rkarlqu@hpscdc.HP.COM (Rick Karlquist) (01/26/89)
According to connector folklore, there were two guys at Bell Labs or maybe
it was MIT Rad Lab whose names started with N and C, and Mr. N invented
the type N connector and Mr. C invented the type C connector and they both
worked on the BNC/TNC series. (The B means bayonet and T means threaded).
Does anyone out there remember the full name of Mr. N and Mr. C?
Was Mr. N named Nichols? Can anyone give more accurate info on this?
Rick Karlquist
HP Santa Clara
rkarlqu%hpscdc@hplabs.hp.comkline@tuna.cso.uiuc.edu (Charley Kline) (01/27/89)
> According to connector folklore, there were two guys at Bell Labs or maybe > it was MIT Rad Lab whose names started with N and C, and Mr. N invented > the type N connector and Mr. C invented the type C connector and they both > worked on the BNC/TNC series. (The B means bayonet and T means threaded). > Does anyone out there remember the full name of Mr. N and Mr. C? > Was Mr. N named Nichols? Can anyone give more accurate info on this? The little light on the dimmer board at the theater I work at has a flexible stalk which plugs into a BNC connector on the board. One of the actors, a physics grad student here, was standing behind me when I was installing the board, and I made some comment about "Neat, they used a BNC connector for this," and he said "Yup. Berkeley Nuclear Corporation." And I said "oh is that what that stands for?" And he said "Absolutely." Take it for what it's worth. ----- Charley Kline, University of Illinois Computing Services kline@tuna.cso.uiuc.edu {uunet,seismo,pur-ee,convex}!uiucdcs!uiucuxc!kline "Flaring high or flaring early makes the little prop tips curly."
jimc@iscuva.ISCS.COM (Jim Cathey) (01/27/89)
In article <5770015@hpscdc.HP.COM> rkarlqu@hpscdc.HP.COM (Rick Karlquist) writes: >According to connector folklore, there were two guys at Bell Labs or maybe >it was MIT Rad Lab whose names started with N and C, and Mr. N invented >the type N connector and Mr. C invented the type C connector and they both >worked on the BNC/TNC series. (The B means bayonet and T means threaded). Around here a TNC connector is a BNC with _two_ center pins (Twin NC?). We of course are not necessarily right in calling them this. If I had to guess I would say BNC meant 'BayoNet Coaxial', and that TNC was the Twin, or Twisted version of same. Any takers? Howabout someone with accurate information? +----------------+ ! II CCCCCC ! Jim Cathey ! II SSSSCC ! ISC Systems Corp. ! II CC ! TAF-C8; Spokane, WA 99220 ! IISSSS CC ! UUCP: uunet!iscuva!jimc ! II CCCCCC ! (509) 927-5757 +----------------+ "With excitement like this, who is needing enemas?"
cook@stout.ucar.edu (Forrest Cook) (01/27/89)
In article <5770015@hpscdc.HP.COM> rkarlqu@hpscdc.HP.COM (Rick Karlquist) writes: >...(The B means bayonet and T means threaded). >Does anyone out there remember the full name of Mr. N and Mr. C? my 2 (10) bits: I once heard that BNC was an acronym for "baby Nelson connector", and was a small version of a Nelson connector, whatever that is. This is probably incorrect, as the B=bayonet and T=threaded argument seems quite logical. Perhaps N=Nelson. ^ Forrest Cook (The preceding comments were my Opinions) ^ /|\ cook@stout.ucar.edu /|\ /|\ {husc6 | rutgers | ames | gatech}!ncar!stout!cook /|\ /|\ {uunet | ucbvax | allegra | cbosgd}!nbires!ncar!stout!cook /|\
rpw3@amdcad.AMD.COM (Rob Warnock) (01/27/89)
In article <399@garcon.cso.uiuc.edu> kline@tuna.cso.uiuc.edu (Charley Kline) writes: >board, and I made some comment about "Neat, they used a BNC connector for >this," and he said "Yup. Berkeley Nuclear Corporation." And I said "oh is that >what that stands for?" And he said "Absolutely." Take it for what it's worth. Almost. Try "Berkeley Nucleonics Corporation". They still exist, are still in Berkeley, CA, and make *extremely* high-precision pulse generators, pulse gates, delay lines, and the like, as needed for doing high-energy physics. Well... as needed for detecting the *results* of doing high-energy physics... ;-} ;-} Rob Warnock Systems Architecture Consultant UUCP: {amdcad,fortune,sun}!redwood!rpw3 ATTmail: !rpw3 DDD: (415)572-2607 USPS: 627 26th Ave, San Mateo, CA 94403
wjc@XN.LL.MIT.EDU (Bill Chiarchiaro) (01/28/89)
The BNC and type N connector were both developed during World War II.
