Cothrell@DOCKMASTER.ARPA (08/23/87)
Interview with Kieth Ledbetter about the new Express! BBS Professional
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Network: Atari and the Hard Disk User Group have recently had the
distinct pleasure of interviewing Keith Ledbetter Author of the highly
successful Express! series of Terminal and BBS Programs. This interview
centers on the newest of his BBS programs:
BBS Express! Professional
Chuck: Welcome Keith and we are honored to have this opportunity
to talk with you about you current efforts.
Keith: Thank you Chuck. It's nice to have support like yours.
Chuck: Believe me Keith there are hundreds more that support your
work. I'm not alone. Well I have a pretty exhaustive list of questions
about your newest version of BBS Express! and I'm sure the readers
will be glad to hear about it.
Let me start out by asking one of the most frequently asked questions
I get here. Will you allow other SysOps and programmers the opportunity
to write their own files as utilities games and other things for this
version?
Keith: Absolutely. This new version is dramatically different than
all the others. I'll supply a list of equates for those wishing
to write nice utilities for the BBS. There will also be some example
programs. some source code will be on the disk
All the system vectors and variable names that point to commonly
used routines will be supplied so that the bulk of utilities folks
write that utilize SpartaDOS [3.2d] functions will be easier to write.
You don't ha ve to write all that stuff now just use the routines already
provided while writing your program around them.
Things like input/output from/to the modem etc. will be user accessible
for people who want to write their own external commands.
Chuck: Which language did you use to write the new version?
Keith: Well I used my own ST and a cross assembler and ported over
to the 8-Bit Atari system.
Chuck: Then which language do the programmers use to add these other
options?
Keith: MAC/65 or any other machine language as long as the addressing
corresponds to the correct vectors I'll supply. Probably MAC/65 will
be the best for this. Anybody having experience in ML can write
files for the BBS. It's real simple. Real easy for folks to write
their own commands.
Chuck: What are some of the new things we can expect...Changes in
format etc.?
Keith: Well you are really going to need a ramdisk or a hard disk
to run this version. Most of the commands are external commands
[separate files] and using a floppy will be slow to say the least.
It can be done but will be very slow. You might be able to get by
with a US Doubled 1050 but you're still talking about accessing the
drive for every command.
You get to basically use the commands supplied and if you don't
like those you can write your own. It's a real simple task.
Chuck: Whew! Let's jump ahead for a second and let me ask when this
gem will be up for sale.
Keith: Oh that's really hard to say. Right now I'd say...
Chuck: ...Before this newsletter hits the stands in October???
Keith: No. right now I'd say it's about 80% complete. I'm hoping
to get into Beta test by the end of this month [August] and it might
be possible by October but it's really hard to say. I'll let Network:
Atari and the Mouse BBS do the Beta testing.
Chuck: Music to my ears....
Keith: I figured it would be.
Chuck: OK back to configuration. I had one of my users ask if you
were going to support Kermit Protocol.
Keith: No we'll support XMODEM CRC and YMODEM but not Kermit.
Chuck: You mentioned SpartaDOS 3.2d and I was wondering which other
DOS's can be used.
Keith: The new system absolutely requires SpartaDOS 3.2d. No other
DOS. You can use the R-TIME8 or run off of the internal software
clock in SpartadOS.
Chuck: What about the Sparta-X Cartridge?
Kei th: It's being worked on right now. It should work with that
because we are going to try to preserve all of the system vectors all
the time/date vectors and all of that.
Chuck: Are there any forseeable problems running off of an MIO or
P: R: Connection?
Keith: No I'm running it off of an MIO right now. Should be no problems
at all.
Chuck: Ok how many columns support are we to expect? 38? 40? 80?
Keith: There are basically 4 sets of menus under HELP40 and HELP80
Pathnames. Support for the ST for sure and maybe VT-52. I'm still
thinking about the VT-52 though. We'll see about that one. It's
possible but I'm not sure at the moment.
Chuck: What about the high baud rate? What's the limit this time?
Keith: 300 through 9600 Baud.
Chuck: Will it actually do 9600?
Keith: Yes but you have to have the exact same type of modem on each
end to have it work. There's not much call for it but it's there.
Chuck: I figure there's only 2 other folks out there in modem land
pushing 9600 at any rate so I'm sure we don't really need it. I'm
not going to go out to buy 9600 unless it becomes standard.
Keith: Right but it's in there for those that want it.
Chuck: Basically 2400 baud max will be used. Great.
Keith: Right.
Chuck: Ok What else?
Keith: Well before I let the SysOp define his/her own pathnames and
such but this version has them all Hard-Coded.
You have to CREDIR each of those since they are hard-coded. All
of the Sub-Directories have been set up the same. Hard-Coded. There
are COMMANDS> HELP40> HELP80> BASES> USERLOG> FILES> and other subs that
need creation. Also the Message Bases 32 of them are Hard-Coded. BASE01 BASE02
etc.
4000 Bytes maximum P/Message and 250 Messages P/Base. Plenty to
go around I guess. That's roughly 50 lines @ 80 Columns P/Line.
