bellas@ttidcb.UUCP (Pete Bellas) (05/10/85)
>1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate)
A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe
needs this then there is something wrong with it.
-Pete-eac@drutx.UUCP (CveticEA) (05/13/85)
>>1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) >A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe >needs this then there is something wrong with it. I don't know about cancer, but I can vouch for the headaches and dizzyness sometimes known as Chinese Restaurant Syndrome. Do avoid the MSG--it really doesn't enhance the food flavor enough to be worth it. Betsy Cvetic ihnp4!drutx!eac
jeffw@tekecs.UUCP (Jeff Winslow) (05/14/85)
> > > >1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) > > A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe > needs this then there is something wrong with it. > I eat Chinese food all the time, and I understand it generally has a fair amount of MSG in it. I suffer neither from headaches or dizziness. Therefore I can only assume your statement, as made, is a crock. MSG may increase the risk of those conditions in some people, but to say it "insures" them is ridiculous. Jeff Winslow
lindis@ames.UUCP (Lindis Daly) (05/14/85)
> > > >1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) > > A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe > needs this then there is something wrong with it. > > -Pete- * lslslslsllsls help
seifert@hammer.UUCP (Snoopy) (05/15/85)
In article <5319@tekecs.UUCP> jeffw@tekecs.UUCP (Jeff Winslow) writes: >> >1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) >> >> A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe >> needs this then there is something wrong with it. >> >I eat Chinese food all the time, and I understand it generally has a fair >amount of MSG in it. I suffer neither from headaches or dizziness. Therefore >I can only assume your statement, as made, is a crock. "Insure" is probably too strong a word. However, you shouldn't assume that all Chinese food is loaded with MSG. It is most likely the Americanised stuff that is full of MSG, and sugar, and all that crap that "improves" the flavor. <cough> I doubt that you will find much in *authentic* Chinese food. Snoopy
jerem@tekgvs.UUCP (Jere Marrs) (05/15/85)
MSG is indeed used in Chinese restaurants as well as Thai, Korean, and many other nonoriental restaurants. MSG is a flavor enhancer for use with proteinaceous foods (mainly meat stocks and sauces) and it works quite well for its intended purpose. However, for those of us who are allergic to it, it is, in no way, a `crock` that it causes problems. For me, it creates an excrutiating headache and dizziness that lasts about two days. I go to extremes to avoid eating food containing it. There is a sunstantial fraction of eating people who have reactions to it that go beyond my particluar one. Most good oriental restaurants will prepare food without using MSG and are only too glad to do so. Some restaurants lie about using it and cause me great pain. I enjoy travelling in Canada because it is not used there in restaurant food (against the law, I guess) and I seem to be free of the scourge when eating there (true in Alberta, at least). Nutrasweet(R) causes a very similar reaction for me and I have yet another substance to look for in food. I know, from my own cooking, that one can enhance the flavor of broths and wine sauces with the judicious use of drops of lemon juice. It requires careful application and tasting to optimize it, but the reward is great. I hope MSG disappears someday. Jere M. Marrs Tektronix, Inc. Beaverton, Oregon tektronix!tekgvs!jerem
eac@drutx.UUCP (CveticEA) (05/16/85)
>>> A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe >>> needs this then there is something wrong with it. >>> >>I eat Chinese food all the time, and I understand it generally has a fair >>amount of MSG in it. I suffer neither from headaches or dizziness. Therefore >>I can only assume your statement, as made, is a crock. Not EVERYONE is affected by MSG, just like not everyone is allergic to dogs. If you are serving a large group, and you don't know for sure, your MSG sensitive guests will appreciate it if you don't use it. By the way, I'm not sure that this is a small number of people. Everyone in my family is sensitive to it to one degree or another. And how come it is now popular for Chinese restaurants in San Francisco's China town to advertise no MSG? In general they use it so they can make a large quantity of something with veggies in it ahead of time, and the veggies won't get soggy. I don't think it does much for flavor. Public pressure is the reason some of the restaurants avoid it. However, most brands of soy sauce are loaded with it. So please don't think that because it doesn't affect you its a crock. That's like the dentist telling me it isn't going to hurt, when I'm the expert on that, not the dentist! Betsy Cvetic ihnp4!drutx!eac
jcp@osiris.UUCP (Jody Patilla) (05/17/85)
> > >1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) > > > > A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe > > needs this then there is something wrong with it. > > > I eat Chinese food all the time, and I understand it generally has a fair > amount of MSG in it. I suffer neither from headaches or dizziness. Therefore > I can only assume your statement, as made, is a crock. > MSG may increase the risk of those conditions in some people, but to say it > "insures" them is ridiculous. > Jeff Winslow Some individuals are in fact very sensitive to MSG. A friend of mine turns all red and puffs up with hives whenever he eats Chinese food. It probably isn't very good for a person in general, but then neither is salt, and I eat LOTS of salt (i also have very low blood pressure). -- jcpatilla "'Fancy thinking the Beast was something you could hunt and kill !'"
