hboswell@jackson.UUCP (Harry Boswell) (07/07/88)
Does anyone know of an editor available for unix that emulates the
ISPF/PDF editor of IBM mainframe-environment fame? We connect to
an MVS system and most programmers I can hire have worked only in that
environment (no unix here in the deepest South). Vi tends to be a shock
to them.
--
Harry Boswell (601) 354-6454 ext.352
{pyramid or bellcore or tness..}!swbatl!jackson!hboswell
Do not go gently into that good night, but rage against the dying of the light" Maynard) (07/07/88)
In article <272@jackson.UUCP> hboswell@jackson.UUCP (Harry Boswell) writes: >Does anyone know of an editor available for unix that emulates the >ISPF/PDF editor of IBM mainframe-environment fame? We connect to >an MVS system and most programmers I can hire have worked only in that >environment (no unix here in the deepest South). Vi tends to be a shock >to them. Me too! I spend all day, every day, in front of ISPF/PDF. Coming home to another editor is disconcerting, to say the least. I've gotten MicroEMACS, which is a distinct improvement over vi, but having the same thing on Unix as I use at work would be very nice. ...Jay -- Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC...>splut!< | Never ascribe to malice that which can uucp: uunet!nuchat! | adequately be explained by stupidity. hoptoad!academ!uhnix1!splut!jay +---------------------------------------- {killer,bellcore}!tness1! | Birthright Party '88: let's get spaced!
whh@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt) (07/13/88)
In article <574@splut.UUCP>, jay@splut.UUCP (Jay "you ignorant splut!" Maynard) writes: > In article <272@jackson.UUCP> hboswell@jackson.UUCP (Harry Boswell) writes: > >Does anyone know of an editor available for unix that emulates the > >ISPF/PDF editor of IBM mainframe-environment fame? We connect to > >an MVS system and most programmers I can hire have worked only in that > >environment (no unix here in the deepest South). Vi tends to be a shock > >to them. > > Me too! > I spend all day, every day, in front of ISPF/PDF. Coming home to another > editor is disconcerting, to say the least. I've gotten MicroEMACS, which > is a distinct improvement over vi, but having the same thing on Unix as > I use at work would be very nice. > ...Jay > I, too, spend all day in front of the ISPF editor. It's ghastly. Unfortunately there is not way (that I know of) to put a decent editor on a block-transfer terminal, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. If your new programmers can't learn new editors--you need a better grade of programmer. Before you write me off as some kid that learned vi in school and resents anything else, let me note that when I started programming you had to worry about the difference between an 024 keypunch and an 026. I was a student at Berkeley before UNIX existed. I currently have to keep track of 4 TSO, 1 VM, and 3 UNIX accounts--and that's just at work. So what's a couple of different editors among friends? --Hal ========================================================================= Hal Heydt | "Hafnium plus Holmium is Analyst, Pacific*Bell | one-point-five, I think." 415-645-7708 | --Dr. Jane Robinson {att,bellcore,sun,ames,pyramid}!pacbell!pbhya!whh
mark@lakesys.UUCP (Mark Storin) (07/13/88)
In article <16534@pbhya.PacBell.COM> whh@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt) writes: > >If your new programmers can't learn new editors--you need a better grade >of programmer. > What a novel idea ;-). Programmers should be flexible? >I currently have to keep track of 4 TSO, 1 VM, and 3 UNIX accounts--and >that's just at work. So what's a couple of different editors among >friends? > Editors are tools. Some tools are better for some things than others. You wouldn't expect much fun from trying a standard screwdriver on a philips head screw. In the spirit of the original question, students should learn as many editors as they are capable of learning. School is where you should be learning these things. You develop your capability to learn new instruction sets. Adds flexibility to your thinking. Improves concentration, etc. Preferences? Everybody has preferences. -- Mark A. Storin Lake Systems, Milw., WI UUCP: {ihnp4,uwvax}!uwmcsd1!lakesys!mark
zjat02@apctrc.UUCP (Jon A. Tankersley) (07/14/88)
The IBM'ers of the UNIX world need to unite and press Mansfield Software or other vendors to port Kedit and Rexx to UNIX. I am not sure that IBM would be able to do it, they'd probably come out with YAE (yet another editor). Maybe TSO edit, CMS Edit or Edgar. :-)... Kedit/Xedit with Rexx would be a big win for the RT and the PS/2 systems. But what do I know, I'm only a UNIX systems administrator. As always, the usual disclaimer. -tank-
whh@pbhya.PacBell.COM (Wilson Heydt) (07/16/88)
In article <814@lakesys.UUCP>, mark@lakesys.UUCP (Mark Storin) writes: > Editors are tools. Some tools are better for some things than others. > You wouldn't expect much fun from trying a standard screwdriver on a philips > head screw. In the spirit of the original question, students should learn as > many editors as they are capable of learning. School is where you should be > learning these things. You develop your capability to learn new instruction > sets. Adds flexibility to your thinking. Improves concentration, etc. > > Preferences? Everybody has preferences. You bet. Possibly we also need a better grade of student. I'm been slowly coming to the conclusion that there is so much that REALLY NEEDS to be understood to have complete education (see the the debate about requirements out of Stanford a few months ago) that College undergraduate curricula should be considered to be 5 years rather than 4. You want flexibility? When I was a student, the beginning CS course taught Algol in 9 weeks. The corresponding EECS course did FORTRAN and Algol in the same time. I suspect the real reason for hiring marginal programmers is because the demand for anyone who can code exceeds the supply of those whose talents run in that direction. Companies are reaching farther and farther down the talent pool and coming up with some piss-poor examples. All this is complicated by the "title inflation" that took place during Nixon's wage-price freeze. At that time, people got title promotions for doing the same work in order to be paid more. coders became programmers and programmers became programmer-analysts or systems analysts. Now, "coder" is never used. Pity, one sees so many analysts (who used to be 'programmers') that can't write competent code or debug without elaborate help. [Help! Stop me before I tell more 'good old days' stories!] --Hal ========================================================================= Hal Heydt | "Hafnium plus Holmium is Analyst, Pacific*Bell | one-point-five, I think." 415-645-7708 | --Dr. Jane Robinson {att,bellcore,sun,ames,pyramid}!pacbell!pbhya!whh
" Maynard) (07/16/88)
In article <479@apctrc.UUCP> zjat02@apctrc.UUCP (Jon A. Tankersley) writes: >The IBM'ers of the UNIX world need to unite and press Mansfield Software or >other vendors to port Kedit and Rexx to UNIX. Yuk. Pooey. Bleh. :-P I want ISPF, not XEDIT. Maybe it's because I've been using ISPF for 6 years, and only used XEDIT at one job, and then only until I could figure out how to use ISPF under VM. Now, I might call Command Technology Corporation... To the poster who suggested that real programmers can learn any editor: I'm writing this right now under microEMACS. I *can* use it and vi under Unix. The point is, though, that I don't *want* to. I want ISPF. I may have to write it, though, to get it... -- Jay Maynard, EMT-P, K5ZC...>splut!< | Never ascribe to malice that which can uucp: uunet!nuchat! | adequately be explained by stupidity. hoptoad!academ!uhnix1!splut!jay +---------------------------------------- {killer,bellcore}!tness1! | Birthright Party '88: let's get spaced!