A short novel.
Chuck: That should make everyone happy. Is there a good Message
Base Editor?
Keith: Absolutely but it's set up a bit different. Previously we
had all those commands before you entered the Base but now the sub-commands
come after that. I found it was easier that way.
Chuck: How about the Menu's? Will they be set-up the same? Can
I use my old menu's from the old system?
Keith: No because they are set-up a little different however I may
write a quick converter program to change all those over. Maybe
even one for the userlog.
Chuck: Are the "letter-commands" still going to be the same?
Keith: Sure but there may be "word" command support too. The way
it is now and the way it'll probably enter Beta test will be with
the letter options.
Chuck: Ok. What did I forget?
Keith: You have to ask me about download files!!!
Chuck: Hehe..ok hey Keith what have you done about the 8 Pathname
limit in the download section?
Keith: Well I'm glad you asked me about that. There are now 516 128
available filenames that you can have in your Massive download section!
It's set up like this: I have Hard-Coded the program to read sub-director
ies FILES_01> through FILES_32>. Under each of those sub-directories
are all the sub-directories that you want scanned. Figure 127 SysOp-Chosen
Sub-directories under each of these FILES_xx> sub-directories and
each containing 127 downloadable files you come up with the big picture.
Another way to put it is you can have sub-directories FILES_01>
through FILES_32> each containing 127 sub-directories apiece and each
of those containing 127 files.
Chuck: Alright! You shouldn't have any more complaints about that!
Keith: Nope. I took care of that one for a while.
Chuck: That was probably your biggest complaint true?
Keith: Yeah that was the big one. The people that have switched
to the other BBS switched because of that problem. Well now we've
made the whole BBS better so I expect most of those to come back.
Chuck: I hate to admit it Keith but I was one of those that switched.
I'm so ashamed. But now that we have a new toy I'll gladly switch
over again to see the changes you've made. I really have to say
that personally I don't care which BBS I operate but it has to suit
the system I run. With 120 Meg to play with I need flexibility.
Keith: Gotta do what you gotta do.
Chuck: Sigh.
Keith: Getting back to the Downloads. Each file on the system will
have a 240 character description space allotted to it just like the
ST Express! BBS.
Chuck: That also takes up disk space. I can see why you need a
large system.
Keith: Yes I figure everyone will go with double density and that'S
why I went with 240. Each will only take up 2 sectors on the disk
P/Description. But that is at the SysOps approval. If you don't
want to use the descriptions you can set that up in the SYSDATA.DAT
file.
Chuck: Does it have a catalog command? Like the ST version?
Keith: Better than the ST version. It will allow a catalog of the
files you specify with wildcards. There will be 15 names P/Page
and each one downloadable with the press of a single key.
Chuck: That sounds like it's going to take some dedicated effort
by a SysOp to set it up. But once it is done you can have a class
act.
Keith: Sure. And all the file descriptions are editable from the
SysOp but really all you'll have to do to set it up is just to copy
all your files over and then go through and do a <B>rowse. It will
tell you "Description not available" and you just hit <E>dit to write
up a short description. It's only a lot of work if you have a lot
of files like you.
Chuck: I'm having typer's cramps already. However it costs to be
the boss so I can't complain.
On to another subject. How about the logon data. will that still
be setup the same? Selectable to go either to the printer or a disk
file?
Keith: Yes it's the same as the older versions. You'll be able to
use handles and such and the initial logon sequence asks quite a lot
of questions so if it goes to a disk file it will take up a bit of
space. You have plenty. The rest is similar to the other versions.
Chuck: Does that include download ratio's?
Keith: Yes. It saves all that data to the logfile.
Chuck: What are you going to charge for this?
Keith: I'm n ot really sure yet. It won't be much though.
Chuck: Ok what's the maximum number of active users we can have?
Keith: Well over 65 000 but Realistically you have a logical limit.
See SpartaDOS can handle a single file 8 Megabytes in length. Take
that number of bytes and divide it by 256 bytes [the number of bytes
each userlog takes up] and you come out with around 30 000 or so.
Chuck: Well I don't think that anyone will have that many user.
Even Atari Base would find it tough.
Keith: Right and that would be almost a whole Hard Drive partition
just for the userlog.
Chuck: Time to buy a mainframe!
Keith: Yeah no kidding.
Chuck: What about Passwords?
Keith: On this new version the passwords are user supplied.
Chuck: Great. How many characters?
Keith: From 1 to 15 characters I believe. Again though just like
the ST version...the user will be assigned a record number and if
they logon with that number then the look-up time will be almost
immediate.
Now they can optionally key in their Handle along with their password
and then the board will search for it much like it does when you
send E-Mail to somebody. It looks to see that they exist. So there
are multiple ways to logon.
Chuck: Ok would you please explain again if you will the equate functions
that you're supplying with the disk?
Keith: Sure. Really there's 2 sets of equates. One is the MAC/65
source code equates to all of the "Global Variables" including the
SYSDATA data the USER record data Current date current time and whatever.
Then there are also a set of vectors that are jump vectors. These
help you control data within the program itself.
