[comp.databases] RDBMS benchmark data

bruce@zeb.USWest.COM (Bruce W. Hoylman) (12/13/89)

I'm evaluating RDBMS packages for potential use in a major
development effort in my company.  I am having trouble
locating *ANY* type of benchmark/performance data for
the RDBMS packages I am considering.  Maybe I'm looking
in all the wrong places.

The packages I am currently evaluating are:

		  o  Progress
		     Progress Software Corporation
		  o  Ingres
		     Relational Technology, Inc.
		  o  Sybase
		     Sybase, Inc.
		  o  Informix
		     Informix Software, Inc.
		  o  Oracle
		     Oracle Corporation

I am particularly interested in results derived through
embedded SQL commands in 3GLs, 4GL, report writers and
form tools (if possible) with mainly ANSI standard SQL
calls.  Otherwise, *ANY* information would be greatly
appreciated.  Alternately any information SOURCES which
might provide me with this type of information would
be welcome as well.

Please e-mail replies.  If there is enough interest
in my findings, I will certainly post a summarization.

Thanks in advance.

Later ...


Bruce W. Hoylman (303-889-5806)  -- Standard disclaimer: "These views are 
bruce@mirage.USWest.COM             probably my own ..." --
ncar!boulder!uswat!bruce

jkrueger@dgis.dtic.dla.mil (Jon) (12/13/89)

bruce@zeb.USWest.COM (Bruce W. Hoylman) writes:

>I'm evaluating RDBMS packages for potential use in a major
>development effort in my company.

And, like most people, you're focusing on performance,
instead of functionality, reliability, vendor support,
and programmer productivity.  Please reconsider.
Don't be like most people.

>The packages I am currently evaluating are:

>		  o  Progress
>		  o  Ingres
>		  o  Sybase
>		  o  Informix
>		  o  Oracle

You can expect adequate performance from any of these.
Within a few years, you can expect little difference
in performance between any of the survivors.  Please
look at things that really matter.

-- Jon
-- 
Jonathan Krueger    jkrueger@dtic.dla.mil   uunet!dgis!jkrueger
The Philip Morris Companies, Inc: without question the strongest
and best argument for an anti-flag-waving amendment.

robf@squid.rtech.com (Robert Fair (ECSC Tech Support)) (12/14/89)

>From: bruce@zeb.USWest.COM (Bruce W. Hoylman) writes:

>		  o  Ingres
>                    Relational Technology, Inc.

INGRES comes from  Ingres Corperation (what was RTI). The name changed
earlier this year.

Robert Fair
Technical Support
Ingres Corperation.

eric@pyramid.pyramid.com (Eric Bergan) (12/15/89)

In article <698@dgis.dtic.dla.mil> jkrueger@dgis.dtic.dla.mil (Jon) writes:
>bruce@zeb.USWest.COM (Bruce W. Hoylman) writes:
>
>>I'm evaluating RDBMS packages for potential use in a major
>>development effort in my company.
>
>And, like most people, you're focusing on performance,
>instead of functionality, reliability, vendor support,
>and programmer productivity.  Please reconsider.
>Don't be like most people.
> [...]
>You can expect adequate performance from any of these.
>Within a few years, you can expect little difference
>in performance between any of the survivors.  Please
>look at things that really matter.

	I'm afraid I disagree. I agree that if you average across all
applications, etc, that the DBMSs tend to be about the same, but the fact
is that there can be significant differences in performance on specific
facets - differences so great as to rule out the DBMS. Some examples:

	- complex query that one DBMS properly parses out, and another
	  doesn't - can mean a several order of magnitude difference
	  in performance

	- backup strategy - some products can take 8 times longer to
	  do backups than others, due to their buffering/backup strategies.
	  Can be very important if backing up larger databases

	- differences in buffer management, particularly with respect to
	  what to do about linear searches, can cause major differences
	  in performance.

	(It is true that TP1 is not a great distinguisher of performance
any more...)

