gnd@tetons.UUCP (Greg Darnell) (08/04/89)
I would like to install a fire detection system in our horse barn.
All of the commercial alarm system installers that have been out to
give me an estimate would like to use "rate-of-rise" heat detectors
that sense a rapid increase in temperature accompanying a fire.
The installers believe that smoke detectors are not appropriate
for a dusty, open area (36' x 165') such as where the stalls are.
Unfortunately, the spec sheets for heat detectors have big warnings
that they are for property protection only, and that many types of
fires would generate fatal amounts of smoke before the detectors would
go off. Now, aside from the monetary value of the horses, which may
be far greater than the value of the barn, our emotional investment
in the horses is infinitely greater than in the building.
Therefore, I am looking for a method of barn fire detection
which will give better protection for the animals themselves.
If anyone has any experiences or ideas, please let me know. Also,
if you know of any sources where I can order the equipment and install
it myself, I would appreciate pointers to them. Local supply is limited
to Radio Shack, whose systems and sensors are probably not
sophisticated enough for this application. If there is sufficient
interest I will summarize all responses to the net.
Thanks.
Greg
--
Greg Darnell Amdahl Corporation 143 N. 2 E., Rexburg, Idaho 83440
UUCP:{ames,decwrl,sun,uunet}!amdahl!tetons!gnd (208) 356-8915
INTERNET: gnd@tetons.idaho.amdahl.combarry@hprmokg.HP.COM (Barry Fowler) (08/05/89)
You might send away for brochures from some of the burglar alarm companies. They also use sensors for home fire protection in conjunction with their alarm systems. Some manufacturers that come to mind are Honeywell and Ademco.
macy@fmsystm.UUCP (Macy Hallock) (08/09/89)
In article <825@tetons.UUCP> gnd@tetons.UUCP (Greg Darnell) writes: > > I would like to install a fire detection system in our horse barn. As the owner of an alarm company and holder of a State of Ohio Fire Alarm Installer's License, I have seen this application in the past. It's a tough one. If you wish to protect the lives of the building's occupants (as opposed to the structure itself), you will have to design to National Fire Protection Ass'n spec's... just like a hospital or other similar "Life Safety" application. Normally you would use smoke detectors, installed at spacing determined by square footage, with height of the ceiling (higher ceilings de-rate smoke detection) and ventilation taken in consideration. This appilcation presents some other unique problems, though. There are two common types of smoke detectors: photoelectric and ionization. (More on other types later.) Each type has its own weaknesses. Horse barns are usually not suitable for either type. The ammonia and dust in the air cause false alarms. Of the other types of detectors made, the flame-signature infrared/ ultraviolet system works best (except for smoldering, spontaneous combustion type fires, common in barns). This is what the military uses in jet hangars. It is -very- expensive, but since you have horses, you are used to spending large amounts of money ;-) From what horse owners tell me, they are as expensive as jet aircraft to maintain (and almost as expensive as teenagers to raise). :-) ! >All of the commercial alarm system installers that have been out to >give me an estimate would like to use "rate-of-rise" heat detectors >that sense a rapid increase in temperature accompanying a fire. Basically, you need a working fire with four to five feet of open flame to trigger one of these. Not suitable for life-safety protection. >The installers believe that smoke detectors are not appropriate >for a dusty, open area (36' x 165') such as where the stalls are. At least they have some idea of what they are talking about. All too many do not. How have I dealt with this problem in the past? 1. I warned the customer that this would be a somewhat expensive and a high maintenance installation, otherwise a high number of false alarms could be expected. And no other guarantees, either. 2. I used photoelectric detectors with detachable heads and placed them in the barn using NFPA and (especially!) the guidance of a factory fire safety engineer (NOT the sales rep). Usually I spaced them on 20 to 30 foot centers and was sure to keep them accessible for service. 3. I taught the customer to clean the detectors every two or three months, and made him keep a written record. 4. I designed the system with pre-warning: When tripped, a local beep tone sounds for thirty seconds before the main alarm signals to the central alarm station. This allows the cancellation of an alarm locally when caused by throwing hay bales (dust), etc. 5. I made sure the customer was one who kept the place clean in the first place. Be sure ALL components are UL listed for Fire Alarm use, including the wire (they will be plainly labeled as such). Get decent commercial rated equipment from a professional company. If you are going to do this yourself, get it designed by an experienced company. A poor installation is worse than no installation at all, it gives you a false sense of security. E-mail me or call me to get further specific suggestions. I don't wish to sound negative, but fire alarm engineering and installation is seldom successfully done by amateurs, at least without a LOT of help. (Just talk to your local insurance company loss prevention engineer or fire marshall for their ideas on this...) Regards, Macy Hallock fmsystm!macy@NCoast.ORG F M Systems, Inc. hal!ncoast!fmsystm!macy 150 Highland Dr. uunet!hal.cwru.edu!ncoast!fmsystm!macy Medina, OH 44256 Voice: 216-723-3000 X251 Fax: 216-723-3223 Disclaimer: My advice is worth what you paid for it. Your milage may vary.