werner@molokai.sw.mcc.com (Werner Uhrig) (07/02/89)
> Under a reciprocal agreement with USENIX, members of one organisation can > benefit many of the services of the other. > For example, anyone interested in following developments in europe, > who is a USENIX member, can subscribe to the EUUG Newsletter for what > amounts to the cost of production and postage. > Similar arangements exist for entry to EUUG conferences etc. in this day and age such an item should be distributed electronically and available to everyone that is able to read news. or do you copyright that thing and distribute it only to paying members also? from all the recent negative publicity, maybe you should reconsider posting this newsletter for a couple of months now (and some back-issues) so that we can read up on your activities and positions and check if you really are the "good guys in the white hat" ... I thought I was Anke's list of people to get this thing and even offered to make it available in the US for anonymous FTP ... and I gladly to repeat that offer again.... -- --------------------------> please send REPLIES to <------------------------ INTERNET: uhrig@mcc.com (if unavailable: werner@rascal.ics.utexas.edu) UUCP: ...<well-connected-site>!milano!werner ALTERNATIVE: werner@astro.as.utexas.edu OR werner@utastro.UUCP
philip@axis.fr (Philip Peake) (07/05/89)
In article <2569@molokai.sw.mcc.com>, werner@molokai.sw.mcc.com (Werner Uhrig) writes: > > > Under a reciprocal agreement with USENIX, members of one organisation can > > benefit many of the services of the other. > > For example, anyone interested in following developments in europe, > > who is a USENIX member, can subscribe to the EUUG Newsletter for what > > amounts to the cost of production and postage. > > Similar arangements exist for entry to EUUG conferences etc. > > in this day and age such an item should be distributed electronically > and available to everyone that is able to read news. or do you > copyright that thing and distribute it only to paying members > also? from all the recent negative publicity, maybe you should > reconsider posting this newsletter for a couple of months now (and > some back-issues) so that we can read up on your activities and > positions and check if you really are the "good guys in the white > hat" ... It is the EUUG NEWSLETTER - ie really intended for EUUG members - much of it would not be of interest to the majority of news readers - yes it IS copyright. Why don't you ask the IEEE, USENIX et. al. to put their newsletters/journals on the net too ? It also contains photographs and diagrams - not easy to put on the net. What negative publicity ? you mean about the intolerant, short sighted attitudes of a few American people ? > I thought I was Anke's list of people to get this thing and even > offered to make it available in the US for anonymous FTP ... > and I gladly to repeat that offer again.... No. As with the network, it costs money to produce - it is done proffesionaly (I know you are not going to like that word ..) and is for the benefit of EUUG members - not the whole world. There was some talk of making the postscript available, but this would be on the same conditions as the Newsletter itself - ie copyrighted, but with permission to copy for non-profit use with suitable acknowlegemets to the author(s) and the EUUG. Unfortunately, some of the work is still done using cut and paste techniques, so there isn't a real postscript image available.
