mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) (11/29/88)
Here are a couple of questions about HP tape drives. We have an HP 9000 series 350 system running HP-UX 6.2 with an HP 9144A tape drive. Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? I have tried to use (non-HP) unformatted tapes in this drive but it just went into spasms and locked up totally refusing to use these tapes (which are in every way identical to HP's except that they are not pre-formatted). Question 2) If it is not possible, then does anybody know if other companies than HP make these pre-formatted tapes? We found that at twice the price of the other tapes out there, HP prices were a little excessive. :-) Thanks in advance for any help, Pierre Mathieu mathieu@ists.yorku.ca Institute for Space and Terrestrial Science mathieu@yunexus.yorku.ca Center for Research in Exp. Space Science York University, Ontario, Canada.
mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) (12/01/88)
<274@istsists.ca>, by mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu): > Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that > are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? Not that I know of; in fact, if you write onto a pre-formatted tape from a non-HP drive (e.g., a Sun) you destroy the formatted track(s?) and can no longer use the tape in the HP drive. > Question 2) If it is not possible, then does anybody know if other > companies than HP make these pre-formatted tapes? We 3M makes them. They are DC600HC tapes. Mike Khaw -- internet: mkhaw@teknowledge.arpa uucp: {uunet|sun|ucbvax|decwrl|ames|hplabs}!mkhaw%teknowledge.arpa hardcopy: Teknowledge Inc, 1850 Embarcadero Rd, POB 10119, Palo Alto, CA 94303
hmc@hwee.UUCP (Hugh Conner) (12/01/88)
In article <274@istsists.ca> mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) writes: > > Here are a couple of questions about HP tape drives. >We have an HP 9000 series 350 system running HP-UX 6.2 >with an HP 9144A tape drive. > As far as I know you cannot use un-formatted tapes, as most of these are wound on in the opposite direction to the HP tapes. However, in the UK anyway, you can use 3M tapes models DC600HC and DC615HC. I assume these should be available in Canada as well. The DC600HC is 600ft and the 615 is only 150ft. -- + "Who are all these people in my office anyway?" + + + + Hugh M. Conner hmc@ee.hw.ac.uk +
burzio@mmlai.UUCP (Anthony Burzio) (12/01/88)
In article <274@istsists.ca>, mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) writes: > Here are a couple of questions about HP tape drives. > Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that > are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? Not possible. HP uses a backwards file system. > Question 2) If it is not possible, then does anybody know if other > companies than HP make these pre-formatted tapes? Try MISCO at (800)631-2227 and ask for part number 6319. For small quantities, the price is $30.19 per tape. They also have a very nice cartridge organizer to hold 10 of the tapes neatly ($11.65 part #LF6324)... I got overnight delivery of the tapes. ************************************************************************** Tony Burzio * My HP computer is too fast. I can't use my Martin Marietta Labs * VAXen any more cause I'm spoiled... **************************************************************************
scf@statware.UUCP (Steve Fullerton) (12/02/88)
In article <26007@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA> mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) writes: >> Question 2) If it is not possible, then does anybody know if other >> companies than HP make these pre-formatted tapes? We > >3M makes them. They are DC600HC tapes. I used to purchase the 3M DC600HC tapes for use on a HP9144 on an HP1000 and while they are pre-formatted, they are not certified. For a 150 ft tape it required about 15 minutes to certify and an hour for 600 ft tapes. During the certification process, the system would be completely locked up and unusable. I'm not sure if HP-UX requires certified tapes or not. And if so, what program would be used to certify them. I believe that `certified' means that a bad block scan is done and spares are created. This is necessary since HP also treats these tapes as blocked media suitable for file systems. We now have 2 cartridge tape drives and a 9-track drive and ONLY use the cartridge drives to build recovery systems. Used 1600 bpi 9-track drives for HP systems are cheap so if you do a lot of tape handling it might be worth it for you. -- Steve Fullerton Statware, Inc. scf%statware.uucp@cs.orst.edu 260 SW Madison Ave, Suite 109 orstcs!statware!scf Corvallis, OR 97333 503/753-5382
neil@yc.estec.nl (Neil Dixon) (12/02/88)
In article <274@istsists.ca> mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) writes: > >Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that > are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? Try using mediainit(1) -- Neil Dixon <neil@yc.estec.nl> UUCP:...!mcvax!esatst!neil, BITNET: NDIXON@ESTEC Thermal Control & Life Support Division (YC) European Space Research and Technology Centre (ESTEC), Noordwijk, The Netherlands.
mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) (12/03/88)
<1074@statware.UUCP>, by scf@statware.UUCP (Steve Fullerton):
- In article <26007@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA> mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) writes:
->> Question 2) If it is not possible, then does anybody know if other
->> companies than HP make these pre-formatted tapes? We
->
->3M makes them. They are DC600HC tapes.
-
- I used to purchase the 3M DC600HC tapes for use on a HP9144 on an HP1000
- and while they are pre-formatted, they are not certified. For a 150 ft
- tape it required about 15 minutes to certify and an hour for 600 ft tapes.
- During the certification process, the system would be completely locked
- up and unusable. I'm not sure if HP-UX requires certified tapes or
- not. And if so, what program would be used to certify them. I believe
Not a problem with HP-UX. I remember the hassles with using non HP tapes
on HP-1000s. When HP first came out with these drives, it might have made
sense to go with these "high-density" tape cartridges, but I wish they'd
join the rest of the world now and make life simpler for those of us with
heterogeneous (Unix) hardware.
