ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) (05/07/91)
(From a thread in comp.sys.apple2) Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mark Wistey... gmw1142%msu3.dnet@mtsunix1 (BITNet) | Bicycling, Apple II's, gmw1142%msu3.dnet@terra.oscs.montana.edu (InterNet) | Christ-like living, Quad D, #308, Bozeman, MT 59715, USA (BikeNet) | Music, and Physics :-)
fargo@iear.arts.rpi.edu (Irwin M. Fargo) (05/07/91)
In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >(From a thread in comp.sys.apple2) >Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? >What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) > Although I've never tried this myself, a friend recommended WD-40 or silicone spray for gummed up keys. I suggested it to another friend of mine and he said it worked great. If you spray the board lightly, clean the soda off, and then wipe off the silicone, there shouldn't be any problems. Anyone know what might go wrong with this idea? -- Thank you and happy hunting! Actually: Ethan M. Young Internet: fargo@iear.arts.rpi.edu Please press 1 on your touch tone Bitnet (??): userfp9m@rpitsmts.bitnet phone to speak to God... Disclaimer: Who said what?
stevem@specialix.co.uk (Steven Murray) (05/07/91)
ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >(From a thread in comp.sys.apple2) >Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? >What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) If you get it quickly after the accident, get some a little water in there before you start the real work - but I wouldn't 'run it under the tap' so much I think. The best way to clean it up would be to use Isopropyl alcohol and heaps of paper towels and cotton buds. The alcohol is a solvent that will disolve just about anything messy on a circuit board (including flux), but it is important to 'Sop it up' with something absorbent before it evaporates, or else you will just be leaving a uniform film of whatever you were trying to clean off. BTW Deionized water is used to clean circuit boards in some PCB production plants. Regards Steven Murray -- Steven Murray uunet!slxsys!stevem stevem@specialix.co.uk I am speaking, but | If these are your opinions, then we are in agreement!! not for my employer.| Flames, spelling errors, complaints > /dev/null
henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) (05/07/91)
In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards... Clean, fresh water is not very corrosive. It may be worth trying as a last resort. I'd recommend taking the keyboard apart, though, so you can rinse the innards directly and so they will dry relatively quickly. Water sitting on the board for a while is bad news. -- And the bean-counter replied, | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology "beans are more important". | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry
miker@polari.UUCP (Mike Ranta) (05/08/91)
>Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? >What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) > Cleaning PC boards in water is _not_ normally a problem. In fact, nearly every board in your PC was probably washed that way after it was soldered. The company I work for produces AT and PS/2 bus boards and they are washed in a dishwasher with special flux remover "soap" after final assembly. The exception to this rule are certain components such as some relays, switches, connectors, etc. Certain kinds can trap the water, and hence some of the dirty residue, and it causes problems. ICs, resistors, caps, and the PC board material itself are all very immune to water. I'd wash your keyboard out with hot water and perhaps a very dilute solution of Ivory liquid. At least you don't stand much to lose....
wm1h+@andrew.cmu.edu (Wayne Alan Martin) (05/08/91)
Sory about the previous post. >From a another post Although I've never tried this myself, a friend recommended WD-40 or silicone spray for gummed up keys. I suggested it to another friend of mine and he said it worked great. If you spray the board lightly, clean the soda off, and then wipe off the silicone, there shouldn't be any problems. Anyone know what might go wrong with this idea? -- Thank you and happy hunting! Actually: Ethan M. Young Internet: fargo@iear.arts.rpi.edu Please press 1 on your touch tone Bitnet (??): userfp9m@rpitsmts.bitnet phone to speak to God... Disclaimer: Who said what? >Not necessary wrong, but I would really recommend against getting silicone on the key switch contacts. Suggestion, try plastic safe tuner cleaner, hopefully better for the case than silicone or WD-40. Wayne Martin Dr.FeelGood Want a soda? Yeah! Here catch! Arghh.....! splash.
