked the file systems and was back | on-line within a short period of time re-distributing news. Your experience is much the same as mine. When I was ready to go to a 386 UNIX I got evaluation copies of Xenix, ISC, and Microport. I chose Xenix because it was the most reliable. 2.3.3 is even more of the same, it just runs and runs. I suppose that I will have to go to straight SysV someday, and I suspect that it will be SCO again. They, too, have a fast filesystem (if you turn off the security stuff), and someday that security might be nice. The SCO development set has the MSC compiler for 286, 286, DOS, and OS/2, as well as pcc for those things which want it. ISC X seems to be the best available *today*. Don't quote me in a month, it may not be true. If you can go ISC upgrade cheaply it may be the thing to do. If you plan to run a lot of X you should us etheir X, which I have been told will run under SCO UNIX as well (haven't tried myself). I'm sure that ISC has reliability up now, I talk to a lot of happy users. Hope you report on what you do. BTW: rn runs fine under Xenix, but if you have the latest (5.10.010 beta) compiler you will have to hack it or use the older 2.2 compiler and headers. bill davidsen (davidsen@crdos1.crd.GE.COM) {uunet | philabs}!crdgw1!crdos1!davidsen "Stupidity, like virtue, is its own reward" -me
paine@fungus.dec.com (Willy Paine) (12/05/89)
In article <111059@nstar.UUCP> you write: > >The Saga of my dealings with ISC continues.. > >I wanted to run a news site - and wanted an OS to make my machine shine >(25mhz '386). After looking through Unix Today!, Unix Review and Unix >World - I decided on ISC - primarily due to the speed of the file system. >At the time (6 months ago) SCO wasn't producing their Unix product and I >wasn't interested in Xenix - since it wasn't Unix - so my first introduction >to ?NIX was with ISC. > > >ISC wasn't working for me - so I called an ordered SCO Xenix 2.3.2. I >installed Xenix - and everything overall ran quite well. I never needed >and miss the fast Unix file system (I also heard about how neat rn is as a >news reader - and want to run rfmail which is a fidonet compatible package >written for Unix system V). The Xenix machine runs so well, that if I died >the machine would keep running as long as the bills were paid. I went on >vacation and the machine rebooted, checked the file systems and was back >on-line within a short period of time re-distributing news. > >This is December - and I have been reading about others who have positive >experiences with ISC 2.02 and the X5 mod. I also have heard from others >for whom the X5 modification didn't do any good. I guess I'm willing to >am interested in X-Windows now that I have an enhanced VGA graphics sub- >system. I talked with Brian at ISC and he has ageed to help me get ISC >back up and running. What more could I ask? Maybe I was un-fair to ISC >in my previous messages - or maybe I wasn't? Hopefully the Hostess drivers >and/or X5 mod will work for for this site nstar.. It is better to try not to switch system too much and this is really stressful. It is not only upgrading ICS -> Xenix -> SCO Unix at home but today I will install 11th Operating system from scratch this year at work (both Unix and VMS). I am software engineer on Unix Development and this is very stressful. I find it is much more pleasant try not to switch system at home because I want to spend more time on reading and sending messages to friends as well as working with new softwares like Pcomm or Elm etc. Recently I am on SCO Developer's program so I am getting pre-release Xsight (X-windows ) this week. I have good experience with X-windows (using DECwindows) at work and this takes up alot of time to set up. I did install ICS with X5 Upgrade and this does not work with my current gettydefs so I have to change gettydefs. This does not work well on returning to login prompt after users disconnect without warning. So I switched to Xenix and SCO Unix. ICS and SCO are good products but I can not take both. I feel that SCO is better for uucp communication. SCO Unix has C1 security that causes some problem with chat programs. Rfmail is very well tested for BSD but not for System V yet and Randy Bush got this to work with Xenix but he did not continue using this long. I am still getting another release soon. Rfmail is not 100% working under ICS at all and this does not made connection very well. I just start testing rfamil again in SCO Unix right now after upgrading from Xenix. If you have several lines for Unix, I suggest to get one beatup MSDOS machine for FidoNet. I think it would take couple of years to polish rfmail. UFGATE package for MS-DOs was testing over three years before releasing to public. Rfmail and UFGATE authors work on sparetime in the evening!! Overall, I suggest to relax and have fun playing or tuning with system rather than switching over systems. My kids remind me again again - "Don't worry - Be happy" Willy - -- ................................................................ . Willy Paine BBS/FAX +1-206-822-4615 . . willyp@seaeast.WA.COM FidoNet 1:343/15 . . uunet!nwnexus!seaeast!willyp fungus.enet.dec.com!paine . ................................................................ . It takes less time to do a thing right than to explain . . why you did it wrong - Longfellow. . ................................................................