	I'm sure if pointed out to the vendors, any shortcomings versus
a competitor will go on the list of things to change, but that list can
get very long, and not all items make the cut for each release. But if the
effect is a difference between a 1 second response time and a 100 second
response time, I submit that is a very important point in choosing a database.

	My suggestion is that the only way to assess the performance of
a database system for your application is to do as accurate a job as you
can at developing a benchmark which models your application and environment,
and then run it on the DBMS systems under selection. General benchmarks,
such as TP1 or DeWitt are only useful if you can understand the relationship
between the TP1 or DeWitt application model and your own.

-- 

					eric
					...!pyramid!eric

pan@propress.com (Philip A. Naecker) (12/18/89)

In article <4703@uswat.UUCP>, bruce@zeb.USWest.COM (Bruce W. Hoylman) writes:
> I'm evaluating RDBMS packages for potential use in a major
> development effort in my company.  I am having trouble
> locating *ANY* type of benchmark/performance data for
> the RDBMS packages I am considering.  Maybe I'm looking
> in all the wrong places.
>
>...
> Bruce W. Hoylman (303-889-5806)  -- Standard disclaimer: "These views are
> bruce@mirage.USWest.COM             probably my own ..." --
> ncar!boulder!uswat!bruce
--

Without intending to be insulting, a reasonable question is "Why do you think
that this information might be of help to you?"  As a consultant who
specializes in building high-performance data management applications (almost
always using a relational database underneath), I can tell you that "Your
mileage may vary" is more than just a cute saying in the area of relational
database performance - it is the critical factor that you must understand and
take to heart.

If you believe that performance is going to be a major factor in your selection
of an RDMS, then I strongly suggest that you use a suite of benchmarks built
from your own (most important) applications.  Anything else is just not
sufficiently meaningful to be considered in any rational sort of way.  At the
very least, to make use of a "standard" benchmark you would need a deep
understanding of the relationship between you own application(s) and the
standards.  And since the standards as generally completely unrealistic in a
great many ways, even if you have that understanding you will likely have very
many unanswered questions regarding how your own application will perform.

Of course, almost no one either has (1) a sufficiently complete understanding
of their most critical applications to build such a benchmark suite, (2) the
time, money or inclination to do so, or (3) the environment in which to perform
such tests.  Cie la vie.

If you happen to be lucky enough to have a narrow range of applications that
you want to use with the RDMS, i.e.:

	o	a very update-intensive application

	o	an application with mostly ad-hoc query to stable data

	o	a read-only application with full reloads of the database

	o	a single-writer application

	o	or some other rather monolithic characteristic that dominates
		all database accesses

then you might be able to use some standard benchmarks that represent such
extremes in normal RDMS usage.  However, most *real* applications are not
easily represented by such extremes.

If you haven't already done so, I suggest you stop spending time looking for
benchmarks and start spending time rigorously documenting the characteristics
of your application(s).  Such parameters as transaction volumes, a preliminary
data model, update characteristics, referential integrity requirements,
hardware constraints (especially in the disk subsystem), requirements for
distribution through the network,  de-normalizations you might be willing to
make for performance, and so on.  These factors will be of much more use to you
in constructing a truly useful benchmark (even if it is synthetic) than will
most of the information you are likely to find about the publically available
benchmarks and how they perform in your proposed hardware environment.

Of course, the above steps are useful not only for understanding the
performance impacts of your RDMS choice, but also for identifying differences
between RDMS's in other important areas (ease of development, tools for
performance monitoring, data integrity characteristics, portability, network
distribution, etc.)

Even in building high-performance systems, I believe that the performance of
the database system itself (given any of the major players, including some you
haven't listed) is probably no more than 10% of the problem.


_______________________________________________________________________________
Philip A. Naecker                            Consulting Software Engineer
Internet: pan@propress.com                   Suite 101
          uunet!prowest!pan                  1010 East Union Street
Voice:    +1 818 577 4820                    Pasadena, CA  91106-1756
FAX:      +1 818 577 0073                    Also: Technology Editor
                                                   DEC Professional Magazine
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