mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) (10/12/90)
We have a Novell Ethernet with about 10 systems on it, and a SCO TCP/IP Ethernet with 2 systems on it (but probably expanding in the near future). We'd like to link the TCP/IP and Novell networks so users on the SCO ODT machines can access the Novell server's drives, and users on the Novell workstations can send mail to the ODT machines, as well as access the ODT drives through NFS and possibly telnet/rlogin/ftp/etc. to the ODT machines. Some questions: 1. Is it okay to put the TCP/IP and Novell networks on the same Ethernet cable? I know Ethernet packets is Ethernet packets, but will Novell and/or ODT just ignore packets it doesn't understand? 2. If it's okay to do (1), then I suppose we could just use something like PC-NFS plus NCSA Telnet on the PC's, right? 3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx for SCO Unix? 4. If it isn't okay to do (1), then is there a program for MS-DOS that we could use to connect the two? I'd prefer to not have to buy a separate network bridge or router, especially considering that we're a computer reseller and thus have lots of spare PC's lying around. Sorry if these are absurdly simple questions or have been recently discussed, but as you've probably already figured out, I'm a novice network administrator... -- Marc Unangst | mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us | "Bus error: passengers dumped" ...!umich!leebai!mudos!mju |
nelson@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Russ Nelson) (10/13/90)
In article <gu6wq4w163w@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) writes:
1. Is it okay to put the TCP/IP and Novell networks on the same
Ethernet cable? I know Ethernet packets is Ethernet packets, but will
Novell and/or ODT just ignore packets it doesn't understand?
Yes, that's the whole point of Ethernet type codes.
2. If it's okay to do (1), then I suppose we could just use something
like PC-NFS plus NCSA Telnet on the PC's, right?
Sort of. If you want both Novell and TCP/IP on the same machine, then
basically the only solution is to use the packet drivers (see below for
availability).
3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx
for SCO Unix?
I don't know, but I think Novell has something like that...
4. If it isn't okay to do (1), then is there a program for MS-DOS that
we could use to connect the two? I'd prefer to not have to buy a
separate network bridge or router, especially considering that we're a
computer reseller and thus have lots of spare PC's lying around.
Even though it's okay to do (1), yes, there is a program for MS-DOS
that you could use, called PC-BRIDGE, and PC-ROUTE respectively. See
the "support.txt" file in the packet driver distribution for availability.
The Clarkson packet driver collection
Availability
The Clarkson collection of packet drivers is available by FTP, by
archive-server, and by modem. They come in two flavors -- executables
only (drivers.arc), and source+executables (driverss.arc). All of the
following instructions apply to both drivers.arc and driverss.arc.
Mail:
I distribute the packet drivers on a 1.2 MB 5.25" disk, or a 720K 3.5"
disk. You can send me a check for $20, or you can send me a purchse
order and I will bill you for $22. NY residents add 7% sales tax,
overseas orders add $3 for shipping. If you send a check, please be
sure it is in US dollars -- the bank charges me $15 to convert checks
drawn in foreign currencies.
Russell Nelson
11 Grant St.
Potsdam, NY 13676
FTP:
sun.soe.clarkson.edu:/pub/ka9q/drivers.arc
grape.ecs.clarkson.edu:/e/tcpip/drivers.arc
Archive-server:
Send mail to archive-server@sun.soe.clarkson.edu and put the following
command as the body of your message:
help
This will send you a help message. Reading this help message will tell
you how to fetch the packet drivers.
Modem:
Call the Clarkson Heath User's Group's BBS: (315)268-6667, 8N1,
1200/2400 Baud, 24 hours. Change to file area 24 and download drivers.arc.