root@shiloh.UUCP (Admin) (12/05/89)
Larry, I would be willing to talk you through the task. Give a call. I will for the sake of never meeting you, and not knowing your background help in any way that might prove helpful to you.
kmoore@shiloh.UUCP (kirk moore) (12/05/89)
Sotty, forgot to get the signaure in there. The work number is (206) 644-2400 X 2242. Again I am willing to help as much as is possible. Please call.... -- Kirk Moore --- Bellevue, WA --- uunet!pilchuck!dataio!-------\ uw-beaver!uw-entropy!dataio!-----shiloh!kmoore shiloh --- Bellevue, WA --- (206) 562-1561(board) - (206) 747-5709(voice)
larry@nstar.UUCP (Larry Snyder) (12/10/89)
> Larry, I would be willing to talk you through the task. Give a call. I will for the sake of never meeting you, and not knowing your background help in any way that might prove helpful to you.
Thanks for the offer, but I only have a few little "leftovers" to work out -
like transports under the sendmail supplied with ISC 3.2 to handle mail
addressed to akcs.larry@nstar - and I still am having some strange problems
with the kernel needing to be relinked at powerdown - when it's been done on
on another shutdown. I am using the Hostess board for 8 ports and the normal com
port as the primary com port - which works (called unix.10 at boot time) but
after every powerdown my system wants to "re-link" the kernel then after
rebooting I loose control on all com ports.
larry@nstarrick@pcrat.uucp (Rick Richardson) (12/11/89)
In article <511068@nstar.UUCP> larry@nstar.UUCP (Larry Snyder) writes: >port as the primary com port - which works (called unix.10 at boot time) but >after every powerdown my system wants to "re-link" the kernel then after >rebooting I loose control on all com ports. This happens after you've built kernels the ISC way (kconfig) and the AT&T way (usually performed by an installable device driver). As you discovered later, you have to remove /etc/conf/cf.d/unix manually, or change the scripts. We ship our software the AT&T way, since it is the most portable, and I suspect that most vendors will do the same. The ISC way has advantages, though, and I wish that the vendors had come to a mutually agreeable merge, rather than trying to simultaneously support both (actually three, if you count SCO). There's another bug (AT&T created; not yet fixed in ISC) you can run into that may cause similar problems. Here is the info I sent to ISC about the bug. AT&T UNIX SVR3.2 also has this bug. If you make these changes to your scripts now, you won't get a surprise later. SUBSYSTEM: installpkg VERSION: 2.0.2 (possibly, likely, in earlier releases) DATE: 11/11/89 (Acked 11/19) SUMMARY: Can't install two installable packages which have rc and/or sd scripts. FILES: /etc/conf/bin/idmkenv DESCRIPTION: Starting at line 24, the code looks like this: if [ -f /etc/conf/rc.d/* ] then for rc in /etc/conf/rc.d/* do ln $rc /etc/idrc.d done fi if [ -f /etc/conf/sd.d/* ] then for sd in /etc/conf/sd.d/* do ln $sd /etc/idsd.d done fi Both "-f" tests will fail if more than one script exists in these directories. SEVERITY: Urgent. Third party install packages fail to install properly, or break previous installations. SUGGESTED FIX: if [ -d /etc/conf/rc.d ] then for rc in `find /etc/conf/rc.d -type f -print` do ln $rc /etc/idrc.d done fi if [ -d /etc/conf/sd.d ] then for sd in `find /etc/conf/sd.d -type f -print` do ln $sd /etc/idsd.d done fi -- Rick Richardson | Looking for FAX software for UNIX/386 ?????? mention PC Research,Inc.| WE'RE SHIPPING your uunet!pcrat!rick| Ask about FaxiX - UNIX Facsimile System (tm) FAX # (201) 389-8963 | Or JetRoff - troff postprocessor for the HP {Laser,Desk}Jet
davr@hrtix.UUCP (David C. Raines) (12/13/89)
In article <511068@nstar.UUCP> larry@nstar.UUCP (Larry Snyder) writes: >addressed to akcs.larry@nstar - and I still am having some strange problems >with the kernel needing to be relinked at powerdown - when it's been done on >on another shutdown. I am using the Hostess board for 8 ports and the normal com >port as the primary com port - which works (called unix.10 at boot time) but >after every powerdown my system wants to "re-link" the kernel then after >rebooting I loose control on all com ports. > Larry, it sounds like you have an old unix that was built without the Hostess driver sitting in a directory where the system wants to link it to /unix when rebooting (/etc/conf/cf.d, I believe). It seems some installpkgs put unix here, which is different from ISC's kconfig. Kconfig puts it's kernals in subdirectories to /etc/conf/kconfig.d. Do ls -li on these dirs and the root dir to match up the inodes, then remove or rename the old unix. -- David Raines TCA 5 National Dr., Windsor Locks, CT 06096 UUCP: ...!uunet!hrtix!davr