markv@gauss.Princeton.EDU (Mark VandeWettering) (12/05/89)
I am posting the first issue of the scientific visualization newsletter to comp.graphics and sci.math.num-analysis, as these seem to be the most appropriate groups. If you would wish to join this group, send mail to sci-vi-request@acm.princeton.edu, and include a short description of your interests. Due to an mbox failure, I know that several people who sent me mail didn't get added to this list. The current list members are at the bottom of the message, if you still want to be on this list, and do not appear, send me mail again (teaches me to play with mail while logged in as myself). If there is sufficient response, I will try to get another issue out before I leave for my Christmas break. Mark VandeWettering (markv@acm.princeton.edu) Current members are ----- subramn@cs.utexas.edu Ping.Kang.Hsiung@cs.cmu.edu mccalpin@masig3.ocean.fsu.edu mwood@emx.utexas.edu joel@uf.msc.umn.edu annala%neuro.usc.edu@usc.edu spl@ncsc.org davis@unidata.UCAR.EDU munnari!cidam.me.rmit.oz.au!mg@uunet.UU.NET pgf@space.mit.edu kis@beach.cis.ufl.edu posdamer@jvncf.csc.org anderson@hobbes.osgp.osc.edu jd21@prism.gatech.edu sunpix!nick@East.Sun.COM hplabsb!drukarev@hplabs.hp.com sbc@wucs1.wustl.edu radius!pierce@apple.com -----
thomson@cs.utah.edu (Rich Thomson) (12/06/89)
In article <11938@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> markv@gauss.Princeton.EDU () writes: >I am posting the first issue of the scientific visualization newsletter >to comp.graphics and sci.math.num-analysis, as these seem to be the most >appropriate groups. If you would wish to join this group, send mail >to sci-vi-request@acm.princeton.edu, and include a short description of >your interests. I fail to see why you are creating a new newsletter when this topic is already covered in the comp-vis mailing list. If you wish to assimilate all of comp-vis' subscribers, you are welcome to it, but two mailing lists covering the same topic is not productive. We just talked about this in comp.graphics a few weeks ago. Someone (perhaps yourself) suggested starting a sci-vis mailing list and I pointed out that a mailing list covering this topic already exists (comp-vis), although it attempts to cover the general area of computer visualization as opposed to scientific visualization only (i.e. animation of algorithms is appropriate for comp-vis, but probably not for sci-vis). The suggestion was made that perhaps comp-vis' charter was too broad to be of interest to those interested in sci-vis, but I don't see this being really any different than the "broadness" of comp.graphics which still sees discussion of vis. issues. If you wish to fold your newsletter into comp-vis and desire a restatement of the charter to focus more on sci-vis, that is fine as well. There's no point in duplicating mailing lists, though. -- Rich Rich Thomson thomson@cs.utah.edu {bellcore,hplabs,uunet}!utah-cs!thomson "Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly." Thomas Paine, _The Crisis_, Dec. 23rd, 1776
markv@gauss.Princeton.EDU (Mark VandeWettering) (12/06/89)
In article <1989Dec5.140743.13739@hellgate.utah.edu> thomson@cs.utah.edu (Rich Thomson) writes: >I fail to see why you are creating a new newsletter when this topic is >already covered in the comp-vis mailing list. If you wish to assimilate >all of comp-vis' subscribers, you are welcome to it, but two mailing lists >covering the same topic is not productive. We just talked about this in >comp.graphics a few weeks ago. Someone (perhaps yourself) suggested >starting a sci-vis mailing list and I pointed out that a mailing list >covering this topic already exists (comp-vis), although it attempts to >cover the general area of computer visualization as opposed to scientific >visualization only (i.e. animation of algorithms is appropriate for >comp-vis, but probably not for sci-vis). Indeed, and I suppose that I should justify the creation of sci-vis news. 1. Most of the initial people who had expressed an interest had never heard of the comp-vis mailing list. I never had, and sometimes I think I live for news and email. For whatever reason, the existance of such a mailing list seems to be a fact which is not well known. I intend to post copies of the mailing list to newsgroups which have an interest (the moderator of comp.parallel has already expressed an interest, which is fine with me, since I love to talk about parallelism) mainly to boost membership. 2. I have certain specific goals: o creation of a sci-vi bibliography o ftp archive of software that may be redistributed o tell people of upcoming conferences that may be interesting o foster discussion of sci-vi topics including hopefully meaningful discussions of programming techniques o allow researchers who need scientific visualziation tools to meet other people who might have similar interests. I have requested that new members jot down a quick bibliography of their interests and work, and many have complied. Hopefully this will allow people with similar interests to get together and discuss items of interest. Hopefully, they will even detail their discussions back to the newsgroup. Look for these bibliographies in an upcoming (preChristmas) version of the newsletter. 3. If indeed this newsgroup is doomed by lack of participation, I hope to have proved several things. 1. it was not from lack of advertising. 2. it isn't from lack of interest. I think that 2 has already been proved, I have nearly 100 people on this list, and it was announced only several days ago. The only way that this newsletter could die is if people refuse to participate. If I do all of the work, then this newsletter is dead.