werner@molokai.sw.mcc.com (Werner Uhrig) (07/07/89)
In article <581@axis.fr>, philip@axis.fr (Philip Peake) writes: > In <2569@molokai.sw.mcc.com>, werner@molokai.sw.mcc.com I wrote: > > quoting from an article whose author I can no longer identify: > > > Under a reciprocal agreement with USENIX, members of one organisation can > > > benefit many of the services of the other. > > > For example, anyone interested in following developments in europe, > > > who is a USENIX member, can subscribe to the EUUG Newsletter for what > > > amounts to the cost of production and postage. > > > Similar arangements exist for entry to EUUG conferences etc. > > > > in this day and age such an item should be distributed electronically > > and available to everyone that is able to read news. or do you > > copyright that thing and distribute it only to paying members > > also? from all the recent negative publicity, maybe you should > > reconsider posting this newsletter for a couple of months now (and > > some back-issues) so that we can read up on your activities and > > positions and check if you really are the "good guys in the white > > hat" ... > > It is the EUUG NEWSLETTER - ie really intended for EUUG members ... you could have fooled me; I would have thought it is published by the EUUG organization; to be read by whoever is interested in it ... (mostly EUUG-members, by default, but not the exclusion of others ...) > ...much of it would not be of interest to the majority of news readers most anything posted as news is not of interest to 'the majority' but only to a (small) subset of all news-readers ... I am certain that there is enough interest "over here" to pass a few copies of the EUUG-newsletter around, given all the hoopla and traffic this topic has caused in news.admin recently ... > ...yes it IS copyright... good. as it says above "available to USENIX members at cost". and as you say below "can be distributed freely but not for profit" shipping it over the pond electronically seems cheapest to me (dare I say us?). Given that I have been asked to write articles for your worthy magazine (but have not yet done so myself in parts because I am not familiar with the publication and feel hesitant to write for it without first getting a feel for it) and have recruited authors for it instead, encouraging you to make back-issues available electronically really seemed to me like a good idea (and in the interest of EUUG, mostly). But then I have better things to do then to either read, write, or otherwise worry about what might be good for the image of EUUG. > Why don't you ask the IEEE, USENIX et. al. to put their newsletters/journals > on the net too ? oh, I have and I do. and quite a few articles tend to show up electronically and noone would really object if there were more of the same. anyone can scan and post their articles, I believe, at least the ones published under the "go ahead and distribute, but not for profit" copyright. Do you see a problem with EUUG, possibly, taking a lead in electronic publishing? I'd not really expect that the demand for paper copies would diminish - but you can be certain that you would reach a lot wider audience in addition ... > It also contains photographs and diagrams - not easy to put on the net. yes, those will be missed ... (there is still something to be said for paper) > What negative publicity ? you mean about the intolerant, short sighted > attitudes of a few American people ? I ignore those; no, I was thinking of the negative publicity from some Europeans *AND* some Americans who raised questions which seemed quite reasonable and not intolerant or short-sighted at all. > > I thought I was Anke's list of people to get this thing and even > > offered to make it available in the US for anonymous FTP ... > > and I gladly to repeat that offer again.... > > No. As with the network, it costs money to produce the paper copy does; it is my guess that most articles start as electronic copy, mostly (except some photos, etc, of course) > it is done professionally (I know you are not going to like that word ..) silly remarks like this distract only ... > and is for the benefit of EUUG members - not the whole world. I guess we all should scrap the idea of posting electronically to news-groups because it might benefit someone who hasn't paid his membership fee ... sigh! > There was some talk of making the postscript available, but this would be on > the same conditions as the Newsletter itself - ie copyrighted, but with > permission to copy for non-profit use with suitable acknowlegemets to the > author(s) and the EUUG. I would not have it different. if your paper magazine states as much, then I see nothing to prevent anyone to either send me a photocopy, fax me a copy, scan it and send me the bits... if you can, why not make it easier on everyone and distribute electronically yourself? > Unfortunately, some of the work is still done using cut and paste techniques, > so there isn't a real postscript image available. so we don't get it all - but it would be a beginning. Philip, you did not identify yourself as an officer or representative of EUUG, so neither I nor anyone else should assume that what you said represents the EUUG's official position (if one has been formulated and announced). My response, therefore, though it may sound as if I am argueing with such an official position, should also not be misinterpreted by anyone to this effect. I want to repeat my encouragement to the officials of EUUG, however, to post information and facts (and positions) that will allow readers both in Europe and outside to form their own "well informed" opinion about the situation in Europe. Solid information tends to drown out "the noise" rather quickly. However, one thing that should not be forgotten (no matter how unpleasant the style and the arguments posted here sometimes seem) is the fact that, simply by posting, the author *DOES* indicate that he cares for Worldnet (though sometimes it may seem otherwise :-) Cheers, ---Werner -- --------------------------> please send REPLIES to <------------------------ INTERNET: uhrig@mcc.com (if unavailable: werner@rascal.ics.utexas.edu) UUCP: ...<well-connected-site>!milano!werner ALTERNATIVE: werner@astro.as.utexas.edu OR werner@utastro.UUCP