gdtltr@vax1.acs.udel.EDU (Gary D Duzan) (01/10/89)
Well, I hate to be the bearer of ill tidings, but the local system administrators have gotten fed up with the load the mailing list places on our local. Therefore, I'm afraid the ZMAG/ST Report mailing list has come to an end. It was fun while it lasted. I hope you all manage to find the mags on your local boards or the pay systems. If anyone else would like to take over the mailing list, let me know & we can work something out. Gary Duzan Time Lord Third Regeneration Atari Enthusiast Extreme
Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) (01/12/89)
Hey Gary! My mail keeps bouncing back from your address. I am willing to take over at least a portion of the mailing list (say 4-5 names and everyone on Portal). If we can get a group together we can still distribute the Zmag via the net. Another possible solution is to just post the thing to the net. I prefer the second solution myself and I think most of the others who read this newsgroup would also prefer that.
njd@ihlpm.ATT.COM (DiMasi) (01/14/89)
In article <13428@cup.portal.com>, Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) writes: > > Hey Gary! > .... > Another possible solution is to just post the thing to the net. I prefer the > second solution myself and I think most of the others who read this newsgroup > would also prefer that. I would, as I don't have any other reliable way (short of dialing up Paybax BBS or whatever long distance, which I'm not desperate enough to do) to get Zmag. It is supposed to be on DELPHI but Kovacs (who is on there) rarely puts them up. (I suppose I could nag him about it again...) If a mailing list ends up started again, I would be willing to "trade" Chicago Zmag/a\zine's for Kovacs' Zmags. (I sent Gary one, and could send more but if he has machine space problems, well....) Nick DiMasi njd@ihlpm.ATT.COM ...att!ihlpm!njd DELPHI: TURBONICK Uni'q Digital Technologies (Fox Valley Software subsidiary; ^ working as a contractor at AT&T Bell Labs in Naperville, IL) ( | this is an accent mark, supposed to replace the dot over the 'i')
RCH@cup.portal.com (Ric C Helton) (01/15/89)
Gary: I agree with Ordania-DM; post the ZMAG to the net; Talk about busting the signal:noise ratio. I think it is a quality report, and have seen a lot longer and more useless postings!!! -Ric Helton RCH@cup.portal.com
rjung@nunki.usc.edu (Robert allen Jung) (01/16/89)
Count me as another net.person who would like to see ZMag/ST Report/ST-Mag
posted to the net (Should they be cross-posted for the comp.sys.atari.*
groups, or posted individually to each one?)
--R.J.
B-)
=============================================================================
Disclaimer: This message was written with my authorization
# ## #
# ## # Mailing address: rjung@nunki.usc.edu
## ## ## (It's easier to just use the reply function, tho)
#### ## ####Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (01/16/89)
Nick DiMasi mentioned:
>...I would be willing to "trade" Chicago Zmag/a\zine's for Kovacs' Zmags.
Are they still doing that one out of Chicago..?
BobRMakey@LOGICON.ARPA (Jeff Makey) (01/16/89)
In article <2355@nunki.usc.edu> rjung@nunki.usc.edu (Robert allen Jung) writes: >(Should they be cross-posted for the comp.sys.atari.* >groups, or posted individually to each one?) I didn't find the ZMAGs posted a few months ago to be particularly interesting, but if other people like it then I won't be upset to see it posted again. It would be a lot better if the 8-bit and ST portions of ZMAG were *not* crossposted. I suspect that a majority of Atari owners are only interested in one model or the other, not both. :: Jeff Makey Department of Tautological Pleonasms and Superfluous Redundancies Department Disclaimer: Logicon doesn't even know we're running news. Internet: Makey@LOGICON.ARPA UUCP: {nosc,ucsd}!logicon.arpa!Makey
ajy2208@ultb.UUCP (A.J. Yarusso ) (01/17/89)
I also would like to see ZMAG/ST and ST Report posted to the net. There are many Atari ST and 8-bit owners here at RIT who I'm sure wouldn't mind seeing them posted here. Albert Yarusso, Rochester Institute of Technology Bitnet: ajy2208@ritvax.bitnet (preferred) Usenet: ajy2208@ultb.RIT.edu "Old programmers never die, they just branch to a new address"
steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington) (01/17/89)
Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) writes: > > Hey Gary! > My mail keeps bouncing back from your address. I am willing to take over at >least a portion of the mailing list (say 4-5 names and everyone on Portal). >If we can get a group together we can still distribute the Zmag via the net. >Another possible solution is to just post the thing to the net. I prefer the >second solution myself and I think most of the others who read this newsgroup >would also prefer that. No! This already has been proposed, discussed and soundly rejected. The last thing I need is that babble tying up phone lines and overflowing my disk drive. Please do NOT post Zmag to comp.sys.atari.st. UUCP: {rosevax, crash}!orbit!pnet51!steve ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!steve@nosc.mil INET: steve@pnet51.cts.com ----------- -or- stag!thelake!steve@pwcs.StPaul.GOV "A member of STdNET -- the ST Developers' Network"
Jan@cup.portal.com (Martha L Dycus) (01/17/89)
I, too, would like to see Zmag posted to the Net
dav@eleazar.dartmouth.edu (William David Haas) (01/18/89)
I wouldnt mind seeing it posted.