jcp@osiris.UUCP (Jody Patilla) (05/17/85)
> > "Insure" is probably too strong a word. However, you shouldn't assume > that all Chinese food is loaded with MSG. It is most likely the > Americanised stuff that is full of MSG, and sugar, and all that crap > that "improves" the flavor. <cough> I doubt that you will find much > in *authentic* Chinese food. > > Snoopy I wonder about this simply because every Oriental grocery I've ever been in sells MSG in one and five POUND bags. *Somebody* must be using a helluva lot of the stuff. -- jcpatilla "'Fancy thinking the Beast was something you could hunt and kill !'"
seb@mtgzz.UUCP (s.e.badian) (05/17/85)
REFERENCES: <1262@hammer.UUCP>, <2784@drutx.UUCP> MSG is usually used in chinese foods to bring out the flavor of things, particularly meat. One problem I have with MSG is that it emphasizes some flavors while masking others. In many recipes, this is not what you want, especially if you're dealing with delicately flavored foods. And a Chinese restaurant that is worth eating at doesn't use MSG. If they did, a lot of dishes would start tasting alike. I don't know that I'm sensitive to MSG, but I can usually tell when it's used to cover less than wonderful cooking. One of the best Chinese restaurants I've ever eaten out comes right out and says they never use MSG since it changes the way food tastes. (That's Chef Chu's in Mountainview, CA. His cookbook is exceptional also.) Sharon Badian ihnp4!mtgzz!seb
john@x.UUCP (John Woods) (05/20/85)
>>> A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe >>> needs this then there is something wrong with it. >>I eat Chinese food all the time, and I understand it generally has a fair >>amount of MSG in it. I suffer neither from headaches or dizziness. Therefore > >I can only assume your statement, as made, is a crock. > "Insure" is probably too strong a word. However, you shouldn't assume > that all Chinese food is loaded with MSG. It is most likely the > Americanised stuff that is full of MSG, and sugar, and all that crap > that "improves" the flavor. <cough> I doubt that you will find much > in *authentic* Chinese food. "Insure" is too strong a word, but the link (in many people) with headaches and dizzyness is considered a medical fact. [I happen to be so affected] Many people aren't as easily affected, but if you personally believe that it does not happen, try downing 3 tablespoons of it all at once. According to my Joyce Chen cookbook, MSG was imported to China from Japan about 400 years ago, and is not used much at all there. Here, though, it is the panacea for bland, overcooked food (go to your local grocery store and look at the canned soups...). -- John Woods, Charles River Data Systems, Framingham MA, (617) 626-1101 ...!decvax!frog!john, ...!mit-eddie!jfw, jfw%mit-ccc@MIT-XX.ARPA "MU" said the Sacred Chao...