--
--russ (nelson@clutx [.bitnet | .clarkson.edu]) Russ.Nelson@$315.268.6667
It's better to get mugged than to live a life of fear -- Freeman Dysonphil@shl.uucp (Phil Trubey) (10/13/90)
In article <gu6wq4w163w@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> you write: >1. Is it okay to put the TCP/IP and Novell networks on the same >Ethernet cable? I know Ethernet packets is Ethernet packets, but will >Novell and/or ODT just ignore packets it doesn't understand? Yes. >2. If it's okay to do (1), then I suppose we could just use something >like PC-NFS plus NCSA Telnet on the PC's, right? It is usually very difficult to run multiple protocol stacks in a single PC with Novell. Novell has believe it or not *designed* their drivers so that they will be gauranteed not to work with any other resident protocol stack in the same PC. Presumably they do this so that they don't have to be worried about bizarre interoperability problems between their stack and anyone else's - if you can't do it, you can't find bugs in it. However, various more practical people have thought this restriction somewhat silly and hacked the Novell driver to allow it to work with other resident stacks. Most notibly there is a version of the Novell driver out there that will work with NCSA Telnet or FTP Software's PC-TCP Plus (which is FTP Software's version of NFS for PCs). I don't know if Sun's PC-NFS will work with this hacked Novell driver or if there is another Novell driver out there that works with it. I know that FTP will send you a copy of the modified Novell driver with their software if you ask for it. You probably can get it electronically somewhere too, but I don;t know where. >3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx >for SCO Unix? Not that I know of. -- Phil Trubey (UUCP: ...!uunet!shl!phil)
hamish@waikato.ac.nz (10/15/90)
In article <gu6wq4w163w@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us>, mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us (Marc Unangst) writes: > We have a Novell Ethernet with about 10 systems on it, and a SCO > TCP/IP Ethernet with 2 systems on it (but probably expanding in the > near future). We'd like to link the TCP/IP and Novell networks so > users on the SCO ODT machines can access the Novell server's drives, > and users on the Novell workstations can send mail to the ODT > machines, as well as access the ODT drives through NFS and possibly > telnet/rlogin/ftp/etc. to the ODT machines. Some questions: > > 1. Is it okay to put the TCP/IP and Novell networks on the same > Ethernet cable? I know Ethernet packets is Ethernet packets, but will > Novell and/or ODT just ignore packets it doesn't understand? > Yep! We have Novell, TCP/IP, Appletalk, LAT, Decnet and maybe more on ours. > 2. If it's okay to do (1), then I suppose we could just use something > like PC-NFS plus NCSA Telnet on the PC's, right? > Ahhhh... Firstly, Novell and TCP/IP (or NFS) are completely different. Although you can use both at the same time, we have had problems here, where NOvell wanted lots of virtual drives and PC-NFS wouldn't give them away (It only needed 2). > 3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx > for SCO Unix? > Not that I've ever heard of IPX NETx doing TCP/IP > 4. If it isn't okay to do (1), then is there a program for MS-DOS that > we could use to connect the two? I'd prefer to not have to buy a > separate network bridge or router, especially considering that we're a > computer reseller and thus have lots of spare PC's lying around. > Haven't head of one. Maybe now that the accounting print server is working I could do with something else to do? :) > Sorry if these are absurdly simple questions or have been recently > discussed, but as you've probably already figured out, I'm a novice > network administrator... > > -- > Marc Unangst | > mju@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us | "Bus error: passengers dumped" > ....!umich!leebai!mudos!mju | -- ============================================================================== | Hamish Marson | Internet hamish@waikato.ac.nz | | Computer Support Person | Phone (071)562889 xt 8181 | | Computer Science Department | Amiga 3000 for ME! | | University of Waikato | | ============================================================================== |Disclaimer: Anything said in this message is the personal opinion of the | | finger hitting the keyboard & doesn't represent my employers | | opinion in any way. (ie we probably don't agree) | ==============================================================================
larree@altos86.Altos.COM (Larry Snyder) (10/18/90)
