[comp.bugs.sys5] Sys V 3.2.1 online man pages

jim@lsuc.on.ca (Jim Mercer) (08/17/90)

we are a Sys V 3.2.1 license holder.

i have been told by our AT&T Source Code Sales rep that there are _no_
online man pages for release 3.2.

i find this a little hard to believe.  the printed man pages had to come
from somewhere.

as a license holder, is there anyone out there who will arrange to get these
to me?

[ we recently upgraded from V7 and miss them a bunch ]


-- 
[ Jim Mercer  jim@lsuc.On.Ca  || ...!uunet!attcan!lsuc!jim    +1 416 947-5258 ]
[ Systems Facilitator - Law Society of Upper Canada, Toronto, Ontario, CANADA ]
[ Standards are great. They give non-conformists something to not conform to. ]
[      The opinions expressed here may or may not be those of my employer     ]

jim@lsuc.on.ca (Jim Mercer) (08/21/90)

in response to my query as to the availability of online man pages for
Sys V 3.2.1, this is what i got:

> From: Bruce D. Becker <bdb@becker.UUCP>
> 
> Amiga unix comes with AT&T man pages, and there was a
> 3.2 version for a while.

> From:	hedrick@cs.rutgers.edu
> 
> There are certainly man pages, but ATT charges separately.  Some
> vendors include it in the package, some charge the user, other don't
> make it available at all.  There have been enough complaints that most
> vendors are now supplying them.  You should pressure yours to do so
> as well.

[ it used to be that they can as part of the DWB (nroff) package, but this is
  no more ]

> From:	paone@cs.rutgers.edu (Phil Paone)
> 
> Until I freed my bonds of AT&T two months ago, I tried to track down
> those elusive man pages. They do exist. The only problem is that the
> only way to get them is by ordering the source code license
> ~10,000.00.  I havn't found anyone with that kind of money (even in
> AT&T) to check it out, but that is what I was told.

[ we ARE a source licensee, and they still tell me i can't have them ]

> From:	arnold@audiofax.com (Arnold Robbins)
> 
> They do exist, and you can buy them.  For a mere $10,000 U.S.  Ask again,
> a little louder, and you'll find this out.
> 
> Personally, that one has to pay that kind of price for the man pages
> really ticks me off....  Can you say "greed", boys and girls?  Sigh.

> From: gwyn@smoke.BRL.MIL (Doug Gwyn)
> 
> They are certainly not covered by the UNIX System V license.
> It is possible that (as with older releases) they may be licensed separately.
> 
> >as a license holder, is there anyone out there who will arrange to get these
> >to me?
> 
> You shouldn't ask people to commit a federal crime in so public a forum.

[ it was my understanding that as a source licensee, we can exchange source
  with other licensees (within limit's, ie. we don't have a DWB license so
  i can't very well ask someone to provide DWB).  as i understand it, we can
  call up UCB and ask for BSD source as we already have the prerequisite
  AT&T license (UCB charges a nominal fee as well).

  my license says, and i quote section 7.05(b):

    LICENSEE may distribute copies of a SOFTWARE PRODUCT, either in modified
    or unmodified form, to third parties in the AUTHORIZED COUNTRY having
    licenses of at least equivalent scope ....

  (AT&T's emphasis)

  if the man pages do not fit either "SOFTWARE PRODUCT" (which in our case
  means Unix System V 3.2.1) or are not in the "scope" of our license, i'm
  sure someone out there would let me know. ]

> From:	jimm@IMA.ISC.COM (Jim McGrath)
> 
> Interactive includes online man pages with its latest release (2.2) of
> V3.2.  I believe that SCO does also.  I don't know how one buys an
> unbundled copy, however.  I suggest you contact the sales organization
> of either/both SCO and Interactive.  Good luck.

> From:	wdavis@x102c.ess.harris.com (davis william 26373)
> 
> Absolutely correct.  When 3.2 came out, ATT had just finished a deal with
> Prentice-Hall to have nice manuals printed up.  Providing man pages
> would have cut into the sales by Prentice-Hall.

> From: lyndon@cs.athabascau.ca (Lyndon Nerenberg)
> 
> Har dee har har har! :-)  (Sorry Jim.)
> 
> AT&T has an agreement with Prentice Hall regarding printed manuals that
> (apparently) prevents AT&T from shipping source to the man pages. I
> went through this some months ago. For a while, it seemed like they
> might be able to give us man page source under the terms of our DWB
> source license, however AT&T was never able to figure out if that
> was the case or not. Not that they would do you much good - SVR3
> doesn't come with nroff or a man command, either.
> 
> System V: Just Consider It Bogus.

why is it that most of the vendors who have licensed 3.2 from AT&T (ie. SCO,
interactive, Commodore) issue online man pages, but AT$T (oops) decided to
squeeze some additional bucks out?

one of the reasons we have a source license is that we would like to alter
some of the programs for our environment.  it would be nice to update our
man pages to reflect these changes.

i don't think submitting them to Prentice-Hall for a private run will be
very cost effective.  8^)

hmmm....

does anyone know if you get FULL online man pages with the Sys V 4.0
source distribution?


-- 
[ Jim Mercer  jim@lsuc.On.Ca  || ...!uunet!attcan!lsuc!jim    +1 416 947-5258 ]
[ Systems Facilitator - Law Society of Upper Canada, Toronto, Ontario, CANADA ]
[ Standards are great. They give non-conformists something to not conform to. ]
[      The opinions expressed here may or may not be those of my employer     ]