A friend who restores old radios has seen both styles of connectors on
military equipment from 1944/1945. I think this rules out Berkeley
Nucleonics; the earliest product of theirs of which I know dates from
the late 1950s.
According to the Hewlett-Packard "1979-80 Coaxial & Waveguide Catalog
and Microwave Measurement Handbook," N stood for "Navy" and BNC stood
for "Bayonet Navy Connector." The Handbook also states that TNC stood
for "Threaded Navy Connector," APC for "Amphenol Precision Connector,"
GR for "General Radio," SMA for "Sub-Miniature C," and SMC for
"Sub-Miniature C."
In the September 1986 issue of Ham Radio magazine, Joe Reisert stated
that the N connector was designed by Paul Neill of Bell Labs. I think
Reisert said that the design was created during the 1940s. He also
said that the "C" of BNC stood for Carl Concelman
(Bayonet-Neill-Concelman). Reisert cited "A Designer's Guide to RF
Connector Selection" by Allen Nemetz in the September/October 1980
issue of rf design magazine. I have not seen that article.
Both of the above claims have a common element in the naming of the N
and BNC connectors ("Navy" or "Neill"). I could believe that they had
a common origin as a male N will mate with a female BNC.
The common usage of "TNC" does not refer to a two-pin BNC. There are
connectors for twinaxial cable that look very similar to BNCs, except
that they have two pins (actually one pin and one socket) side-by-side
and they are a pain in the butt to use. There is another style of
twinax connector that has one pin and two concentric shells and is
much easier to make mate. "TNC" refers to a connector that is similar
in size to a BNC, but has a threaded (rather than bayonet locking)
outer shell. It is a very nice connector to use with small coax.
Both of the above naming schemes ("Navy Connector" or "Neill and
Concelman") would nicely support the "T" standing for "threaded."
Happy Connecting,
Bill Chiarchiaro
N1CPK
wjc@xn.ll.mit.edussr@cos.com (Dave Kucharczyk) (01/28/89)
In article <2312@iscuva.ISCS.COM> jimc@iscuva.ISCS.COM (Jim Cathey) writes: >Around here a TNC connector is a BNC with _two_ center pins (Twin NC?). We >of course are not necessarily right in calling them this. If I had to guess >I would say BNC meant 'BayoNet Coaxial', and that TNC was the Twin, or Twisted >version of same. Any takers? Howabout someone with accurate information? Acording to the Amphenol catalog the connectors you are refering to are simply called 'Twin' coaxial connectors. They come in different types including UHF and BNC style. BNC connectors are identical to TNC except for the BNC uses 'a two stud bayonet lock coupling' while a TNC has 'a 7/16 - 28 threaded coupling'. also the 'Twin' type connectors have a characteristic impedance of 78 or 90 ohms while 'BNC/TNC' have a 50 ohm impedance. All electrical specs between the 'TNC' and 'BNC' are identical. (excluding cable sizes and other obvious differences of course). dave
punia@uvm-gen.UUCP (Card 54...) (01/28/89)
From article <399@garcon.cso.uiuc.edu>, by kline@tuna.cso.uiuc.edu (Charley Kline): >> According to connector folklore, there were two guys at Bell Labs or maybe >> it was MIT Rad Lab whose names started with N and C, and Mr. N invented > > this," and he said "Yup. Berkeley Nuclear Corporation." And I said "oh is A while back, I was talking to a sales engineer at Berkely Nucleonics, and he told me that the BNC is a "Baby N Connector", a smaller version of the original larger coaxial connectors. Let's see how many different stories we can collect... :-) -- David T. Punia Voice: 802-656-1915 Compu$erve: 72617,1211 Univ. of Vermont CSEE dept UUCPathalias --> punia@uvm-gen.uucp Burlington, VT 05401-0156 CS/INTERNET ---> punia@uvm.edu UUCPath --> ...!{princeton,harvard,decvax,dartvax,?}!uunet!uvm-gen!punia
buckwheat@richp1.uucp (Joe Panfil) (02/01/89)
I don't know if you really want to know what BNC stands for, or if this is supposed to be a continuing joke. But, I do know that BNC stands for "Bayonet Nut Connector". Just like TNC stands for "Threaded Nut Connector".