In article <gu6wq4w163w@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> you write: >> We'd like to link the TCP/IP and Novell networks so >> users on the SCO ODT machines can access ... >> >> 1. Is it okay to put the TCP/IP and Novell networks on the same >> Ethernet cable? I know Ethernet packets is Ethernet packets, but will >> Novell and/or ODT just ignore packets it doesn't understand? netware can be configured to run either using 'length' or 'type' fields (these correspond to 802.3 or ethernet-II specs, respectively). in either case, the two packet types can happily co-exist. assuming that you can get both the IPX/SPX and the TCP/IP protocol stacks to run in the same unix kernel, inbound packets will be sorted to the appropriate stack depending upon how they were bound to the ethernet driver. if no driver is bound appropriately for a particular packet, it will drop it. examples: assume that the netware PCs are configured for 802.3 packets (ethernet packet bytes 13-14 are the length of the frame), whenever a packet is received from the ethernet with a 'length/type' field between 0x60 and 0x5ee (min and max frame lengths) it would go to the netware stack. for other frames, the length/type field value would be looked-up in a table of bound types, and sent up the TCP stack as appropriate. if, however, your novell PCs were using 'type' fields, then all netware packets received by Unix would have a type value of 0x8137 (?) and would be passed to the proper stack (since the IPX/SPX stack would have registered itself as the proper destination for frames of this type.) >> 3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx >> for SCO Unix? WARNING ***** ADVERT COMING ... in order to accomplish (cleanly) your objective, novell has come up with a source-level product which they call 'portable netware' which can be ported to other enviromnents. of the current contractees for this product Altos is the only company which has a port to an SCO-based unix. to date, this product is only offered on altos hardware. we have a (very slick) family of '486 EISA systems, running a Unix based on SCO 5.3.2 with ODT. I say "based" since we started with source to SCO Unix and then put a great deal of effort into system tuning, enhancement, and bug fixes. (i would be happy to go into detail at another time if you wish) with the altos system in your network, it could act as a netware server, while running ODT (TCP, NFS, etc.), SCO applications and give everyone access to the printers, disks, ... hanging off the unix system. by configuring NFS, you could also give your PCs access to the filesystems of your current SCO systems. -- Larry Snyder Altos Computer Systems 2641 Orchard Parkway Internet: larree@altos.com San Jose CA 95134 UUCP : uunet!altos!larree 408.432.6200
jcurtis@simasd.uucp (Jay Curtis) (10/23/90)
In article <4267@altos86.Altos.COM> larree@altos.com (Larry Snyder) writes: > >In article <gu6wq4w163w@mudos.ann-arbor.mi.us> you write: >>> We'd like to link the TCP/IP and Novell networks so >>> users on the SCO ODT machines can access ... (Stuff deleted) > > >>> 3. Again, if it's okay to do (1), are there versions of IPX and NETx >>> for SCO Unix? > >WARNING ***** ADVERT COMING ... > (more stuff deleted) > >with the altos system in your network, it could act as a netware >server, while running ODT (TCP, NFS, etc.), SCO applications >and give everyone access to the printers, disks, ... hanging off >the unix system. by configuring NFS, you could also give your PCs >access to the filesystems of your current SCO systems. > >-- >Larry Snyder Altos Computer Systems > 2641 Orchard Parkway >Internet: larree@altos.com San Jose CA 95134 >UUCP : uunet!altos!larree 408.432.6200 Portable netware is a slick product if your intention is to make the Unix Machine a server. However if you read the first quoted line, the question seems to be "Can I make my unix machine a CLIENT on a Novell network?". I also have a number of personal unix workstations that would like to have access to the Novell network and it's resources. The Unix machines are a minor portion of a 500 node PC based LAN. Politics and common sense say to make the unix workstations clients rather than servers for print services, etc. Is there a way to do this? Has anyone managed it to date? The technology is there. Most of the software has already been written. With unix running on 386/486 machines and "dos under unix" products in such common use, can it be long before the PC based unix systems can access the resources available on the Novell based LANs? Inquiring minds want to know! --Jay -- Jay Curtis jcurtis@simasd.UUCP {nosc;ncr-sd;ucsd;}!simasd!jcurtis Of course my opinions are my own... Who would let me speak for them?!