mgh@mtunh.UUCP (Marcus Hand) (05/21/85)
>>1 tsp Accent* (monosodium glutamate) > >A good way to insure headaches, dizzyness and cancer. If your recipe >needs this then there is something wrong with it. > > -Pete- I'v heard of headaches and dizziness, although the symptoms for me are very tired upper arms and sometimes a tightness across the chest -- but only from an excess of this protein. But, cancer? Any references for the carcinogenic effects of MSG? -- Marcus Hand (mtunh!mgh)
donn@hp-dcd.UUCP (donn) (05/21/85)
Just as a calibration point Aji-no-Moto (a Japanese brand of MSG) is normally sold in VERY large quantities (5 pound tins!). My experience is Hawaii, not Japan, but it is a Japanese brand and it has always been my impression that is it was also the case in Japan. (Large tins are considered significant gifts for major occasions.) This tends to confirm that it's normally used in the Orient in large quantities. My understanding is that "Aji-no-Moto" means "the essence of flavor". I still refer to it/think of it as "Aji" even if it is Durkee's. Maybe MSG syndrome is the analog to lactose intolerance that people of European stock must suffer :-) ! Donn
reiher@ucla-cs.UUCP (05/22/85)
In article <1262@hammer.UUCP> seifert@hammer.UUCP (Snoopy) writes: >However, you shouldn't assume >that all Chinese food is loaded with MSG. It is most likely the >Americanised stuff that is full of MSG, and sugar, and all that crap >that "improves" the flavor. <cough> I doubt that you will find much >in *authentic* Chinese food. According to Irene Kuo's "Key to Chinese Cooking" (an excellent cookbook, by the way), MSG *is* an authentically Chinese ingredient. The form used in China isn't the same as is used here, Kuo says, and she advises against using even the Chinese form, but they throw handfulls of it into food with abandon in China, or did when she lived there. They also use questionable substances to get various deep food colorings, and I think that the Chinese make wide use of sugar as a seasoning in their foods. Chinese food is not necessarily good for you, even when authentic. It tastes so good that I don't much care, though. -- Peter Reiher reiher@ucla-cs.arpa soon to be reiher@LOCUS.UCLA.EDA {...ihnp4,ucbvax,sdcrdcf}!ucla-cs!reiher
billw@Navajo.ARPA (05/24/85)
> > Americanised stuff that is full of MSG, and sugar, and all that crap > > that "improves" the flavor. <cough> I doubt that you will find much > > in *authentic* Chinese food. > > > > I wonder about this simply because every Oriental grocery I've > ever been in sells MSG in one and five POUND bags. *Somebody* must be > using a helluva lot of the stuff. It's not true. MSG is heavilly used is "authentic" chinese cooking. It is probably only in the US that MSG-free chinese food is trendy - I suspect that CRS is rather like not being able to digest milk - if you've been fed MSG in your food since you were little, it won't bother you at all. A paragraph in a chinese cook book (by a chinese person) said something to the effect of "None of the recipes in this book call for MSG,since so many americans seem to react badly to it, and when using only the freshest ingredients it is not really necessary. However, in China, you would not be thought trendy or healthy if you did not use MSG in your cooking, you would merely be thought strange." BillW
ellen@ucla-cs.UUCP (05/28/85)
I don't think that I'm particularly sensitive to MSG, 'tho' on occasion,
I feel rather unpleasantly light-headed after a Chinese meal. My SO, on the
other hand, is quite sensitive, and gets terrible headaches, so can this
"is a crock" crap. In fact, the number of people sensitive to MSG is not
minute, 'tho' naturally degree of sensitivity varies.
Having lived for almost two years in Indonesia, I can say that MSG is used
there, along with a variety of food additives which are known health hazards,
because the government doesn't care and the people are not educated well,
especially in this area. Because it is a Third World country, the people
look to chemicals as a way of becoming more modern ("Better Living Through
Chemistry"), so food is often FLUORESCENT in color (no, I am NOT exaggerating),
soda pop smells like the deodorant used in ladies' johns (I am less experienced
with men's johns) (that disgusting "cherry-strawberry" smell), and
various brands of MSG are advertised on TV by famous stars. i believe the
government has banned advertising on TV since i was there, because is was
developing unrealistic expectations in the people. the country has an annual
average income of somewhere around $500. yes, $500 annually, and i guess that
millionaires are included in the average. if you are upper middle class
(and the middle class is about as large as the upper class), you might own a
Vespa (what luxury!) so that Dad, Mom, and several of the kids (families
average 5-7 children) can go out for a ride (yes, all at once on the Vespa).
I discovered previously unknown food allergies to artificial flavorings,
while i was there (when they didn't use the flavored, but uncolored syrup in
the fruit drink, i had no reaction). and in this country, i see packages of
MSG sold in the Thai markets in Thai lettered packages. This may be a recent
phenomenon, but it is common.
