agershon@sagpd1.UUCP (Arnie Gershon) (07/04/90)
I have a Panasonic model KX-T2355 speakerphone which I really like. I'm very impressed with its array of features. However, the instructions include installing some AA batteries and they forbid using alkaline (and I think also nicad) batteries, and insist that I use carbon-zinc batteries. Since everything else I have uses alkaline batteries, and they last longer, I buy them in quantity and I'd rather use them in this speakerphone also. I called Panasonic Customer Service, and was told that alkalines couldn't be used because when they were exhausted their leakage would ruin the device. I asked if carbon-zinc didn't have a similar problem, and they said no, they didn't. Does anybody know if this restriction makes sense?
faunt@dustbin.cisco.com (Doug Faunt N6TQS 415-688-8269) (07/06/90)
>I have never seen or heard of an >alkaline battery leaking where I have had many carbon zinc batteries leak. >These people have been fed some WRONG information. I can't address the original issue, but I have a flashlight at home that's got alkalines inside it, that have leaked so bad I haven't gotten them out yet. Soon, though. -- faunt@cisco.com 415-688-8269
jac@paul.rutgers.edu (Jonathan A. Chandross) (07/06/90)
bobt@pogo.WV.TEK.COM (Bob Tidrick) > Alkaline batteries have the cathode on the inside. The outer > part is carbon and it does not diminish. I have never seen or heard of an > alkaline battery leaking where I have had many carbon zinc batteries leak. > These people have been fed some WRONG information. I have had alkaline batteries leak and ruin equipment. Carbon-zinc batteries are DRY cells; take one apart and you'll find a black, tarry, very solid mixture. No how, no way is this going to leak. Alkaline cells are wet; hence the potential for leaks. Jonathan A. Chandross Internet: jac@paul.rutgers.edu UUCP: rutgers!paul.rutgers.edu!jac
jones@sj.ate.slb.com (Clark Jones) (07/06/90)
In article <9382@pogo.WV.TEK.COM> bobt@pogo.WV.TEK.COM (Bob Tidrick) writes: >In article <840@sagpd1.UUCP> agershon@sagpd1.UUCP (Arnie Gershon) writes: >>I have a Panasonic model KX-T2355 speakerphone which I really like. I'm >>very impressed with its array of features. >> >>However, the instructions include installing some AA batteries and they forbid >>using alkaline > >>I called Panasonic Customer Service, and was told that alkalines couldn't be >>used because when they were exhausted their leakage would ruin the device. I >>asked if carbon-zinc didn't have a similar problem, and they said no, they >>didn't. > >>Does anybody know if this restriction makes sense? > >No It doesn't. Carbon batteries use up the cathode which is Zinc and eat holes >through it. Since this is also the containment for the battery this is what >causes the leaks. Alkaline batteries have the cathode on the inside. The outer >part is carbon and it does not diminish. I have never seen or heard of an >alkaline battery leaking where I have had many carbon zinc batteries leak. >These people have been fed some WRONG information. > ----- Uh, I beg to disagree. Everything I've read indicates that if the device ever forces more than a few microamps back into the batteries, you must _NOT_ use alkalines, though carbon-zinc's are OK. The reason for not wanting NiCd's might be because of the lower operating voltage (1.25V/cell). Odds are that it is a misprint, but since all the literature from battery manufacturers says that the alkaline cells can _explode_ if "recharged", I'd be inclined to stick with the carbon-zinc's. (Or if you are adventurous, try some NiCd's. They'll probably work, and unless stored for many years, won't leak [I've had a few leak after 15 or so years in a drawer :-(].) Clark Disclaimer: The opinions expressed above are mine and not those of Schlumberger because they are NOT covered by the patent agreement!
henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) (07/06/90)
In article <Jul.5.17.12.11.1990.22728@paul.rutgers.edu> jac@paul.rutgers.edu (Jonathan A. Chandross) writes: >I have had alkaline batteries leak and ruin equipment. Carbon-zinc batteries >are DRY cells; take one apart and you'll find a black, tarry, very solid >mixture. No how, no way is this going to leak... Unfortunately, it can and does. "Dry" cells are dry in comparison to "wet" cells, which have sulfuric acid slopping around in them. The electrolyte in dry cells is still mobile enough to leak; they can and do leak. Alkalines can too, at the end of their lives (I too have seen it happen), but it is less likely and the lives are longer in the first place. -- "Either NFS must be scrapped or NFS | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology must be changed." -John K. Ousterhout | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry
jones@sj.ate.slb.com (Clark Jones) (07/06/90)
In article <1990Jul6.034230.17946@zoo.toronto.edu> henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: > > "Dry" cells are dry in comparison to >"wet" cells, which have sulfuric acid slopping around in them. Henry! You should know better than this! "Pocket plate" NiCd's use a solution of potassium hydroxide (KOH) plus a little lithium hydroxide (LiOH) "slopping around in them". They are _definitely_ "wet" cells. Only "lead-acid" "wet" cell batteries have sulfuric acid "slopping around in them". There are some other wet cell technologies, but lead-acid and NiCd are the most popular. (NiCd has some significant advantages over lead-acid, like 20 year life expectancy as opposed to 5 to 7 for lead acid, plus much lower maintenance than even the so-called "maintenance free" lead-acids.) Clark ...and I thought Henry knew everything... :-) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed above are mine and not those of Schlumberger because they are NOT covered by the patent agreement!
henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) (07/08/90)
In article <1990Jul6.152621.5542@sj.ate.slb.com> jones@sjs.sj.ate.slb.com (Clark Jones) writes: >> "Dry" cells are dry in comparison to >>"wet" cells, which have sulfuric acid slopping around in them. > >Henry! You should know better than this! "Pocket plate" NiCd's use a solution >of potassium hydroxide (KOH) plus a little lithium hydroxide (LiOH) "slopping >around in them". They are _definitely_ "wet" cells. Only "lead-acid" "wet" >cell batteries have sulfuric acid "slopping around in them"... Picky, picky, picky. :-) There are various wet-cell chemistries around, most of them with fairly specialized uses only. (For example, there's one that uses plain salt water as the electrolyte. Its performance is not impressive, but it's used anyway for some portable military applications, where it's useful that it doesn't spray corrosive chemicals around if it gets a hole shot in it.) I was being picturesque rather than precise, always a mistake on Usenet... :-) >...and I thought Henry knew everything... :-) I do, but I don't always tell all of it. :-) :-) :-) -- "Either NFS must be scrapped or NFS | Henry Spencer at U of Toronto Zoology must be changed." -John K. Ousterhout | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry
bill@vrdxhq.verdix.com (William Spencer) (07/11/90)
in article <1990Jul7.231235.6125@zoo.toronto.edu>, henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) says: > Picky, picky, picky. :-) There are various wet-cell chemistries around, > most of them with fairly specialized uses only. (For example, there's one > that uses plain salt water as the electrolyte. Its performance is not > impressive, but it's used anyway for some portable military applications, > where it's useful that it doesn't spray corrosive chemicals around if it > gets a hole shot in it.) I was being picturesque rather than precise, > always a mistake on Usenet... :-) While we're getting picturesque, I saw a radio designed for nuclear survival. The battery is started by pouring water into it. THe radio had gold plate on it and everything! bill S.
ardai@teda.UUCP (Mike Ardai) (07/16/90)
In article <35313@vrdxhq.verdix.com> bill@vrdxhq.verdix.com (William Spencer) writes:
-in article <1990Jul7.231235.6125@zoo.toronto.edu>, henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) says:
-> Picky, picky, picky. :-) There are various wet-cell chemistries around,
-> most of them with fairly specialized uses only. (For example, there's one
-> that uses plain salt water as the electrolyte.
-While we're getting picturesque, I saw a radio designed for nuclear survival.
I was just on an airplane flight, and the batteries that powered the blinky
lights on the floatation vests used salt water as both the electrolyte and
the power switch. As soon as the vest hits the water, it enters the battery
and turns on the light.
/mike
--
\|/ Michael L. Ardai Teradyne EDA East
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/|\ ...!sun!teda!ardai (preferred) or ardai@bu-pub.bu.edu