[comp.sources.d] another dumb posting about licensing...

mjranum@gouldsd.UUCP (03/26/87)

	Ok, a lot of people who were flaming me about uucp pointed out
that all the UNIX source is licensed as a trade secret. This is
obviously a crock of shit, since Lyons published the version 6 
kernel as a textbook. So much for a trade secret. So much for 'cat'
which is stubbed out in Kernighan & Ritchie, so much for 'dc' and
a host of others. Anything that is printed in a TEXTBOOK is going to
be plenty public, children. (for those of us who can read)

	Not that you want to know what I think, I'll tell you anyway:
I think everyone's afraid of the slimeball lawyers and pissants
who are really just an impediment to progress. I think NOBODY really
knows the status of ~50% of the UNIX code but everyone is afraid to
open their mouths. So much for the former pioneering spirit. That's
what happens to something fun like UNIX when the hobbyists and students
get bumped out by the degree-grubbers, yes-men and lawyer-kissers.
Amazing that anyone manages to make any progress these days.

	I mean, gee, aren't you guys all scared silly that the
descendants of Alan Turing are going to sue all the software developers
of the world because HE came up with the idea of programs ? Get real.

--mjr();
-- 
"It is better to shred the bugger than to bugger the shredder."
					-ancient doltic proverb.

wingard@ncrcae.UUCP (03/26/87)

In article <483@gouldsd.UUCP> mjranum@gouldsd.UUCP (Marcus J Ranum) writes:
>
>	Ok, a lot of people who were flaming me about uucp pointed out
>that all the UNIX source is licensed as a trade secret. This is
>obviously a crock of shit, since Lyons published the version 6 
>kernel as a textbook. So much for a trade secret...

Yeah, and when I took an undergraduate course that used the Lyons
textbook I had to SIGN AN AT&T NON-DISCLOSURE AGREEMENT that stated 
I would relinquish my source listings of the version 6 kernel to the
university for DESTRUCTION upon completion of the course or else the 
CS department would get their UNIX license pulled by AT&T...

pdb@sei.cmu.edu.UUCP (03/26/87)

In article <483@gouldsd.UUCP> mjranum@gouldsd.UUCP (Marcus J Ranum) writes:
>
>	Ok, a lot of people who were flaming me about uucp pointed out
>that all the UNIX source is licensed as a trade secret. This is
>obviously a crock of shit, since Lyons published the version 6 
>kernel as a textbook. So much for a trade secret. So much for 'cat'
>which is stubbed out in Kernighan & Ritchie, so much for 'dc' and
>a host of others. Anything that is printed in a TEXTBOOK is going to
>be plenty public, children. (for those of us who can read)

I dunno - I seem to recall that you couldn't even *get* the Lyons book
unless you had a source license for Sixth Edition or later.

--Pat.

wjb@goanna.UUCP (03/30/87)

In article <804@aw.sei.cmu.edu.sei.cmu.edu>, pdb@sei.cmu.edu (Patrick Barron) writes:
> In article <483@gouldsd.UUCP> mjranum@gouldsd.UUCP (Marcus J Ranum) writes:
> >
> >	Ok, a lot of people who were flaming me about uucp pointed out
> >that all the UNIX source is licensed as a trade secret. This is
> >obviously a crock of shit, since Lyons published the version 6 
> >kernel as a textbook. So much for a trade secret. So much for 'cat'
> 
> I dunno - I seem to recall that you couldn't even *get* the Lyons book
> unless you had a source license for Sixth Edition or later.
> 
> --Pat.

The Lyons book has big notices in the front saying that it is only
to be used by students enrolled in a particular course in
computer science at the University of Sydney.  There is also
this notice:

	This document may contain information covered by
	one or more licences, copyrights and non-dislosure
	agreements.  Circulation of this document is restricted
	to holders of a licence for the UNIX Software System
	from Western Electric.  All other circulation or reproduction
	is prohibited.

Warwick Bolam

pete@tcom.stc.co.uk (Peter Kendell) (03/30/87)

Summary:

Expires:

Sender:

Followup-To:

Distribution:

Keywords:


In article <483@gouldsd.UUCP> mjranum@gouldsd.UUCP (Marcus J Ranum) writes:
>       I mean, gee, aren't you guys all scared silly that the
>descendants of Alan Turing are going to sue all the software developers
>of the world because HE came up with the idea of programs ? Get real.

        *Which* descendants of Alan Turing?

        Get real yourself.
-- 
	Peter Kendell <pete@tcom.stc.co.uk>

	'Have you no idea of development, of progress?'
	'I have seen both in an egg. We call it Going Bad in Narnia.'

jack@mcvax.UUCP (03/31/87)

At the school I work, a student came in a couple of day, saying
"Hey, look what I've got!", and showing me a copy of the Lions
document. So, I immedeately borrowed it. I think I have permission
to read it, since the school has a V7 license. However, the student
doesn't, and obviously got the book in some illegal way.

Now, I guess I won't be expected to hit him across the head and
turn him into the next police station:-), but the thing that
intrigued me is: Am I allowed to give it back to him? He
obviously shouldn't have it, but then, it *is* his....

Moreover, I *think* (note emphasis) that it isn't his fault to
have the book, it's the fault of the person who gave him a copy.

Anyone care to enlighten me?
-- 
	Jack Jansen, jack@cwi.nl (or jack@mcvax.uucp)
	The shell is my oyster.

geoff@desint.UUCP (04/05/87)

In article <1236@bute.tcom.stc.co.uk> pete@stc.UUCP (Peter Kendell) writes:

>         *Which* descendants of Alan Turing?

Rather an unarguable point he has there, but of course Turing *did*
presumably have survivors to whom he left an estate.  Presumably they
could sue us. :-)
-- 

	Geoff Kuenning   geoff@ITcorp.com   {hplabs,ihnp4}!trwrb!desint!geoff