_
"Shadow, do something! Those flying Morpheous / \
birds are going to get us!" Psimon / _ \
shadow master / //\ \
"O.k., o.k., I'll cast Dav El II / // \\ \
Transmute Roc to mud." / /____\\ \
We are the /________\\ \
warrior spirit. \__________\/ajy2208@ultb.UUCP (A.J. Yarusso ) (01/18/89)
I also believe that the ST/Zmag & ST Report should only be posted in one area, not both the ST and 8-bit areas. Since they are both ST related publications it seems obvious that they should be posted in comp.sys.atar.8bit! Oh, by the way.. I am interested in both ST's and 8-bits alike.. I run a BBS system on my 8-bit (130XE, R-Time 8, 1Meg MIO, 2 20 meg hard drives, Adaptek 4000a, XEP80, soon Sparta X, two monitors, and Carina II BBS software). And sitting right next to my 8-bit is my roommate's Mega ST2.. :) Albert Yarusso, Rochester Institute of Technology Bitnet: ajy2208@ritvax.bitnet (preferred) Usenet: ajy2208@ultb.RIT.edu If anyone wants to call the BBS, the # is 716-475-4088! 3/12/2400 bauD
steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington) (01/18/89)
The system administrator here at pnet51 (People-Net node 51, Minneapolis) has
offered to bounce Z-Mag/ST Report to a mailing list. This would avoid the
problems that would come from dumping the magazine into a discussion newsgroup
such as comp.sys.atari.st.
First, I need to hear from someone who can mail it here. After that's set up,
"subscriptions" can be taken.
Incidentally, pnet51 is PC-Pursuitable (612-929-6699). I also can put the
files in my directory, which is publicly accessible.
UUCP: {rosevax, crash}!orbit!pnet51!steve
ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!steve@nosc.mil
INET: steve@pnet51.cts.com
-----------
-or-
stag!thelake!steve@pwcs.StPaul.GOV
"A member of STdNET -- the ST Developers' Network"RCH@cup.portal.com (Ric C Helton) (01/18/89)
I agree with Jeff Makey... I think most Atari owners are only infatuated with the machine they are currently using... Be that ST or 8-bit. I vote against cross-posting.... -Ric Helton RCH@cup.portal.com Freestyle BBS 404/546-8256 Athens, GA (2-FAST FORWARD) Co-sysop
colas@mirsa.inria.fr (Colas NAHABOO) (01/18/89)
From article <494@orbit.UUCP>, by steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington): > Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) writes: >>Another possible solution is to just post the thing to the net.> > No! This already has been proposed, discussed and soundly rejected. Yes! Do not forget us, non-US citizens who cannot get infos on the US BBS!!! Post ST report and STZmag to comp.sys.atari.st, Zmag to comp.sys.atari.8bit! Colas NAHABOO BULL Research FRANCE -- Koala Project (GWM X11 Window Manager) Internet: colas@mirsa.inria.fr Surface Mail: Colas NAHABOO, INRIA - Sophia Antipolis, 2004, route des Lucioles, 06565 Valbonne Cedex -- FRANCE Voice phone: (33) 93.65.77.71
Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) (01/19/89)
In reply to the one no vote, which I didn't see until after I posted my earlier article... I never saw that discussion and I have been reading this newsgroup for 6 months now. So far the requests for the ZMAG posting have been all favorable except yours. There seems to be no reason not to post ZMAG that I can see; as has been said before and will be again...just use whatever feature you have available to SKIP the ZMAG posting. Since you are with some ST organization (I saw it in your signature) I suspect you are against posting of the ST mag. On that issue we agree...I'd much prefer the ST just died and we could get on with the development of a REAL computer! :) Such as the Atari 8/16 bit line. :) Views and opinions change with time; since yours is the only view opposing the posting, I think it fair that we go with the majority and start posting the ZMAG. (off the soapbox..only cuz it slipped out from beneath me) Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com