al@cs.strath.ac.uk (Alan Lorimer) (02/02/89)
In a former incarnation when working for the BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation), I was involved in building TV studios and Radio Stations. Having spent the odd afternoon inserting several hundreds of these things I became convinced that BNC stood for Bloody Nasty Connector.:-) Alan -- ____________________________________________________________________________ Alan G. Lorimer, Strathclyde University, 26 Richmond Street, Glasgow G1 1XH. UUCP: ...!uunet!mcvax!ukc!strath-cs!al DARPA: al%cs.strath.ac.uk@ucl-cs JANET: al@uk.ac.strath.cs
bks@ucbarpa.Berkeley.EDU (Brian K. Shiratsuki) (02/03/89)
In article <2312@iscuva.ISCS.COM> jimc@iscuva.ISCS.COM (Jim Cathey) writes: >In article <5770015@hpscdc.HP.COM> rkarlqu@hpscdc.HP.COM (Rick Karlquist) writes: >>According to connector folklore, there were two guys at Bell Labs or maybe >>it was MIT Rad Lab whose names started with N and C, and Mr. N invented >>the type N connector and Mr. C invented the type C connector and they both >>worked on the BNC/TNC series. (The B means bayonet and T means threaded). >...Howabout someone with accurate information?... i believe the B and T parts. however, i think the N stands for navy (the connectors are somewhat water resistant), and the C stands for connector. which makes ``BNC connector'' redundant. brian
adrian@cs.hw.ac.uk (Adrian Hurt) (02/03/89)
In article <1319@stracs.cs.strath.ac.uk>, al@cs.strath.ac.uk (Alan Lorimer) writes: > In a former incarnation when working for the BBC (British Broadcasting > Corporation), I was involved in building TV studios and Radio Stations. > Having spent the odd afternoon inserting several hundreds of these > things I became convinced that BNC stood for Bloody Nasty Connector.:-) Any connector of which one must fit several hundred in a few afternoons merits that description! I had to fit "N"-type connectors onto an Ethernet cable on one occasion. (Well, several occasions, but only one is relevant here.) We had ordered a crimp tool with which to do this; fortunately we hadn't been invoiced. Now Ethernet being very sensitive, I did a practise run on a small piece of spare cable first to get the hang of the new tool, and ran into a small problem. The tool would not come off! It could slide along the cable, but couldn't open enough to get over the connector. We subsequently found a source of "N" connectors which could be soldered on, and sent the tool, which would have cost some $100, back. -- "Keyboard? How quaint!" - M. Scott Adrian Hurt | JANET: adrian@uk.ac.hw.cs UUCP: ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!adrian | ARPA: adrian@cs.hw.ac.uk
pdg@ihlpa.ATT.COM (Paul D. Guthrie) (02/08/89)
BNC = Baby N Connector. TNC = Threaded N Connector. --paul -- Paul Guthrie iexplode!pdg
mjj@stda.jhuapl.edu (Marshall Jose) (02/09/89)
In article <11581@ihlpa.ATT.COM> pdg@ihlpa.UUCP (Paul D. Guthrie) writes: > >BNC = Baby N Connector. >TNC = Threaded N Connector. Actually, I had always assumed the "B" in "BNC" stood for "bayonet", referring to the fastening method. You realize, of course, that this discussion probably falls under the "ephemera" category. :-) Marshall Jose WA3VPZ mjj@aplvax.jhuapl.edu || ...mimsy!aplcen!aplvax!mjj
strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) (02/11/89)
In article <11581@ihlpa.ATT.COM> pdg@ihlpa.UUCP (Paul D. Guthrie) writes: } }BNC = Baby N Connector. }TNC = Threaded N Connector. WRONG! WRONG! BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector TNC = Threaded Navy Connector -- Norm (strong@tc.fluke.com)
larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) (02/13/89)
In article <6918@fluke.COM>, strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: > }BNC = Baby N Connector. > }TNC = Threaded N Connector. > > WRONG! WRONG! > > BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector > TNC = Threaded Navy Connector I'm not certain that anyone posting on this topic has been correct. I have always had a keen interest in the history of technology, and have a large personal collection of books, periodicals and catalogs, many of which pertain to the development of electrical devices, electronics and communication. The controversy and uncertainty in this discussion has bothered me, so over the course of the past week I spent almost 2 hours trying to find a definitive answer - but to no avail. I can find no references whatsoever to resolve this issue. I can, however, reach the following conclusions: 1. The BNC was definitely not developed by Western Electric (WECO). WECO was a major player in the development of radar during World War II. I have scanned through several volumes published by Bell Labs which relates their history of science and technology. I have looked through some BSP sections, and the BNC was always a KS-coded connector - so WECO didn't make it. Plus, the BNC was not WECO's "style". 