mats@enea.UUCP (02/12/87)
I'm looking for a way to connect Sun-3 workstations with
Xerox (Big Ben) workstations using Ethernet. The main
requirement is to be able to transfer files, but the need
for more functionality will surely arise when people
start using the systems.
My understanding is that there is compatibility at the
hardware level but they use different protocols (TCP/IP
vs. XNS). There seems to be at least three solutions
to my problem.
1. Get XNS for the Sun systems. I know there is (limited)
XNS support in the BSD 4.3 distribution for the VAX.
Does anyone know if Sun is going to support XNS in any
future release of their os? The Sun's that I have looked
at are 4.2 based and I couldn't find any references to
XNS in the documentation or elsewhere. We are BSD 4.3
source licensees, but I can't afford to try a port myself.
2. Get TCP/IP for the Xerox machines. I have a (slightly
outdated) version of the "TCP/IP vendors and implementations
guide" but there is no mention of any Xerox hardware or
software in it.
3. Get some sort of gateway/bridge which will do the conversion
between TCP/IP and XNS, possibly using different LAN's.
This seems to be a really ugly solution.
Has anyone done anything like this before? Any help would
be appreciated. I might add that we're perfectly willing to
pay a reasonable price for a useful product.
--
Mats Josefsson, ENEA DATA, Sweden
UUCP: {seismo,mcvax,munnari,cernvax,diku,inria,prlb2,penet,ukc,unido}!enea!mats
Internet: mats@enea.sehedrick@topaz.UUCP (02/14/87)
Unfortunately the term "Big Ben" doesn't mean anything to me. Xerox Interlisp workstations definitely support TCP/IP. Our Xerox salesman claimed that the Mesa software would support TCP/IP sometime in 86. I suggest talking to your Xerox salesman.
zben@umd5.UUCP (02/17/87)
In article <9233@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU> hedrick@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU (Charles Hedrick) writes: > Unfortunately the term "Big Ben" doesn't mean anything to me. ... Quoted from the original article: > From: mats@enea.UUCP (Mats Josefsson) > Organization: ENEA DATA Svenska AB, Sweden > ... > Mats Josefsson, ENEA DATA, Sweden Careful there. "Big Ben" might be a European marketing name for something sold in the U.S. under a different name. Might even be something not sold in the U.S. at all. In any case, let's not be cultural chauvenists here. Name changes do happen in international marketing, sometimes for the most innocent of reasons. Remember what Coca Cola means in Chinese, and why they changed it? :-) (I don't remember but it was pretty ikky...) -- umd5.UUCP <= {seismo!mimsy,ihnp4!rlgvax}!cvl!umd5!zben Ben Cranston zben @ umd2.UMD.EDU Kingdom of Merryland UniSys 1100/92 umd2.BITNET "via HASP with RSCS"
ken@rochester.UUCP (02/18/87)
|innocent of reasons. Remember what Coca Cola means in Chinese, and why |they changed it? :-) (I don't remember but it was pretty ikky...) Actually it wasn't "Coca Cola" but the slogan "Coke adds life" which some inept translator rendered as "Coke brings your ancestors back from the dead". Ken Disclaimer: all the trademarks in this posting are somebody's trademarks.
dw@rocksanne.UUCP (02/18/87)
In article <1690@enea.UUCP>, mats@enea.UUCP (Mats Josefsson) writes: > > I'm looking for a way to connect Sun-3 workstations with > Xerox (Big Ben) workstations using Ethernet. The main > requirement is to be able to transfer files, but the need > for more functionality will surely arise when people > start using the systems. > > [Plus some stuff about ways to do this] It depends on what software you're running on the Xerox workstation. If you're running XDE or Lisp you're in luck, for both support TCP/IP. If you're running Viewpoint, though, you've gotta talk XNS. Note: TCP/IP is supported in XDE 5.0, which has been available for a few months. /Don -- "Spock's on drugs. Blast him with the phasers!" Don Wegeng Wegeng.Henr@Xerox.COM seismo!rochester!rocksanne!dw
steve@mimsy.UUCP (02/18/87)