gl8f@bessel.acc.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) (01/19/89)
In article <96@mirsa.inria.fr> colas@mirsa.inria.fr (Colas NAHABOO) writes: > >Yes! Do not forget us, non-US citizens who cannot get infos on the US BBS!!! >Post ST report and STZmag to comp.sys.atari.st, Zmag to comp.sys.atari.8bit! Posting ST Report and Zmag and STZmag to the net was rejected earlier, it seems, because they include advertising. If someone would take over the mailing list, then you could still receive the mags for free over the net. I sent mail to the old distributor (gary?) volunteering to take over the list; I received no answer. If someone could obtain the mags each week and mail them to me, I could restart the list. -- greg ------ Greg Lindahl | Graduate School: gl8f@virginia.{edu,bitnet} | It's not just a job, ..!uunet!virginia!gl8f | It's an indenture.
steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington) (01/21/89)
Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) writes: > > In reply to the one no vote, which I didn't see until after I posted my >earlier article... > I never saw that discussion and I have been reading this newsgroup for 6 >months now. So far the requests for the ZMAG posting have been all favorable >except yours. There seems to be no reason not to post ZMAG that I can see; as >has been said before and will be again...just use whatever feature you have >available to SKIP the ZMAG posting. Since you are with some ST organization >(I saw it in your signature) I suspect you are against posting of the ST mag. >On that issue we agree...I'd much prefer the ST just died and we could get >on with the development of a REAL computer! :) Such as the Atari 8/16 bit >line. :) > > Views and opinions change with time; since yours is the only view opposing >the posting, I think it fair that we go with the majority and start posting >the ZMAG. > >(off the soapbox..only cuz it slipped out from beneath me) > > Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com Let me reiterate the arguments against posting the magazine to a newsgroup: * It's not in character. Newsgroups promote group discussion. The Zmags are not discussion; the Zmag editors and contributors are not even on the net. * It's a commercial enterprise that carries advertising, which conflicts with the noncommercial, cooperative nature of the network. * It's excessively long. Some of us run UUCP nodes on SMALL systems -- I run mine on two floppies -- and some of us have rather tenuous network connections. Obviously that isn't a problem for those of you on Portal (a commercial system), but Usenet consists of five to ten thousand sites with widely varying capabilities. * There really isn't very much interest in it. I posted an offer a few days ago to set up a mailing list for e-mail distribution of the Zmag. So far I have received exactly ONE reply. (The offer still stands.) UUCP: {rosevax, crash}!orbit!pnet51!steve ARPA: crash!orbit!pnet51!steve@nosc.mil INET: steve@pnet51.cts.com ----------- -or- stag!thelake!steve@pwcs.StPaul.GOV "A member of STdNET -- the ST Developers' Network"
dag@per2.UUCP (Daniel A. Glasser) (01/21/89)
A suggestion:
Two moderated groups, comp.sys.atari.st.mag and comp.sys.atari.8bit.mag,
(or a single group, comp.sys.atari.mag) could be created, and all "magazine"
postings would go into these/this group(s).
The debate over commercial content in these magazines aside, this would
separate the magazines so that they could be archived separately and sites
that do not want to carry these magazines could so choose without disrupting
the normal comp.sys.atari.st and comp.sys.atari.8bit traffic.
Note:
I am not volunteering to run the debate or votes on this idea, nor to
moderate any group created.
--
_____________________________________________________________________________
Daniel A. Glasser One of those things that goes
...!persoft!dag "BUMP!!!(ouch)" in the night.