2. I do not believe that the BNC was developed until the late 1940's - well after World War II. I have a full set of the famous MIT Rad Lab series, and a brief look in some applicable volumes shows no BNC connector references. Type N, yes, and plenty of PL-259 and SO-239, plus other connectors (ever a strange swivel-type coax connector of British deisgn used on the first airborne radar set, the ASV) - but no BNC.. I have looked though some army and navy technical manuals (including a few rather comprehensive books on communication system engineering) from World War II and can find no references to the BNC nor any photographs of apparatus where the connector is evident. 3. I picked about a dozen issues of "Electronics" magazine from 1945 and 1946 (heavy discussion about military electronics, since the war was won or about to be won), and can find no advertisements or photographs which depict the BNC. 4. I have some copies of the Radio Master from 1942 and 1945, and looked at the connector sections in detail. Lots of military connectors (like MS-series), but no BNC. I did notice that Cannon had a number of connectors which used a 1, 2 or 3 letter part number; some like the WK-series still exist, other weird styles have long disappeared. The only possible theory that I can offer - and this is a pure guess - is that the BNC is Cannon's original part number. 5. I also looked at some catalogs of major coaxial connector and component vendors (like Cannon, Microdot, H-P, Weinschel, etc.) to see if they might have some historical comment - but no luck. I am really stumped. It seems like the BNC just appeared out of nowhere sometime during the late 1940's. <> Larry Lippman @ Recognition Research Corp., Clarence, New York <> UUCP: {allegra|ames|boulder|decvax|rutgers|watmath}!sunybcs!kitty!larry <> VOICE: 716/688-1231 {att|hplabs|mtune|utzoo|uunet}!/ <> FAX: 716/741-9635 {G1,G2,G3 modes} "Have you hugged your cat today?"
jim@mnetor.UUCP (Jim Stewart) (02/14/89)
In article <2987@kitty.UUCP> larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) writes: >In article <6918@fluke.COM>, strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: >> }BNC = Baby N Connector. >> }TNC = Threaded N Connector. >> BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector >> TNC = Threaded Navy Connector > I'm not certain that anyone posting on this topic has been correct. I recall a TA at school saying it was British National Connector. BUT, my memory is pretty fuzzy and the guy was a goof! -- Jim Stewart, VE3SRJ UUCP: {utzoo,uunet}!mnetor!jim ARPA: jim%mnetor.uucp@uunet.uu.net BELL: (416)475-8980
munir@hpfcmr.HP.COM (Munir Mallal) (02/14/89)
According to the IEEE Dictionary - BNC = Baby N Connector Munir Mallal
tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) (02/14/89)
jim@mnetor.UUCP (Jim Stewart) writes: > I recall a TA at school saying it [BNC] was British National Connector. > BUT, my memory is pretty fuzzy and the guy was a goof! Surely you mean Bavarian Normal Connektor... tom gardner P.S. what does BMW stand for? No no no NOOO: don't email me or post a reply. Please.
strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) (02/14/89)
In article <2987@kitty.UUCP> larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) writes: }In article <6918@fluke.COM>, strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: }> }BNC = Baby N Connector. }> }TNC = Threaded N Connector. }> }> WRONG! WRONG! }> }> BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector }> TNC = Threaded Navy Connector } } I'm not certain that anyone posting on this topic has been correct. I received the above info from the presidents of 2 companies that make their living manufacturing BNC and TNC connectors. If you can't believe them, who can you believe? -- Norm (strong@tc.fluke.com)
FAUNT@MATHOM.CISCO.COM (Doug Faunt) (02/15/89)
More rumor level information: The September '86 copy of Ham Radio has column called VHF/UHF World, written by Joe Reisert, which claims that BNC is derived from the names of its developers, Neil and Concelman, hence B(ayonet) N(eill) C(oncelman.) He says that Neil invented the N connector, and Concelman developed the C connector. He references this information to an article in rf design, Sept/Oct 1980, page 18, titled "A designers Gudie to RF Connector Selection" by Allen Nemetz.
larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) (02/15/89)
In article <6953@fluke.COM>, strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: > }> }BNC = Baby N Connector. > }> }TNC = Threaded N Connector. > }> > }> BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector > }> TNC = Threaded Navy Connector > } > } I'm not certain that anyone posting on this topic has been correct. > > I received the above info from the presidents of 2 companies that make their > living manufacturing BNC and TNC connectors. If you can't believe them, who > can you believe? That's a good question - I don't know who to believe! Consider the following from an article which appeared after yours: In article <12470659574025@MATHOM.CISCO.COM> usenet@cslb.CSL.SRI.COM writes: $> The September '86 copy of Ham Radio has column called VHF/UHF World, $> written by Joe Reisert, which claims that BNC is derived from the names of $> its developers, Neil and Concelman, hence B(ayonet) N(eill) C(oncelman.) $> He says that Neil invented the N connector, and Concelman developed $> the C connector. He references this information to an article in rf $> design, Sept/Oct 1980, page 18, titled "A designers Gudie to RF $> Connector Selection" by Allen Nemetz. What thoroughly perplexes me is that I cannot find any reference to this issue in any seemingly applicable book, catalog or periodical which I have so far examined (contemporary or historical, for that matter). I am going to try and obtain a copy of the above referenced article, though. <> Larry Lippman @ Recognition Research Corp., Clarence, New York <> UUCP: {allegra|ames|boulder|decvax|rutgers|watmath}!sunybcs!kitty!larry <> VOICE: 716/688-1231 {att|hplabs|mtune|utzoo|uunet}!/ <> FAX: 716/741-9635 {G1,G2,G3 modes} "Have you hugged your cat today?"
larry@kitty.UUCP (Larry Lippman) (02/15/89)
Regarding this whole issue, shortly after I posted the referenced
article, I decided to again browse through my organization's library, and
I have now found a reference: the 1979-1980 Hewlett-Packard "Coaxial and
Waveguide Catalog", which states on page 91:
"The BNC (Bayonet Navy Connector) connector was originally designed
for the military during World War II." [additional text deleted].
"The TNC (Threaded Navy Connector) connector is merely a threaded
BNC." [additional text deleted].
I place great value on the above information coming from a source
such as H-P.
This information confirms what strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong)
has posted. I apologize if I have doubted him, but with so many conflicting
definitions that were posted (from "Baby N" to "Berkley Nucleonics" to
claiming that the letters stood for people's initials), I simply did not
believe ANYONE until I could find a reference.
I am rather surprised that this connector originated during World War
II. I could find no reference to it in the MIT Rad Lab series. While
I did not check every Rad Lab volume, I did check those which seemed
appropriate. This seems to be an unusual omission. Just about EVERYTHING
pertaining to radar and UHF that was developed during World War II is
discussed or illustrated somewhere in the Rad Lab volumes.
Incidentaly, the H-P catalog also says that the "N" connector
stands for "Navy". Does that mean that the "C" connector (a large
BNC-type) stands for Coast Guard? :-)
<> Larry Lippman @ Recognition Research Corp., Clarence, New York
<> UUCP: {allegra|ames|boulder|decvax|rutgers|watmath}!sunybcs!kitty!larry
<> VOICE: 716/688-1231 {att|hplabs|mtune|utzoo|uunet}!/
<> FAX: 716/741-9635 {G1,G2,G3 modes} "Have you hugged your cat today?" otto@nicmad.UUCP (Douglas Otto) (02/16/89)
In article <6918@fluke.COM> strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: |In article <11581@ihlpa.ATT.COM> pdg@ihlpa.UUCP (Paul D. Guthrie) writes: |}BNC = Baby N Connector. |}TNC = Threaded N Connector. |WRONG! WRONG! |BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector |TNC = Threaded Navy Connector To throw another data point into this discussion, the latest issue of "TPT/Networking Management" magazine defines BNC = Bayonet Neill Concelman Make of this what you will. -- UUCP:harvard-\ att--\ | Douglas Otto 608 271-3333 ext 2346 ucbvax!uwvax!astroatc!nicmad!otto | Nicolet Instrument Corp. rutgers--/ rolls--/ | 5225-1 Verona Rd ames--/ decvax-/ | Madison, Wis 53711-0508
jeffw@midas.STS.TEK.COM (Jeff Winslow) (02/16/89)
In article <6918@fluke.COM> strong@tc.fluke.COM (Norm Strong) writes: >In article <11581@ihlpa.ATT.COM> pdg@ihlpa.UUCP (Paul D. Guthrie) writes: >}BNC = Baby N Connector. >}TNC = Threaded N Connector. >WRONG! WRONG! >BNC = Bayonet Navy Connector >TNC = Threaded Navy Connector No, wait... You're all right, every one of you. Is that fair? Jeff Winslow