[comp.dcom.modems] v.42? v.32? v.va espana!!

MARX@vms.huji.ac.il (06/04/90)

Hi Netters,

Recently I purchased the ATI 2400etc. Modem, In the brochure it says the
MNP class 5 Data Compression abilities and also, the CCITT V.42 Error
Control Protocol.
I am starting to get mixed between the v's the MNPs and the x's.
can anyone explain what is the difference, what are the features
and what's good and what's bad on those protocols?

Michael M. Marx, The Hebrew Univ. Of Jerusalem, ISRAEL
marx@vms.huji.ac.il / marx@hujivms.bitnet

amigo@milton.acs.washington.edu (Michael Robertson) (06/05/90)

In article <2669790120204258@vms.huji.ac.il> MARX@vms.huji.ac.il writes:
>Hi Netters,
>
>Recently I purchased the ATI 2400etc. Modem, In the brochure it says the
>MNP class 5 Data Compression abilities and also, the CCITT V.42 Error
>Control Protocol.
>can anyone explain what is the difference, what are the features
>and what's good and what's bad on those protocols?
	
	MNP is just a early protocol used to boost the modem's throughput
beyond what a non-MNP modem would do. MNP is just a built-in hardware protocol
much like any other software ones used in terms (Zmodem, Xmodem, etc.).
It also has some advantages in that it is designed specifically for modem transfers of course, and it does compression (if on). Anyhow, there is MNP classes
1 to 5, and supposedly 7 was developed, but never used much in modems until
	
	>V.42<.
	
	What V's are is the CCITT standards institute's way of defining how
a modem operates, and calling that a standard of sorts. They recognize only a
few that they can agree apon, such as V.32, or 2400 baud modems all work on
V.22. (V.32 is defined as a two-way full duplex 9600 baud transfer state). 
	
	But back to V.42/V.42bis, V.42 is just the CCITT's standard for
what was MNP-7. It gives you 3 times the modems throughput, so you can
expect to get into the 350-400 characters per second data transfer rates
if your connection is made to a V.42 modem.
	

tnixon@hsfmsh.UUCP (Toby Nixon) (06/07/90)

In article <3931@milton.acs.washington.edu>,
amigo@milton.acs.washington.edu (Michael Robertson) writes:

- 	MNP is just a early protocol used to boost the modem's
- throughput beyond what a non-MNP modem would do. MNP is just a
- built-in hardware protocol much like any other software ones used in
- terms (Zmodem, Xmodem, etc.). 

MNP (Microcom Networking Protocol) was, as the name suggests, 
developed by Microcom, Inc., of Norwood, MA, as a point-to-point 
error correction protocol between modems.  It was originally an 
async start-stop protocol only (MNP2), but has always had the 
advantage over XMODEM or ZMODEM of allowing data transfer in both 
directions simultaneously and of "streaming" operation rather than 
fixed-length blocks.

- It also has some advantages in that it is designed specifically for
- modem transfers of course, and it does compression (if on). Anyhow,
- there is MNP classes 1 to 5, and supposedly 7 was developed, but
- never used much in modems until >V.42<

Actually, MNP classes now go up to 10.  Class 3 introduced 
synchronous transmission on the phone line (HDLC framing); Class 4 
allows longer frames and shorter headers for less protocol overhead; 
Class 5 is data compression based on the frequency of occurrence of 
inidividual characters; Class 6 is a fast-turnaround ping-pong 
modulation scheme for operation up to 9600bps, based on CCITT V.29; 
Class 7 is a data compression scheme based on the frequency of 
occurrence of pairs of characters; Class 8 doesn't exist anymore; 
Class 9 adds some protocol enhancements including multiple selective 
reject and piggybacked acknowledgements; Class 10 adds some 
procedures to help the protocol work over real noisy lines like 
cellular radio (more aggressively reduces maximum frame size, has 
more retries before giving up).

- 	What V's are is the CCITT standards institute's way of
- defining how a modem operates, and calling that a standard of sorts.
- They recognize only a few that they can agree apon, such as V.32, or
- 2400 baud modems all work on V.22. (V.32 is defined as a two-way
- full duplex 9600 baud transfer state). 

The International Telegraph and Telephone Consultative Committee 
(CCITT) is part of the United Nations, and has considerably more 
power than you seem to think.  They are the one and only 
internationally recognized standards organization for telephone 
system operation, including data transmission over the telephone 
network (which is what is defined by the V series Recommendations).  
CCITT standards have the force of law in many countries.  Nations 
are bound by treaty to abide by CCITT Recommendations for 
interconnection of telephone systems.

Because the Bell System controlled data communications in the USA 
for many decades, only in the past 10 years or so has compatibility 
with CCITT Recommendations been a major issue for modem users in the 
US.  There are MANY MANY CCITT standards (not "only a few") that US 
modem manufacturers comply with today: V.1, V.2, V.4, V.14, V.21, 
V.22, V.22bis, V.23, V.24, V.25, V.25bis, V.28, V.32, V.33, V.42, 
V.42bis, V.54, etc.  And this is only a small subset of the entire 
family of V series standards, and doesn't begin to mention all of 
the others in Series A through Series Z!

