whester@isis.cs.du.edu (William R. Hester) (10/17/90)
In article <1118@cameron.egr.duke.edu> wdp@dukee.egr.duke.edu (William D. Palmer) writes: >Friday, 12 OCT 90 > >Simon Kravis writes: > >> From: skravis@csis.dit.csiro.au (Simon Kravis) >> Subject: Stock control tags >> Date: 12 Oct 90 04:48:01 GMT >> >> Does anyone know how the detection system for the metallic tags attach d to >> CDs and other small and valuable items in shops works? ... > >The tags of this type that I have seen are LC tank circuits. A flat coi is >made of copper (or some other non-magnetic material) with a capacitor (s mply >two layers of foil separated by an insulator) made of some magnetic meta in >the center. The coil and capacitor are connected in parallel. When the >magnetic material in the center is demagnetized, the flat coil will have a >certain inductance, producing one resonant frequency for the tank. Magn tize Looks like there are different types of detectors...the tags that I took apart do have the L-C resonant tank circuit but also have a small diode which I assume acts as a frequency doubler or tripler and re-radiates a signal on a harmonic which is then picked up as an alarm. -- Bill Hester, Ham Radio N0LAJ, Denver CO., USA Please route replies to: whester@isis.cs.du.edu or uunet!isis!whester Public Access Unix @ University of Denver, Denver Colorado USA (no official affiliation with the above university)
hbg6@citek.mcdphx.mot.com (10/29/90)
In article <21626@ucsd.Edu> brian@ucsd.Edu (Brian Kantor) writes: >ken@csis.dit.csiro.au (Ken Yap) writes: >>I recently bought >>goods at one store, had the tags deactivated, then went into another >>store and set off the alarms upon exit. A mildly embarassing search >>followed. Fortunately I had a receipt and bag from the first store. > >It'd be more than mildly embarrassing if they tried to search me, alarm >or no. I will not let any store personnel search me or my bags until after >they have notified me that I'm under arrest. Since I don't steal, we'll >then have a very nice time discussing the amount of the false arrest >settlement. > - Brian This did happen to me at a local Kmart. No tags but the "security" guy said he saw me put something in my front pocket. I did, a somewhat used Kleenex. The manager told me to empty my pocets and I refused. When the cops showed up, they asked me to empty my pockets and I said I sould not submit to a search and they would have to arrest me. The cop said they could not and the security guy would have to. They also pointed out the dangers of false arrest to the jerk. He declined, the cops left, and I've never gone to the store again. John
rrw@naucse.cse.nau.edu (Robert Wier) (10/30/90)
In article <13911@mcdphx.phx.mcd.mot.com>, hbg6@citek.mcdphx.mot.com writes: > This did happen to me at a local Kmart. No tags but the "security" guy > said he saw me put something in my front pocket. I did, a somewhat > used Kleenex. The manager told me to empty my pocets and I refused. > When the cops showed up, they asked me to empty my pockets and I said > I sould not submit to a search and they would have to arrest me. The > cop said they could not and the security guy would have to. They also > pointed out the dangers of false arrest to the jerk. He declined, the > cops left, and I've never gone to the store again. > > John I guess the only thing about this, which I might not have been able to resist, would be to empty my pockets with the cops watching once I was outside... probably some legal reason not to do this, though... - Bob Wier -------------- insert favorite standard disclaimers here ---------- College of Engineering Northern Arizona University / Flagstaff, Arizona Internet: rrw@naucse.cse.nau.edu | BITNET: WIER@NAUVAX | WB5KXH or uucp: ...arizona!naucse!rrw
roy@phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith) (10/31/90)
> the "security" guy said he saw me put something in my front pocket. I > did, a somewhat used Kleenex. The manager told me to empty my pocets and > I refused. What's your problem? The security guy's job is to make sure that people don't walk out of the store without paying for stuff, a perfectly valid goal for a store attempting to make money. He didn't pick on you at random, or even because you fit some profile of what he considers a high-risk based on sex, age, and/or skin color, but because he had good reason to suspect you were stealing something, i.e. he saw you put something in your pocket, which, indeed, you say you did. The guard's only problem is that he wasn't following you around closely enough that he could discern that it was indeed a Kleenex, not a piece of merchandise you were attempting to steal. The guy's just doing his job, give him a break. -- Roy Smith, Public Health Research Institute 455 First Avenue, New York, NY 10016 roy@alanine.phri.nyu.edu -OR- {att,cmcl2,rutgers,hombre}!phri!roy "Arcane? Did you say arcane? It wouldn't be Unix if it wasn't arcane!"
hbg6@citek.mcdphx.mot.com (10/31/90)
In article <1990Oct30.181149.226@phri.nyu.edu> roy@phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith) writes: >> the "security" guy said he saw me put something in my front pocket. I >> did, a somewhat used Kleenex. The manager told me to empty my pocets and >> I refused. > > What's your problem? The security guy's job is to make sure that >people don't walk out of the store without paying for stuff, a perfectly >valid goal for a store attempting to make money. He didn't pick on you at >random, or even because you fit some profile of what he considers a > [........] > The guy's just doing his job, give him a break. I'm sorry, no. The guy was a jerk going overboard with his little power trip. It's impossible to relate his tone of voice or attitude in a brief news post but trust me he did not approach the issue with a professional bearing. There probable dozens of ways I could have been confronted where I would have gladly cooperated. "I got you a$$$$le, come with me" is not one of them. John (I think I'll drop this before someone points out its non-sci.elec nature) ..................................................................... reply to 'from' address; hbg6@citek.mcdphx.mot.com NOT the 'sender' line address! Someday my sysadm will decide this is a 'real' problem. :-) ..................................................................... All opinions expressed are mine and not Motorolas, their loss. .....................................................................
