[sci.electronics] 'Need help with 3.5" drives' or '3.5" drive blues'...

scheer@cell.mot.COM (Jon Scheer) (02/01/90)

[ My appologies to people on sci.electronics if this message isn't
appropriate for that group. ]


Hi folks,

   Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't things supposed to be better
with a '286 AT than with an XT ?? :-)

   Here's the story...

   I pieced together an XT over a year ago.  I got the system up and 
running.  It was stable.  The drives were configured as so :

	A: - 5.25" 360K floppy.
	B: - Tape streamer.
	C: - 20 meg hard drive.
	D: - Another 5.25" 360K floppy.
	E: - Switch selectable :
		- 5.25" 720K floppy, or
		- 3.5" 720K floppy.

   I had a 4 drive XT floppy controller (2 internal & 2 external).
Floppies A: and B: were 'physical' floppies (ie, they came up as
A: and B:).  D: and E: were 'logical' floppies (ie, I had to put
the command 'Device=Driver.Sys (appropriate parmeters)' in Config.Sys.

   In the course of setting up the system I discovered that I could
only run the 720K drives under PC-Dos 3.2.  I could not get them to
work under MS-Dos 3.2.  I don't remember if I tried PC-Dos 3.1.  At
the time, I didn't have MS-Dos 3.3, so I don't know if they would have
worked with that.

   So, given that I ran under PC-Dos 3.2 everything worked just fine.
That setup never gave me any problems.


   Now, about 4 month ago I upgraded the motherboard to a 12MHz '286, using
Phoenix Bios 3.10 01 (or 3.01 10 or something like that).

   The first thing I discovered was that I needed a new hard drive controller.
Ok, I got a new one of those.  Everything seemed to work except the
floppies.  They were acting up.

   Using the XT 4 drive controller, I could use A: and B: (as the 360K
and tape streamer).  I could use D: as a 360K, but E: would give me
a 'General Failure' error everytime I tried to access it.

   After calling and calling I finally got ahold of someone at Phoenix
Technologies.  After going through several people there I finally talked
to someone who told me why I was having problems with drive E:  He
said that :

	"AT's can only have 1 logical floppy.  XT's can have 2 [more?  I
don't remember if he said '2' or '2 or more'].  I can run 4 floppies if
I had a card that would run them as physical floppies (A: - D:, with the
hard drive as E:)."

   Ok.  That cleared up that problem, even though I think it's looney
that you can't have 2 logical drives on an AT (grumble grumble...)
I ended up getting a Hard Drive/Floppy Drive controller card that
would give me 2 internal floppies (360K, 720K, 1.2Meg or 1.44Meg).
Read on...

***

   Next problem.  I couldn't (and still can't) get my 3.5" drive (or
720K 5.25" drive) working on my AT.

   If I boot up with the 3.5" hooked up as B: (in place of the tape
streamer), it appears as if the AT 'finds' the drive upon boot up.
I define 'find' as: The drive Led goes on and you can hear/feel the
heads step (presumably the machine is stepping the heads to see how
many tracks are really there).

   I have tried booting with a formatted disk in the drive, an
unformatted disk in the drive, no disk in the drive.  I have changed 
the CMOS setup to 'No drive', 5.25 360K, 5.25 1.2Meg, 3.5 720K, 3.5
1.44Meg.  I have done all combinations of 'disk/nodisk' and 'setup'.  
I get the same results everytime :

	- If I boot with the 3.5" drive connected as B:, the Led on
the drive goes on (properly) when the machine boots, and you can 
hear the heads stepping.

	- After the machine boots, if I put a formatted disk into
the 3.5" drive and do a directory, the drive is accessed but I
get a "Sector not found" (or "Read failure", I think) error message.

	- If I put a blank disk in and try to format the disk, it
attempts to format Track 0, Head 0, then times-out and gives me
a "Media bad" error message.

   I also put the statement "DrivParm /D:1 /F:2" into my Config.Sys
and ran through the above steps.  No change.  Same problems.

+++

   Here's a kicker.  If I boot up with a 360K 5.25" drive connected
as B:, then disconnect the 360K and put the 3.5" drive in as B: (ie,
move the 34 pin connector), I can *read* 720K disks, but if I format
a disk, it only formats to 40 tracks (360K).

+++

   Another thing.  Two other friends upgraded their motherboards at
the same time I did.  One has the same motherboard and the same
HD/FF controller card.  He is only running 360K 5.25" drives.  One of
these days I will take my drive over and try it on his system.

   But the other friend has a different motherboard and different HD/FD
controller, but is experiencing the same problem of not having a 3.5"
drive recognized upon bootup.  He has to do the same "swap after 
booting" trick that I do.

***

   Sooooo.....   Here are my questions :

	1. Has anyone else experienced these problems?  I've tried
obvious (and some not so obvious :-) things, but the problems still remain.
The cables are fine, the drives are fine, etc.

	2. Could it be that I need MSDos 3.3 ?  (This will soon be 
verified; I'm 'borrowing' a copy to see if that clears up anything.  
Something tells me that I've tried it before, though.)

	3. Is there a PCDos 3.3?

	4. If I tell the system (via the CMOS Setup) that there are no
(or 1) floppies, why does the system go out and access the floppies
anyway?  What good is it to tell the system what you've got if it ignores
the setup and tries things itself?

   BTW, I ended up getting another case, power supply, etc so I could get
my XT working again with the 3.5" drive.  Now I have a Sneakernet system for
getting things to 3.5" 720K floppies...

***

   Thank you for taking time to read this.  I imagine that there are other
people who are experiencing similar problems.  Hopefully these problems
will be resolved.

   BTW, I would prefer an email response over posting; I don't always
get a chance to read this group.  Thanks :-)

   If there's enough interest in the replies or enough responses, I'll
summarize and repost.  If I get the problems resolved, I'll post a
message in nice, large fonts (:-) so no one will have to go through 
this same awful mess.  ;-)

   advTHANKSance.

Jon
1/31/90

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