rrwood@lotus.waterloo.edu (Roy Wood) (12/05/89)
Boy, the number of postings to this group really drops off once exams hit, doesn't it? Anyway, my question is whether anyone has seen the graphic user interface for the 8-bits. I think that the product I'm thinking of is called "Diamond Dos" or something. If anyone has seen this (or anything similar) in action, what was your impression? I suspect it would be pretty bad, and the thought of using a joystick in place of a mouse makes me cringe. It would be nice to have a Macintosh-like interface for the 8-bit, but I don't think the machine is fast enough to make it anything but painful to see. And while I think of it, has anyone tried to hook-up a mouse to their 8-bit? I don't suppose it would be that hard, though you'd then have to write all your own software to take advantage of it. That might make a good project...hmm. Does anyone know where I can get a cheap mouse with basic technical specs? I guess I could always go for a Mac mouse, though Apple overcharges sooo much for their stuff. -Roy Wood (rrwood@lotus.waterloo.edu)
Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (12/07/89)
Roy Wood asks about the Graphics environment programs for the 8-bit Atari.. I've used the Diamond O.S. cartridge a bit, and it's actually not bad at all... in fact, if it had been available for the 8-bit system a few years ago, it might have gone a long way toward generating a lot of new interest in the machines.\ Rather than "Mac-like" it's more "ST-like"... it's obviously been modelled after the GEM interface in the ST... While you _can_ use a joystick with it, it works best of all with a real ST mouse.. (there's also a KoalaPad driver for it, but I never tried using that). With a true proportional mouse like the ST's, you can do true "point and shoot" operations. All the "Mac-like" operations are there, including windows, dragging icons to copy disks and files, slider bars on the windows... things like that.. There are even "Desk Accessories" that can be called up from within other programs..! The cartridge came with docs showing how to program the "GEM-like" features into your own programs... a few minutes with the docs, and I was opening windows with title bars and icons from Atari BASIC... very nice..! There was another Graphics interface cartridge that was being worked on called "GOE" (Graphics Operating Environment), but it seems to have evaporated into the great vapor cloud in the sky... actually, I liked the demo version I played with better than the Diamond O.S. in many areas. Like I said, if these things had come out a few years ago, things might be different in the 8-bit world today. When GEOS appeared in the Commodore marketplace, it gave the Commodore-64 a new lease on life... BobR
tle33710@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (12/07/89)
ANALOG published, in Bits n' pieces, I think, a hardware modification to a Radio Shack 360 degree joystick so it could be used as a one-button mouse for the 8bits. When I find it I'll post the issue date. I built it and it cost me about $25--and that includes two (2) joysticks... _______________________________________________________________________________ Tim Elliott | ``Genghis'' University of Illinois at Urpaign/Chambana | ``Dr. Seuss'' (Name of the Week) tle33710@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu | ``Insert your own quote'' ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "A Home Run and a Triple; A first baseman's and a catcher's glove; and Dolly Parton." --Rich Little -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
jrd@STONY-BROOK.SCRC.SYMBOLICS.COM (John R. Dunning) (12/07/89)
Date: 5 Dec 89 14:58:41 GMT
From: attcan!utgpu!watserv1!watdragon!lotus!rrwood@uunet.uu.net (Roy Wood)
Anyway, my question is whether anyone has seen the graphic user interface
for the 8-bits. I think that the product I'm thinking of is called "Diamond
Dos" or something.
There are actually two; Diamond and GOE, both of which are supposed to
be available as cartridges. I think GOE may have gone out of business,
however.
If anyone has seen this (or anything similar) in action,
what was your impression?
There's a demo version of GOE in the software archives. When I played
with it, I was pretty impressed. People who've used diamond say good
things about it, too.
I suspect it would be pretty bad, and the thought
of using a joystick in place of a mouse makes me cringe.
Use an ST mouse. Works great.slackey@bbn.com (Stan Lackey) (12/08/89)
In article <19010@watdragon.waterloo.edu> rrwood@lotus.waterloo.edu (Roy Wood) writes: >And while I think of it, has anyone tried to hook-up a mouse to their 8-bit? >I don't suppose it would be that hard, though you'd then have to write all your >own software to take advantage of it. That might make a good project...hmm. >Does anyone know where I can get a cheap mouse with basic technical specs? I have done the following: Connected the Trak-ball to the 8bit, and written a handler Connected the Commodore mouse, and written a handler Notes: The Trak-ball (in native mode, not joystick-compatible mode) is claimed by net-people to have the same characteristics as the ST mouse. Clocks and directions come in over the four joy direction pins. It was a matter of writing a small handler, which I put in page 6 and installed with a timer interrupt, that looks for changes and asynchronously changes xy coordinates in memory for whatever application to read (Basic, etc). I got sick of the trak-ball; only one button, too bulky, pressing the button is too clumsy. I thought about mouses, and noticed that the Commodore one has 2 buttons and is plug compatible. The CBM has 2 modes - proportional and joystick. Prop mode has analog outputs to the two paddle inputs, which don't work on the Atari; whenever I read mine I get the value 3. So I use it in joy simulation mode, after changing the handler to "integrate" the 4 joy direction lines. (Note: games like millipede and missle command work real good with the CBM mouse in joy mode, as well as some of the elementary drawing programs like the one that came with the pen plotter.) The two buttons are read 1) in prop mode, as trigger and one of the directions and 2) in joy mode as trigger and one paddle input. 2 is usable, although 1 would be better. One other note: when I added VBI/DLI's to my application (drawing using 5-color character graphics) there was an interaction between the VBI and the timer interrupt. I ended up changing the DLI to interrupt every line, count lines, and call the mouse handler every like 8 lines; this eliminated the need for the timeer interrupt. I use player/missle graphics for the screen pointer. The top level application calls a subr every time around the loop that updates the pointer position. You don't miss mouse movements, but the pointer can skip around the screen when the appl is busy. Works pretty good. I have plans to make a graphic OS version of MYDOS. Wish me luck (in finding the time, that is.) I have truly been having fun. -Stan
slackey@bbn.com (Stan Lackey) (12/08/89)
In article <19010@watdragon.waterloo.edu> rrwood@lotus.waterloo.edu (Roy Wood) writes: >And while I think of it, has anyone tried to hook-up a mouse to their 8-bit? Oops I forgot - I'll be happy to share the code, if anyone would like to see it. The drivers are pretty short, so I'd probably just post the source listings. -Stan