Mike Khaw
--
internet: mkhaw@teknowledge.arpa
uucp: {uunet|sun|ucbvax|decwrl|ames|hplabs}!mkhaw%teknowledge.arpa
hardcopy: Teknowledge Inc, 1850 Embarcadero Rd, POB 10119, Palo Alto, CA 94303vic@zen.UUCP (Victor Gavin) (12/03/88)
In article <469@mmlai.UUCP> burzio@mmlai.UUCP (Anthony Burzio) writes: >In article <274@istsists.ca>, mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) writes: >> Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that >> are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? >Not possible. HP uses a backwards file system. Pardon! I'm sorry but HP uses the same file system as Berkely (HP call it HFS). If your referring to the ancient SDF (Structured Directory Format); this was implemented on the HP9000 series 500 (RIP) to allow access between HP-UX and BASIC file systems on the same disk. vic -- Victor Gavin Zengrange Limited vic@zen.co.uk Greenfield Road ..!mcvax!ukc!zen.co.uk!vic Leeds LS9 8DB +44 532 489048 England
bill@iccdev.UUCP (Bill Gaines) (12/04/88)
In article <274@istsists.ca> mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu) writes: > > Here are a couple of questions about HP tape drives. >We have an HP 9000 series 350 system running HP-UX 6.2 >with an HP 9144A tape drive. > >Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that > are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? > I have tried to use (non-HP) unformatted tapes > in this drive but it just went into spasms and locked > up totally refusing to use these tapes (which are > in every way identical to HP's except that they are not > pre-formatted). > Yes it is. We never buy the tapes from HP. We buy 3M DC615HC and DC600HC tapes and certify them ourselves. I haven't tried it on a 300 series, but our 800 series has a program called "mediainit" that will certify these tapes that have not been certified. Buy doing it ourselves, it saves us about $15 per tape we buy. If you don't run mediainit on these tapes, you will not be able to use them. We buy ours from a place called COMTEL. I don't have their phone number or address handy. By the way, if you have an HP 1000, you can use the "formc" program to certify them on it. -- Bill Gaines Industrial Computer Corporation (...!gatech!iccdev!bill)
diblanch@sdrc.UUCP (Jeff Blanchet) (12/06/88)
Someone mentioned that you can buy tapes from 3M that are not certified. What I want to know is how much do these "uncertified" tapes cost and how long it take to certify them. I read that you can certify them by running mediainit. Does this format the tape or does this just write some header information on the tape? We duplicate alot of HP media and any response would be appreciated. Jeff Blanchet UUCP: uunet!sdrc!diblanch SDRC Cincinnati Ohio
jack@csccat.UUCP (Jack Hudler) (12/06/88)
In article <1074@statware.UUCP> scf@statware.UUCP (Steve Fullerton) writes: >I used to purchase the 3M DC600HC tapes for use on a HP9144 on an HP1000 >and while they are pre-formatted, they are not certified. For a 150 ft >tape it required about 15 minutes to certify and an hour for 600 ft tapes. >During the certification process, the system would be completely locked >up and unusable. I am not sure what 9000 box you are using but if you place an additional HPIB card and place the tape drive on it then the lock up would not occur. I have a 320 and the printer,plotter,floppys, and tape drive are all on the internal HP-IB and the mounted drives are on the High-Speed HPIB bus. Anyway you may know this but I just thought I would pass it along. Jack Hudler -- * OS2, what DOS should have been!
maddog@anuck.UUCP (j.j.tupper) (12/06/88)
In article <433@iccdev.UUCP> bill@iccdev.UUCP (Bill Gaines) writes: >Yes it is. We never buy the tapes from HP. We buy 3M DC615HC and >DC600HC tapes and certify them ourselves. I haven't tried it on a 300 >series, but our 800 series has a program called "mediainit" that will >certify these tapes that have not been certified. Buy doing it >ourselves, it saves us about $15 per tape we buy. If you don't run >mediainit on these tapes, you will not be able to use them. We use the 3M tapes (DC-600HC) in 2 9144 drives and a 35401 autochanger. We don't ever bother running mediainit and have no problems. I think this is because the later models of HP drives (like ours) do auto sparing of bad blocks on the fly. [I *know* that ours has a read while write head to check for errors as it writes, unlike earlier tape drives.] -------------------------------------------------------- sdflkjreo vdklfj (my real signature is illegible too)
sfr@praxis.co.uk (Stephen Rickaby) (12/06/88)
In article <26007@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA> mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) writes: ><274@istsists.ca>, by mathieu@ists.yorku.ca (Pierre Mathieu): >> Question 1) Is it possible to load tapes into this drive that >> are not pre-formatted and format them from HP-UX? > >Not that I know of; in fact, if you write onto a pre-formatted tape >from a non-HP drive (e.g., a Sun) you destroy the formatted track(s?) >and can no longer use the tape in the HP drive. Can't remember which HP drives you are talking about, but I once loaded a DC600 which had been bulk erased into a 7914 on an A900. It was spectacular. The tape whizzed about a bit while to controller looked at it, then there was a long pause for thought, then the drive hung, hanging the disc (shared HPIB controller) *and* the CPU. (Users of A-eries machines will know that system crashes are *rare*, as opposed to some operating system :-) ...) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Steve Rickaby | ,,, Praxis Systems plc | < O_O > 20 Manvers Street, Bath, BA1 1PX, UK | ==( . )== Tel: +44 225 444700 Tx: 445848 PRAXIS G | Prrrouwf, Wackwacka sfr%praxis.uuc@ukc.ac.uk | !mcvax!ukc!praxis!sfr | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pascal is a blase, but Modula-2 is wirth its weight in gold.