- 	But back to V.42/V.42bis, V.42 is just the CCITT's standard
- for what was MNP-7. It gives you 3 times the modems throughput, so
- you can expect to get into the 350-400 characters per second data
- transfer rates if your connection is made to a V.42 modem. 

Huh?  V.42 is the CCITT standard for error control.  It defines two 
protocols: Link Access Procedure for Modems (LAPM) in the main body 
of the standard, and an Alternative Protocol defined in Annex A of 
the recommendation which provides backward compatibility with modems 
implementing MNP2-4.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with MNP7.  
LAPM is the basis for future extensions to V.42, one of which is the 
V.42bis international standard for data compression.

V.42bis is based on the Lempel-Ziv data compression technique, which 
compresses variable-length strings of characters into fixed-length 
tokens.  On text files, we often see throughput approaching 4-to-1 
(e.g., 9600bps throughput on a 2400bps V.22bis modem).  While MNP7 
was proposed by Microcom for consideration during the development of 
V.42bis, as well as a number of other techniques, the Lempel-Ziv 
technique as enhanced by British Telecom and Hayes was selected 
because of its superior performance, reduced microprocessor 
requirement, ability to quickly adapt to changing data patterns, 
flexibility to work in varying amounts of memory with proportional 
degrees of compression, and relative simplicity of design and 
description.


Anyway, I've written about five times what I intended, but simply 
want to caution you about presenting as facts information with which 
you are obviously not very familiar.

	Toby Nixon
	Principal Engineer, Hayes Microcomputer Products Inc.
	Standards Committee Representative
	Chairman, TIA standard committee TR-30.4
	Special Rapporeur on Q.14 in CCITT Study Group XVII

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oneill@bu-tyng.bu.edu (Brian O'Neill) (06/12/90)

In article <3931@milton.acs.washington.edu> amigo@milton.u.washington.edu (Michael Robertson) writes:
>In article <2669790120204258@vms.huji.ac.il> MARX@vms.huji.ac.il writes:
>>Hi Netters,
>>
>>Recently I purchased the ATI 2400etc. Modem, In the brochure it says the
>>MNP class 5 Data Compression abilities and also, the CCITT V.42 Error
>>Control Protocol.
>>can anyone explain what is the difference, what are the features
>>and what's good and what's bad on those protocols?
>	
>	MNP is just a early protocol used to boost the modem's throughput
>beyond what a non-MNP modem would do. MNP is just a built-in hardware protocol
>much like any other software ones used in terms (Zmodem, Xmodem, etc.).
>It also has some advantages in that it is designed specifically for modem transfers of course, and it does compression (if on). Anyhow, there is MNP classes
>1 to 5, and supposedly 7 was developed, but never used much in modems until
>	
>	>V.42<.
>	

Sorry, but you are a bit mistaken. MNP is a suite of protocols. Levels 1
through 3 deal with error-correction, as does V.42, CCITT's standard
error-correcting protocol. MNP levels 1 and 2 did error-correction with a
loss on throughput. Level 3 managed to keep the same throughput. Level 4
added variable-sized packets. Level 5 is not an error correcting protocol,
but a data compression scheme which can increase throughput up to 100%.
CCITT's V.42bis is a similar but better and I believe offers up to 200%
throughput. MNP Level 7 is also a data-compression scheme offering
approximately the same throughput, but isn't very common. V.42 if fact
includes MNP levels 1 through 4, so it is compatible with MNP class modems
as far as error correction goes.

>	What V's are is the CCITT standards institute's way of defining how
>a modem operates, and calling that a standard of sorts. They recognize only a
>few that they can agree apon, such as V.32, or 2400 baud modems all work on
>V.22. (V.32 is defined as a two-way full duplex 9600 baud transfer state). 
>	

Unfortunately, CCITT's V.XX naming can be difficult to understand at times.
V.32, as Mr. Robertson stated above, is a method of communication between
hish-speed modems. V.42, on the other hand, is a method of error-correction
between modems regardless of speed. V.XXbis is usually some sort of
extension to a previous standard. The standard for 2400 baud communications 
is V.22bis, whereas the standard for 1200 baud is V.22 in Europe, but Bell
212A in the United States. There is also a variety of synchronous standards
such as V.29 for leased-line applications.

>	But back to V.42/V.42bis, V.42 is just the CCITT's standard for
>what was MNP-7. It gives you 3 times the modems throughput, so you can
>expect to get into the 350-400 characters per second data transfer rates
>if your connection is made to a V.42 modem.
>	

V.42bis is what you are referrring to here. V.42, as stated above, is only
error-correction. V.42 can actually work with MNP version 5 and 7 to get
better throughput.

Incidentally, I own an ATI 2400etc/e as the original poster has. It is an
excellent modem. It has V.42 error-correction and MNP level 5 compression. I
just talked to ATI last Thursday, and there is a planned upgrade for
V.42bis, but it is still in the works, and may be available in a month or
so.

-- 
===========================================================================
Brian O'Neill - Boston University Corporate Education Center, Tyngsboro, MA
UUCP:  {decvax|ulowell}!bu-tyng!oneill
Internet: oneill@bu-tyng.bu.edu                          (508) 649-9731 x14