In article <1690@enea.UUCP> mats@enea.UUCP (Mats Josefsson) writes: [stuff about wanting to talk between Suns and Xeroxes deleted] >1. Get XNS for the Sun systems. I know there is (limited) > XNS support in the BSD 4.3 distribution for the VAX. > Does anyone know if Sun is going to support XNS in any > future release of their os? The Sun's that I have looked > at are 4.2 based and I couldn't find any references to > XNS in the documentation or elsewhere. We are BSD 4.3 > source licensees, but I can't afford to try a port myself. It's not clear exactly what's going on with regard to Sun support for XNS. A NFS meeting last April said that SunOS 4.0 was going to include 4.3BSD networking, and leaving out XNS would be, in my opinion, silly. It's also rumored that someone in the Sun Consulting group is stuffing yet another XNS implementation into 4.2, so you might talk to your Sun sales rep (or whatever other appropriate warm body seems handy) about what if anything is being done in this area. Some Sun people have indicated (Usenix Sun BOF a month ago) that there isn't demand for XNS on Suns, but I seem to answer a lot of questions from people who want it... I have ported the whole of the 4.3BSD networking stuff (at the kernel level, at least, plus some user-level programs) into a Sun 3.0 kernel. I've had it more-or-less stable for a month now, but while I had hoped to put more time into it (enough to turn it into a product for everyone, not just wizards) it now appears that I just won't be able to come up with that time. I intend to do just a little more work on my stuff, then make it available somehow to the Internet community at large. I (and here I want to stress that "I" != "University of Maryland") am really rather distressed at the time it has taken and will take for Sun to get 4.3 networking into the hands of its customers. The 4.2 networking implementation is, as I think we will all admit, seriously deficient in some areas, and Sun hasn't corrected those deficiencies. I know that Sun has their reasons (involving a product that doesn't work under 4.3 networking), but I'd *love* to hear more details. Anyone out there care to comment? >2. Get TCP/IP for the Xerox machines. I have a (slightly > outdated) version of the "TCP/IP vendors and implementations > guide" but there is no mention of any Xerox hardware or > software in it. There has been TCP/IP support in Interlisp for a while now, but as I've never used it I don't know how good it is. Xerox has also done work recently to put a TCP/IP implementation into their XDE 5.0 release. We've been a test site for this stuff for a long time. The implementation is like many others in that it is good in some ways, and bad in others. It's certainly not going to work as a gateway without modification, but it does understand subnets and there's some stuff from ISI that lets it use the name server; that's more than a lot of other vendors do! I recall a comment somewhere to the effect that TCP/IP will make it into ViewPoint sometime around the 2.0 release. Hopefully, your Xerox vendor will have more information about when the different Xerox TCP/IP implementations will be available. >3. Get some sort of gateway/bridge which will do the conversion > between TCP/IP and XNS, possibly using different LAN's. > This seems to be a really ugly solution. Yes, probably, but maybe a good thesis for someone. >Mats Josefsson, ENEA DATA, Sweden > >UUCP: {seismo,mcvax,munnari,cernvax,diku,inria,prlb2,penet,ukc,unido}!enea!mats >Internet: mats@enea.se -- Spoken: Steve Miller ARPA: steve@mimsy.umd.edu Phone: +1-301-454-4251 CSNet: steve@mimsy.umd.edu UUCP: {seismo,allegra}!mimsy!steve USPS: Computer Science Dept., University of Maryland, College Park, MD 20742
mats@enea.UUCP (02/19/87)
First, I want to thank everyone that has responded to my query
on communication between Sun and Xerox workstations. From the
answers I've got this far the best solution seems to be a package
called XDE from Xerox. The latest release (5.0 of Feb -87)
supports TCP/IP. There are a few other options as well. If
anyone is interested in my findings, send me mail and I'll
summarize.
There seems to be some confusion about the name "Big Ben" which
I used in my query. As I understand it, "Big Ben" is a version
of (or a nickname for) the Xerox 6085 workstation. Maybe it's
just a local marketing name, I don't know. Anyway, I called
my local Xerox office asking for info on "Big Ben" and they
sent brochures describing the 6085.
--
Mats Josefsson, ENEA DATA, Sweden
UUCP: {seismo,mcvax,munnari,cernvax,diku,inria,prlb2,penet,ukc,unido}!enea!mats
Internet: mats@enea.senewbery@vuwcomp.UUCP (02/20/87)
In article <24944@rochester.ARPA> ken@rochester.UUCP (SKY) writes: ||innocent of reasons. Remember what Coca Cola means in Chinese, and why ||they changed it? :-) (I don't remember but it was pretty ikky...) | |Actually it wasn't "Coca Cola" but the slogan "Coke adds life" which |some inept translator rendered as "Coke brings your ancestors back from |the dead". I believe the phonetic transliteration of Coca Cola translates as "Bite the wax tadpole" ! See "The Wizard Masters of Peng-Shi Angle" by Frederik Pohl. -- Michael Newbery ACSnet: newbery@vuwcomp.nz UUCP: {ubc-vision,alberta}!calgary!vuwcomp!newbery Une boule qui roule tue les poules. (Landslides kill chickens)