Another common allergy, which is often LIFE-THREATENING, is to bisulfiting
agents. This was described on 60 Minutes about 2 years ago. The allergy
causes loss of breath, constriction of the chest, an asthma-like attack,and
has caused death. Bisulfites are used to keep fruits and vegetables from
turning brown after being cut. The food is then dipped in a solution of
bisulfites and water, as soon as it is cut. This is common in restaurants,
where they are cut long before cooking, and sit around all day in little
metal trays wilting. Ah! but with the miracle of chemistry, they won't LOOK
wilted. However, bisulfites are common in frozen and canned foods, especially
prepared potatoes. They are listed on the label of packaged foods, but
restaurants do not let the customers know that bisulfites are being used.
In fact, because these chemicals are sold under a variety of brand names to
restaurants, the employees often do not even know what they are using, and
if you ask them, they will say that they are not used, even when they are!
In Germany, the artificial colors & flavors, and other chemical additives
are listed RIGHT ON THE MENU in restaurants!! (At least they were 10 years
ago when i was there). Seems like a good idea to me. Most people know
what their food allergies are and can be selective, but chemical allergies
are trickier and just as unpleasant.
Bon Appetit!reiher@ucla-cs.UUCP (05/31/85)
In article <154@Navajo.ARPA> billw@Navajo.ARPA writes: > > >It's not true. MSG is heavilly used is "authentic" chinese cooking. >"... >However, in China, you would not be thought trendy or healthy if you >did not use MSG in your cooking, you would merely be thought strange." I took a closer look at the Chinese cookbook I mentioned earlier. According to Irene Kuo, gourmet Chinese cooking doesn't use MSG, relying instead on large quantities of fresh ingredients. Normal Chinese cooking uses MSG to help cover up inferior ingredients. I've been told that, by and large, US fruits, vegetables, and meats are superior to those available in Asia, and in Europe, for that matter, so there may be no need for the flavour enhancement of MSG in most Chinese cooking done in the US. -- Peter Reiher reiher@ucla-cs.arpa soon to be reiher@LOCUS.UCLA.EDU {...ihnp4,ucbvax,sdcrdcf}!ucla-cs!reiher
figmo@tymix.UUCP (Lynn Gold) (06/05/85)
> It's not true. MSG is heavilly used is "authentic" chinese cooking. > It is probably only in the US that MSG-free chinese food is trendy - I > suspect that CRS is rather like not being able to digest milk - if > you've been fed MSG in your food since you were little, it won't bother > you at all. A paragraph in a chinese cook book (by a chinese person) > said something to the effect of "None of the recipes in this book call > for MSG,since so many americans seem to react badly to it, and when > using only the freshest ingredients it is not really necessary. > However, in China, you would not be thought trendy or healthy if you > did not use MSG in your cooking, you would merely be thought strange." > > BillW Offhand, I'd like to hear from some of the Chinese people who read this list (where are you?????). My guess is that the use of MSG is as regional within China as the different types of US cuisine are, just based on what I've heard and seen from people. The Chinese people I've discussed the subject with say they don't use MSG, but often put it on dishes for Americans. --Lynn
rzdz@fluke.UUCP (Rick Chinn) (06/10/85)
> > Offhand, I'd like to hear from some of the Chinese people who read this > list (where are you?????). My guess is that the use of MSG is as regional > within China as the different types of US cuisine are, just based on what > I've heard and seen from people. The Chinese people I've discussed the > subject with say they don't use MSG, but often put it on dishes for > Americans. > > --Lynn My mother uses trace amounts of MSG in her cooking. Her reasoning is that it gives flavors a boost, makes good things better. Myself, I have some around, but don't use it. I suspect that many Chinese restaurants are guilty of "Americanitis" (my term)...if a little bit is good, then *lots* must be better. Myself, I've never been bothered by CRS (and I've eaten in my share of them). Seems to me that you can request no MSG in any reputable restaurant although it's hard to avoid it in most prepared foods. Oddly, as long as I can remember, the MSG that we bought was Accent brand, which is Japanese in origin. Rick Chinn John Fluke Mfg. Co MS 232E PO Box C9090 Everett WA 98206 {ihnp4!uw-beaver, ucbvax!lbl-csam, microsoft, allegra, ssc-vax}!fluke!rzdz (206) 356-5232 <--------------- menus != user friendly programs ------------------------->