[ ZNOTE: An indepth description was given concerning these equates but
this will come on the disk so we won't waste the space here going
into detail. ]
Chuck: Then any Atari assembler will be functional for these mods.
Keith: Correct. Yes. It's all very simple because most of the data
you need is already in the shell of the program. You don't have
to come up with a lot of the user input. It's already there.
Even when you're talking about really indepth utilities or games
like adventures and such those things are readily accessible.
Chuck: Then are we limited to the size of these external commands?
Keith: Yes. Somewhere around 16K is the limit. That's even bigger
than SpartaDOS itself so those are really involved. The shell really
takes all the kluge work out of writing an assembler program. It's
totally possible to write a game like Zork(tm) for on-line use if
that's what you wanted to do.
Chuck: Where can the folks purchase the p rogram?
Keith: This will be through Orion Micro Systems as always. The
main support/sales board will remain there.
Chuck: Can the Hard Disk User Group members get a special price
on it?
Keith: I'm sure we can work something out for your members. T hose
are probably the people most likely to purchase it. Sure.
Chuck: Ok I'll send Chris King at Orion a list of my members.
Keith: That'll do it.
Chuck: Next question. How many security levels are allowed on the
new system?
Keith: About 320. See there are 32 Msg Bases 32 File areas [SIGS]
and 32 command levels. So basically each user record has 32 flags
for each of those things. Then there are other things that you would
need to read the documentation to see.
Chuck: Is there an option on the new board to allow survey's?
Keith: Yes. Up to 32 trackable surveys with an un limited number
of questions.
Chuck: Unlimited?
Keith: Well by disk space only.
Chuck: Superior!
Keith: Again we're talking about a BBS designed for a really big
system. So by now you can probably see that this is really for a
Hard Disk configuration.
Chuck: I was seriously hoping for these kinds of modifications and
trvthfully there are a lot of folks going to hard disk systems. Therefore
this is quite a marketable product in that sense.
Keith: Right. You can still run it from floppy but you'll be severely
limited in the options allowed. Even with the use of a ramdisk.
Chuck: I see. Those folks running Megabytes and larger RAMdisks
will be able to apply most of the available options.
Keith: Correct.
Chuck: Ok here's one. I know this is an important issue. Are the
folks that have purchased the other express! programs going to be
able to trade in their old versions for the new one?
Keith: Yes they can. Trading in the master disk for a replacement.
Even tho ugh this version is being called BBS Express! Professional
[Express! PRO] it is a version 2.0 upgrade of the 850 version. So those
that are currently owners will be able to upgrade it for a fee that
has not been set yet.
There is also going to be a 1030 version of BBS Express! Professional so
that news should make everyone happy. This will be released sometime
after the 850 version.
Originally we were not going to write a 1030 version. We figured hey...if
you want to keep up with us you should upgrade to an 850 but we figured
hey...it was really the 1030's that got us started so we'll support
them too.
Chuck: I'm not sure how many folks run 1030's and Hard Drives but
it's there if needed.
Keith: Right. It has now gotten to the point now where we're going
to have to talk to the folks a little more now to determine what
kind of system they want. We have to be sure they get the version
that they can use best. With so many version out it may confuse a
few.
Chuck: To be sure they don't get a Hard Disk version to run off
a single drive...etc.
Keith: Right.
Chuck: Hey! Do you know what just happened?
Keith: What's that.
Chuck: I just ran out of questions!
Keith: Ha!!
Chuck: Well I sure do appreciate all this good information and I'm
sure my readers do too.
So now's your chance to ramble and tell the folks what I've neglected
to ask.
Keith: Well the most important thing to get across is that this is
really a large system BBS program and it really does act that way.
There's 5 different logon sequences that the SysOp can use. There
are a LOT of one-key commands available for the SysOp. See this version
is different in that it was written more for the SysOps editability and
still allows more things for the users. It's simply a better all-around
program.
The nice part about it is the fact that it's what the SysOp wants.
A lot of the program isn't even written yet and I'm not really sure
which way i want to go on some of the things. Sorta flying by the
seat of my pants. That's why I needed some suggestions from your
users. I've basically added all the features that everyone has asked
for.
Chuck: Well...ending an interview especially this one is a hard thing
to do but I suppose we have to do it.
Keith: Ok well let's do this... give me a call in a few minutes.
I'll boot up the new version and let you take a look at what I've
got completed. This way you can get a general idea of the new system.
Chuck: I'm shakin' all over! Ok and I want to thank you VERY much
for this exclusive interview today!
Keith: My pleasure. No problem.
Chuck: Fantastic. Take care Keith.
Keith: See you later.
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[ ZNOTE: I called Keith and saw the new version a t work. I want
one! I figure with all the changes that he has made it will be worth
whatever he asks for it. And the option to trade in your old master
for the new version is a great deal!
Plan to call Network: Atari HD Express! BBS <ZBBS> in the next
few weeks to see this version at work!
I will guarantee you wil l be impressed with his efforts and continue
to support him in his endeavors.
And last but certainly not least Keith... You've done it again!