csmith@plains.NoDak.edu (Carl Smith) (05/08/91)
In article <1991May7.153627.4590@zoo.toronto.edu> henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: >In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >>Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >>computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. >Clean, fresh water is not very corrosive. It may be worth trying as a >last resort. I'd recommend taking the keyboard apart, though, so you can >rinse the innards directly and so they will dry relatively quickly. Water >sitting on the board for a while is bad news. If you try this, and least take the guts of the keyboard out of the case. It would be difficult to get all the water out of the corners of the case of a fully assembled keyboard. Also, if something posseses you to dry it with a hair dryer, be careful not to melt the key caps. I once removed the circuit board and washed the mechanical parts of a keyboard (the key caps, shafts, springs, and contact pads were all mounted in a metal sheet that could be removed from the PCB in one piece) and used a hair dryer to dry it. It was a little too hot, and the space bar warped a little, making it stick occasionally. I then cleaned the PCB with alcohol, put the two parts back together, and all has worked perfectly ever since. >-- >And the bean-counter replied, | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology >"beans are more important". | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry Carl D. Smith Jr. Electrical and Electronics Engineering North Dakota State University, Fargo, ND
phil@brahms.amd.com (Phil Ngai) (05/08/91)
I once tried to clean a VT220 keyboard with water. Never worked again. -- The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
whinery@hale.ifa.hawaii.edu (Alan Whinery) (05/09/91)
In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >(From a thread in comp.sys.apple2) >Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? >What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) Actually the idea of the dishwasher scares me -- all that heat. But as far as rinsing a board, there's nothing wrong with that, as long as you can dry it fast. The danger from water only comes from being energized, when things short to other things. I recall one incident (don't try this at home) when I was a consultant to the Navy when 3 entire computers were dropped into SALT water. They were retrieved, hosed out, and blown dry with a high pressure air hose. Two of the 3 passed diagnostics. Here at my present job, we frequently do final cleaning on prototype boards with trichloroethylene, after which they are rinsed with tap water and blown dry with an air hose. I don't know what the ramifications of not blowing it out would be, but if you use your head and be careful of nooks and crannies where water would hole up, it should work OK. Alan whinery@hale.ifa.hawaii.edu -- ========================================================================= | D. Alan Whinery| The Institute for Astronomy, University of Hawaii | | Technical Genius| Internet: whinery@hale.ifa.hawaii.edu | | Potential Writer| 71350.3005@compuserve.com
fmgst@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Filip Gieszczykiewicz) (05/09/91)
In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >(From a thread in comp.sys.apple2) >Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? >What's the best way to clean a pop-filled keyboard? (BTW, it's not mine.) > Greetings. Hmmm... whenever I get fix something (old and dusty) I take an old toothbrush, a bucket of warm water, and a bar of soap and clean the PCB.... Then I put it in such a position that 2 fans push air over and below the board (drying both sides) Hasn't failed me yet: I can see what I'm soldering, the chips last longer (wash off the oil and grime), and I can see all the solder joints :-) By the way, I've done this with motherboards, HV boards, keyboards, modems, you name it - NOTE: give the wet thing some time to dry ;-) Take care. P.S. Not responsible for fools plugging in wet motherboard and expecting everything to be "peachy" -- _______________________________________________________________________________ "The Force will be with you, always." It _is_ with me and has been for 11 years Filip Gieszczykiewicz "... a Jedi does it with a mind trick... " ;-) FMGST@PITTVMS or fmgst@unix.cis.pitt.edu "My ideas. ALL MINE!!"
