paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (paul friberg) (01/11/90)
Does anyone have a feeling for where lies a standard in terms of interfaces to SQL servers? I understand that Sybase is trying to set a standard with OSF by calling its db_library() an Open Client. Is this true? Does anyone at Sybase have a feeling for where it might be headed? Is there any direction towards an SQL server protocol for data bases as was done for graphics with X windows? As I am rather new to this whole business of client/server openness I would appreciate any comments or personal inklings on the subject. Thanks in advance. Paul Friberg @ Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory of Columbia Univ. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Email: paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu Analog: (914) 359-2900 x620
randys@otl.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Randy Smerik) (01/11/90)
In article <1988@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu> paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (paul friberg) writes: > > >Does anyone have a feeling for where lies a standard in terms of >interfaces to SQL servers? I understand that Sybase is trying to >set a standard with OSF by calling its db_library() an Open Client. >Is this true? Does anyone at Sybase have a feeling for where it >might be headed? Is there any direction towards an SQL server >protocol for data bases as was done for graphics with X windows? >As I am rather new to this whole business of client/server >openness I would appreciate any comments or personal inklings on >the subject. Thanks in advance. > >Paul Friberg > @ Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory of Columbia Univ. >---------------------------------------------------------------------- >Email: paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu >Analog: (914) 359-2900 x620 There are two efforts underway. One concentrates on the protocol across the wire: ISO OSI-RDA. The other is dedicated to advancing ISO OSI-RDA as well as supplying the needed application interfaces: the SQL Access Group. Both efforts are described below. I am active on both the ANSI RDA commit- tee (ANSI X3H2.1) and the SQL Access Group. ISO OSI RDA ----------- First, there is an ISO standard being developed to address remote database access (RDA). The RDA standard (9579 DP) is part of the OSI Reference Model and it resides in layer 7 (application layer). The ANSI committee that takes US positions to the ISO RDA meetings is ANSI X3H2.1 (RDA). The purpose of the RDA standard is to solve the problem of remote hetero- geneous database access. RDA is based on the client/server model of interaction. As with the other OSI standards, RDA does not attempt to define application programming interfaces (API's). Instead, it concen- trates on specifying the services, message formats, and protocols needed for this type of interoperation. The RDA standard is comprised of two logical parts: Generic RDA and RDA Specializations. The Generic RDA standard specifies the operations and behaviors that are applicable to virtually all database languages (open resource, close resource, execute DBL, etc). RDA Specializations then further clarify the operations and behaviors for a specific database language. Currently, there is only one RDA Specialization being actively developed and it is the SQL Specialization. However, work has just started on an ISO IRDS Specialization as well. The SQL Access Group -------------------- The SQL Access Group that recently formed is dedicated to advancing the SQL and RDA standards as quickly as possible. Its goal is to have a working prototype demonstration that includes both standards ready by third quarter 1990. ------------------------------------------------------- | | | | -- | --- | Randy Smerik | | |\ | | | | | ) | NCR Corp. Mail Stop 4792 | | | \| | | | |-- | 16550 West Bernardo Drive | | | | | -- | | \ | San Diego, California 92127 | |-------------------- randy.smerik@sandiego.ncr.com | | E & M San Diego (619) 485-2084 | | Transaction Management Systems | -------------------------------------------------------
cmorris@ws2s.rtech.COM (Colin Morris) (01/13/90)
In article <2339@ncr-sd.SanDiego.NCR.COM> randys@otl.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Randy Smerik) writes: >In article <1988@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu> paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu (paul friberg) writes: >> >> >>Does anyone have a feeling for where lies a standard in terms of >>interfaces to SQL servers? I understand that Sybase is trying to >>set a standard with OSF by calling its db_library() an Open Client I believe OSF has postponed (cancelled?) a request for technology for database interconnect technology. The reasons given were to do with funding and potential conflict with the SQL Access Group (see below). > There are two efforts underway. One concentrates on the protocol across > the wire: ISO OSI-RDA. The other is dedicated to advancing ISO OSI-RDA as > well as supplying the needed application interfaces: the SQL Access Group. My understanding is that the Sybase db_library is an RPC machanism and is not connection oriented. ISO RDA is connection oriented and based upon the ISO Remote Operations mechanism. Was this why Sybase chose not to participate in the SQL Access Group? Anybody from Sybase care to correct and/or comment? ---- Colin Morris, cmorris@rtech.com Ingres Corp., Alameda, California.