---Persoft, Inc.---------465 Science Drive-------Madison, WI 53711-----------ajy2208@ultb.UUCP (A.J. Yarusso ) (01/23/89)
I would like to be on your Zmag mailing list.. Thanks, Albert Yarusso Bitnet : ajy2208@ritvax.bitnet (preferred) Usenet : ajy2208@ultb.RIT.edu
preston@felix.UUCP (Preston Bannister) (01/24/89)
From article <511@orbit.UUCP>, by steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington): [ ...writes about why "ZMAG" isn't really appropriate material to be posted to Usenet... ] I also would rather NOT see "ZMAG" posted here. I read the issues posted and saw nothing of interest that I hadn't already seen elsewhere. I would suggest that "ZMAG" be distributed by mailing list (or some other mechanism) because of the large posting size, the limited interest, and the advertising. (Just my 2 cents :-) -- Preston L. Bannister USENET : hplabs!felix!preston BIX : plb CompuServe : 71350,3505 GEnie : p.bannister
frankg@nikhefk.UUCP (Frank Geerling) (01/24/89)
Add me on the mailing list. Thanks
Frank Geerling
(frankg@nikhefk.uucp)
Usenet: {seismo, philabs, decvax}!mcvax!frankg@nikhefk
Normal mail: Frank Geerling
NIKHEF-K (PIMU)
Postbus 4395
1009 AJ Amsterdam
The Netherlandsljdickey@water.waterloo.edu (Lee Dickey) (01/24/89)
In article <511@orbit.UUCP> steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington) writes: >Let me reiterate the arguments against posting the magazine to a newsgroup: >* It's not in character. .. >* It's a commercial enterprise that carries advertising, ... >* It's excessively long. ... >* There really isn't very much interest in it. ... and he expands on these four ideas. However, there is an answer to each of these comments and I will give the short version of each. In separate posting, I proposed the creation of a new group "comp.sys.atari.newsletter", specifically for things like ZMag, ST Rpt, Lustletter, and if we are lucky, others. (1) Things can and do change (2) So what? I know that commercials have been on the net for years; a few blatent, many subtle. (3) No one is forced to subscribe to the newsletter group. (4) The evidence Steve gives is flawed by the fact that most believe there is a better way. Perhaps if they are forced into a corner, they will take up his offer to run a mailing list. -- L. J. Dickey, Faculty of Mathematics, University of Waterloo. ljdickey@water.UWaterloo.ca ljdickey@water.BITNET ljdickey@water.UUCP ..!uunet!watmath!water!ljdickey ljdickey@water.waterloo.edu
gl8f@bessel.acc.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) (01/25/89)
In article <489@nikhefk.UUCP> frankg@nikhefk.UUCP (Frank Geerling) writes: >Add me on the mailing list. Thanks People who _POST_ a request to be added to the mailing list will be IGNORED. Do NOT bore the entire net and waste lots of money by posting items which should be mailed. -- greg (p.s. I'm not normally like this, but I have a qualifying exam this Saturday :-) ------ Greg Lindahl | Graduate School: gl8f@virginia.{edu,bitnet} | It's not just a job, ...!uunet!virginia!gl8f | It's an indenture.
The-Sorcerer@cup.portal.com (Douglas P Dionne) (01/26/89)
Please add me to the mailing list for ST Zmag (if one is ever created). Thanks, the-sorcerer@cup.portal.com Douglas P. Dionne
merlin@bsu-cs.UUCP (Scott McPheeters) (01/26/89)
In article <2050@water.waterloo.edu>, ljdickey@water.waterloo.edu (Lee Dickey) writes: > In separate posting, I proposed the creation of a new > group "comp.sys.atari.newsletter", specifically for things like > ZMag, ST Rpt, Lustletter, and if we are lucky, others. > I agree with this idea very much. This way no one would have to see the posting if they did not want to and those of us whose system managers get mad for a large mail message every week!!!!! ------------ Scott McPheeters UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee}!bsu-cs!merlin merlin@bsu-cs.UUCP
The-Sorcerer@cup.portal.com (Douglas P Dionne) (01/26/89)
Greg Lindahl writes: > People who _POST_ a request to be added to the mailing list will be > IGNORED.... [rest deleted] Obviously not, Greg. After all, *you* replied. the-sorcerer@cup.portal.com Douglas P. Dionne
david@bdt.UUCP (David Beckemeyer) (01/27/89)