gordon@prls.UUCP (Gordon Vickers) (11/01/90)
In some previous article, somebody wrote: >> the "security" guy said he saw me put something in my front pocket. I >> did, a somewhat used Kleenex. The manager told me to empty my pocets and >> I refused. > In article <1990Oct30.181149.226@phri.nyu.edu> roy@phri.nyu.edu (Roy Smith) writes: > What's your problem? The security guy's job is to make sure that >people don't walk out of the store without paying for stuff, a perfectly [ WARNING: I'm not spelling worth a damn today. Save your flames.] :-) One doesn't make accusations irresponsably. There are alot of valid reasons why a customer may put something that they themselves own, into a pocket. The guard had no reason to suspect that the object was store property. Wouldn't you feel several differant emotions if it were YOU the guard had stopped ? I had a similar experiance when I was a kid. I was shopping for a small ("Tot") stapler. The guard saw me looking at them, and he also saw some open packages with the staplers gone. Rather than buy the stapler, I decided to just buy more staples for my old stapler. Just as I was leaving the check-out, the guard stopped me, looked in the bag to see what I had bought, and then had me empty my pockets. It was a horriable experiance. Lots of customers walking by, looking at me and many problably making the wrong conclusions. It was humiliating, embarressing, and degrading. I tried to rationalize it my telling myself that the guard was just doing his job. But, he wasn't ! My rights were violated and for years afterwards, I would get tense everytime I was leaving a store, wondering if some guard would stop me again. I think the gentalman above acted properly. The guard will prehaps be more respectful of the rights of others, choosing to be more carefull and avoid wasting time on a conjucture. Gordon Vickers 408/991-5370 {mips,pyramid|philabs}!prls!gordon Signetics in Sunnyvale,Ca (USA) Earth is a complex array of symbiotic relationships: Every extinction, whether animal, mineral, vegetable, or cultural hastens our own demise.
rbrink@hubcap.clemson.edu (Rick Brink) (11/01/90)
From article <46609@prls.UUCP>, by gordon@prls.UUCP (Gordon Vickers): >> What's your problem? The security guy's job is to make sure that >>people don't walk out of the store without paying for stuff, a perfectly > > One doesn't make accusations irresponsably. There are alot of valid > reasons why a customer may put something that they themselves own, into > a pocket. The guard had no reason to suspect that the object was store > property. > Wouldn't you feel several differant emotions if it were YOU the guard > had stopped ? > I had a similar experiance when I was a kid. I was shopping for a > small ("Tot") stapler. The guard saw me looking at them, and he also > I think the gentalman above acted properly. The guard will prehaps > be more respectful of the rights of others, choosing to be more carefull > and avoid wasting time on a conjucture. > Gordon and others overly sympathic: Like most everything else in life, store security is not perfect. It may be one of the least perfect things we can think of. But what are the alternatives. Right. I know you probably have suggestions, and more war stories to share, but who pays for your comfort? I managed a bookstore for 4 years in florida. (Aside from the lowlife that thinks all books are in libraries, ie. free to read) the biggest day to day problem a retailer faces is how to control stock. Your but 10 items from the distributor, sell 3 and have none on the shelves. Where did they go? A lot of it goes out the back door with dishonest employees. But unless you hired a real thief, most of it goes out the front, under the shirts, in the trosers, purses, bags, etc. of your customers. It is very unconfortable being stopped and questioned. If some real creton does it, it's positively outrageous. But we lost 10 to 15 percent of our stock to thieves each year. If your freinds came over for Pizza, once a week, and only stold 1 in 10 of the CD's, Software packages, guns, Video tapes, etc., it would not be ok with you. You'd look for new friends! In business, you're not always dealing with friends. You have even less patience with people who are looking at merchandise that you have real $$$$s invested in, puting things into their pockets. If you are standing looking at refrigrators, security guards might not be too suspicious. But if you are standing at a cosmetics counter? (Yea, guys steal mascaria too). Expect to be watched. If you get treated unfairly, ask to speak to the manager. If s/he is as bad an ass as the guard, call the police yourself. Don't let your rights get tromped, but remember, your at the stores party. They're just trying to separete their friends from the theives. Who pays for the thieves pizza? You do.
wrf@mab.ecse.rpi.edu (Wm Randolph Franklin) (11/03/90)
In article <11315@hubcap.clemson.edu> rbrink@hubcap.clemson.edu (Rick Brink) writes: > Like most everything else in life, store security is not perfect. By their own choice, often. The stores, bookstores included, go out of their way to make both impulse buying and shoplifting easy by piling things in the aisles, putting displays everywhere, etc. I've been in many stores where I had to walk sideways or push the merchandise aside to get down the aisle. An overly obnoxious guard could easily think I was stealing then. -- Wm. Randolph Franklin Internet: wrf@ecse.rpi.edu (or @cs.rpi.edu) Bitnet: Wrfrankl@Rpitsmts Telephone: (518) 276-6077; Telex: 6716050 RPI TROU; Fax: (518) 276-6261 Paper: ECSE Dept., 6026 JEC, Rensselaer Polytechnic Inst, Troy NY, 12180