betsy@alf.sybase.com (Betsy Burton) (01/18/90)
In article >From: cmorris@ws2s.rtech.COM (Colin Morris) Subject: Re: open server/client architectures Summary: RPC versus Connection Based Date: 12 Jan 90 18:36:52 GMT Organization: Ingres Corporation, Alameda CA 94501 > Colin Morris writes: In article <2339@ncr-sd.SanDiego.NCR.COM> randys@otl.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Randy Smerik) writes: >In article <1988@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu> paulf@lamont.ldgo.columbia.edu >> Paul Friberg writes: >>> Does anyone have a feeling for where lies a standard in terms >>> of interfaces to SQL servers? I understand that Sybase is >>> trying to set a standard with OSF by calling its db_library() >>> an Open Client > I believe OSF has postponed (cancelled?) a request for > technology for database interconnect technology. The reasons > given were to do with funding and potential conflict with the > SQL Access Group (see below). > There are two efforts underway. One concentrates on the > protocol across the wire: ISO OSI-RDA. The other is > dedicated to advancing ISO OSI-RDA as well as supplying the > needed application interfaces: the SQL Access Group. There is currently one official remote database interface standards effort underway. It is the ISO OSI-Remote Database Access (RDA) work. The RDA committee is currently working on a draft specification in an effort to define service and protocol. Sybase is an active member of the ANSI RDA committee, along with a number other software vendors and end-users. The ANSI RDA committee is an open organization, with each member having equal vote, which votes to determine the U.S. position for the ISO RDA meetings. Sybase is committed to the standards organizations and is committed to enhancing our products as the RDA standard becomes defined. The SQL Access Group (SAG) is not a standards organization, but rather a consortium. This means that they develop a technology which they hope the industry will accept as an industry standard. The work of the SQL Access Group is also based on the draft RDA specifications. Within the SQL Access Group only producers have a vote. To be a producer, a company must dedicate 2 developers to the development effort. The SQL Access is working on providing interoperability to SQL relational database only. > My understanding is that the Sybase db_library is an RPC > mechanism and is not connection oriented. ISO RDA is > connection oriented and based upon the ISO Remote Operations > mechanism. Your comment that Open Client (formerly called DB-Library) is connectionless is incorrect. The SYBASE Client/Server Interfaces (C/SI) (which includes Open Client, Open Server) and the SYBASE SQL Server products are connection oriented. C/SI is based on the draft ISO RDA standard. The purpose of the Sybase Client/Server Interface is to integrate previously incompatible data, applications and services. C/SI also includes an RPC facility as an added feature. By providing both an API and an RPC mechanism, C/SI provides developers and end-users with the ability to interoperate with: - other SQL relational databases - non-SQL, non-relational databases - applications and services. Currently, over 60 software vendors have implemented interfaces to C/SI. > Was this why Sybase chose not to participate in the SQL > Access Group? Anybody from Sybase care to correct and/or > comment? Sybase agrees with the objectives of the SQL Access Group and views database interoperability as a critical need in the industry. However, Sybase believes that the objective of database interoperability is best met through established standards bodies. They have a broader base of contributors and an independent status. Because of this, Sybase has decided not to participate in the SQL Access consortium. Sybase is focusing involvement in database interoperability on submitting technology to RDA and participating in OSF efforts. Betsy Burton Sybase Connectivity Product Manager