In article <511@orbit.UUCP> steve@pnet51.cts.com (Steve Yelvington) said about ZMAG: * It's a commercial enterprise that carries advertising, ... To which, ljdickey@water.waterloo.edu (Lee Dickey) replied: > (2) So what? I know that commercials have been on the net for > years; a few blatent, many subtle. Starting a newsgroup especially for a commercial enterprise would be a bad idea. I for one will not accept or forward articles to such groups. That's not what Usenet is all about and I doubt whether very many Sysadmins are going to pay for somebody elses commercial project. It doesn't belong here - take it someplace else. -- David Beckemeyer (david@bdt.UUCP) | "Lester Moore - Four slugs from a .44 Beckemeyer Development Tools | no Les, no more." 478 Santa Clara Ave. Oakland, CA 94610 | - Headstone at Boot Hill UUCP: {uunet,ucbvax}!unisoft!bdt!david | Tombstone, AZ
frankg@nikhefk.UUCP (Frank Geerling) (01/31/89)
In article <13947@cup.portal.com> The-Sorcerer@cup.portal.com (Douglas P Dionne) writes: >Please add me to the mailing list for ST Zmag (if one is ever created). Me to !! Frank Geerling (frankg@nikhefk.uucp) Usenet: {seismo, philabs, decvax}!mcvax!frankg@nikhefk Normal mail: Frank Geerling NIKHEF-K (PIMU) Postbus 4395 1009 AJ Amsterdam The Netherlands Frank Geerling (frankg@nikhefk.uucp) Usenet: {seismo, philabs, decvax}!mcvax!frankg@nikhefk Normal mail: Frank Geerling NIKHEF-K (PIMU) Postbus 4395 1009 AJ Amsterdam The Netherlands
ralph@laas.laas.fr (Ralph P. Sobek) (02/03/89)
Why do these requests to be added to a mailing list (which doesn't exist yet) get posted to the net?? -- Ralph P. Sobek Disclaimer: The above ruminations are my own. ralph@laas.laas.fr Addresses are ordered by importance. ralph@laas.uucp, or ...!uunet!mcvax!laas!ralph If all else fails, try: SOBEK@FRMOP11.BITNET sobek@eclair.Berkeley.EDU
gl8f@bessel.acc.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl) (02/05/89)
In article <285@laas.laas.fr> ralph@laas.laas.fr (Ralph P. Sobek) writes: > >Why do these requests to be added to a mailing list (which doesn't >exist yet) get posted to the net?? The mailing list does exist. People can subscribe by sending me mail. However, some people have been posting requests to get added to the list. I ignore all such postings (unless I flame them :-) in an attempt to keep their volume down. ------ Greg Lindahl | Graduate School: gl8f@virginia.{edu,bitnet} | It's not just a job, ...!uunet!virginia!gl8f | It's an indenture.
stowe@silver.bacs.indiana.edu (holly) (02/07/89)
Actually a vote was taken on whether ZMag and/or ST Report should be posted to the group. It was decided that it was not in the net's best interest to do so, and I for one don't feel that has changed. As long as they are and with the frequency they're released, that's an incredible load to the network. If need be, perhaps start a separate newsgroup and let individual sites decide, but please don't put comp.sys.atari.st at risk. Both are available on MANY BBSs, as well as GEnie, CompuServe and other pay services.
dav@eleazar.dartmouth.edu (William David Haas) (02/07/89)
In article <285@laas.laas.fr> ralph@laas.laas.fr (Ralph P. Sobek) writes: > >Why do these requests to be added to a mailing list (which doesn't >exist yet) get posted to the net?? > IT DOESN'T EXIST?!?!? gee... i wonder where all that stuff in my mailbox is coming from... its say ZMAG on it..... hmmm.... curious _ "Shadow, do something! Those flying Morpheous / \ birds are going to get us!" Psimon / _ \ shadow master / //\ \ "O.k., o.k., I'll cast Dav El II / // \\ \ Transmute Roc to mud." / /____\\ \ We are the /________\\ \ warrior spirit. \__________\/
Ordania-DM@cup.portal.com (Charles K Hughes) (02/08/89)
RE: ZMAG (AND OTHER MAGS) Usenet is not supposed to be used for commercial advertisements. Having checked the issues of Zmag that I have, I found that they do contain some advertisements and therefore shouldn't be posted. So that alone should limit the discussion of posting it here or in a new newsgroup. Ordania-DM @cup.portal.com
RCH@cup.portal.com (Ric C Helton) (02/10/89)
Anyone else notice that we could have already posted several copies of Zmag to the net in the space we've devoted to debating it...? -Ric Helton RCH@cup.portal.com Freestyle BBS 404/546-8256