thomson@cs.utah.edu (Rich Thomson) (12/08/89)
Mark,
You seemed to have missed my point.
In article <11980@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> markv@gauss.Princeton.EDU
(Mark VandeWettering) writes:
>In article <1989Dec5.140743.13739@hellgate.utah.edu> I wrote:
>>I fail to see why you are creating a new newsletter when this topic is
>>already covered in the comp-vis mailing list. If you wish to assimilate
>>all of comp-vis' subscribers, you are welcome to it, but two mailing lists
>>covering the same topic is not productive.
>Indeed, and I suppose that I should justify the creation of sci-vis news.
I don't really care whether you create it or not; it is simply pointless to
have two mailing lists on the same subject. If you want to fold in
comp-vis into your newsletter, fine. Just make a decision! Currently
there about 250 lurkers on my mailing list (and every note on comp.graphics
about the subject adds a few more).
>1. Most of the initial people who had expressed an interest had never
> heard of the comp-vis mailing list.
Well, it is posted in news.lists every couple of weeks, right along with
all the other mailing lists. As far as I know, this is the only standard
way of letting people know such a mailing lists exists. I don't bother to
post announcements of its formation to comp.graphics, since a) there hasn't
been any submitted material for over a year, and b) when I formed the mailing
list over a year ago, I posted an announcement to comp.graphics.
> For whatever reason, the existance
> of such a mailing list seems to be a fact which is not well known.
Well, it is certainly known since you've been making noises about starting
another list!
>2. I have certain specific goals:
> o creation of a sci-vi bibliography
> o ftp archive of software that may be redistributed
> o tell people of upcoming conferences that may be
> interesting
> o foster discussion of sci-vi topics including hopefully
> meaningful discussions of programming techniques
> o allow researchers who need scientific visualziation
> tools to meet other people who might have similar
> interests.
All of those are fine goals, and nearly the same goals I had when forming
comp-vis.
> I have requested that new members jot down a quick bibliography of
> their interests and work, and many have complied.
A good idea.
>3. If indeed this newsgroup is doomed by lack of participation, I hope
> to have proved several things.
> 1. it was not from lack of advertising.
> 2. it isn't from lack of interest.
I encourage you to advertise until people tell you to shut up, but I think
you will find that there will be many people interested in reading but few
with anything to say. Perhaps your idea of bibliographies will get people
talking. I hope so.
But, you seemed to have missed my whole point. If you are so enthusiastic
about starting a sci-vis list, why not just fold the two lists into one
instead of forcing people to subscribe to both lists? As I said in my last
message, if you wish comp-vis to mutate into something that is more attuned
to sci-vis, then fine. But I still think its a stupid idea to have two
mailing lists that are nearly identical.
-- Rich
Rich Thomson thomson@cs.utah.edu {bellcore,hplabs,uunet}!utah-cs!thomson
"Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with
us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain
too cheap, we esteem too lightly." Thomas Paine, _The Crisis_, Dec. 23rd, 1776