wolfgang@wsrcc.com (Wolfgang S. Rupprecht) (05/09/91)
phil@brahms.amd.com (Phil Ngai) writes: >I once tried to clean a VT220 keyboard with water. Never worked again. I once cleaned a Wyse-75 keyboard with Sammy Adams. It never was the same again either. ;-) Even the subsequent washings with tap water didn't help. Some keys stayed electrically dirty. Perhaps one day I'll try to inject some Cramolin into the really bouncy switches (and watch them stop working all together). -wolfgang -- Wolfgang Rupprecht wolfgang@wsrcc.com (or) uunet!wsrcc!wolfgang Snail Mail Address: Box 6524, Alexandria, VA 22306-0524
nick@spider.co.uk (Nick Felisiak) (05/13/91)
In article <1991May7.153627.4590@zoo.toronto.edu> henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: > > [ re cleaning keyboard soaked in soda with water ] > >Clean, fresh water is not very corrosive. It may be worth trying as a >last resort. I'd recommend taking the keyboard apart, though, so you can >rinse the innards directly and so they will dry relatively quickly. Water >sitting on the board for a while is bad news. But don't, as a friend of mine tried, use a hair dryer! The way he told it, the keys 'went all funny', and the manufacturing people downstairs (he worked for a small manufacturer!) couldn't really explain what had happened! Nick -- Nick Felisiak nick@spider.co.uk Spider Systems Ltd +44 31 554 9424
richard@mee.tcd.ie (05/13/91)
Someone had a similar problem last year, and their novel solution was to bring the keyboard into the shower with them. This worked a treat (or so they said), just be sure to leave the keyboard in a warm area to dry out for 2 or 3 days afterwards. As regards using solvent cleaners like Isoclene, they're by far the best way of cleaning keyboards if you can get access to the pcb-to-key surface area (just try opening an IBM 406 keyboard), but if you can't or don't wish to go in deep, try a good hot shower. Richard, Richard Bolger // Trinity College Dublin // rbolger@vax1.tcd.ie Republic of Ireland //
rolande@kuling.UUCP (Roland Eriksson) (05/13/91)
>>Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >>computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >>water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards. Who's right? I have never cleaned any keyboard (a pocket calculator though) under the tap, but i have cleaned ceveral other electronic circuit boards under lukewarm tap water. Afterwards i usually use a fan for drying (no heat). As long as all IC cases are intact i think there should be no side-effects with the above mentioned practice. I have never had any really bad cases of contaminated circuits, but if you *MUST* use a detergent use the mildest you can get. If the keyboard is of membrane type you may get some problems with water "inside" the membrane. >Although I've never tried this myself, a friend recommended WD-40 or silicone >spray for gummed up keys. I suggested it to another friend of mine and he >said it worked great. WD-40 if *GREAT* anything technical that is not working the way it should works BETTER with a few drops :-). The ozone may go away or i might get cancer or something, but i works wonder for any kind of contact problems. It is good for old clocks too. And it smells nice too. IMHO use water for cleaning the keyboard, and use WD-40 afterwards to fix it if it does not work. Good luck, Roland Eriksson.
beyo@beyonet.UUCP (Steve Urich) (05/14/91)
In article <2053@kuling.UUCP>, rolande@kuling.UUCP (Roland Eriksson) writes: > WD-40 if *GREAT* anything technical that is not working the way it should > works BETTER with a few drops :-). The ozone may go away or i might get > cancer or something, but i works wonder for any kind of contact problems. > It is good for old clocks too. And it smells nice too. <*> WD-40 is generally used in water-proofing sparkplug wires, distributers. Help stop sqeaks :-). Its does remove and help clean circuit boards, but its not very good for dusty fan blown enclosures. The film of WD-40 lasts a long time on the PCB. Dust bunnies will have a ball, not to mention once the film dries up the bunnies will be harder to get off. Unless you have a UUCP site in the middle of the Amazon and you don't want the local fungus to munch away on your PCB's. Blueshower by Tech Spray (24oz can) is what I use to blow away bunnies. Easy to use, has lots of pressure, ozone friendly (Thats what the can says) :-) and evaporates in approx. 5 minutes. No oily film and dry as a whistle. Doesn't hurt most plastics, works without having to remove the PCB. Steve Urich WB3FTP
jimc@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM (Jim Cathey) (05/15/91)
In article <2053@kuling.UUCP> rolande@kuling.UUCP (Roland Eriksson) writes: >WD-40 if *GREAT* anything technical that is not working the way it should >works BETTER with a few drops :-). The ozone may go away or i might get >cancer or something, but i works wonder for any kind of contact problems. >It is good for old clocks too. And it smells nice too. Gack. WD-40 is something like 40 weight motor oil with a solvent in it. After a while the solvent evaporates leaving this gummy oily residue all over the place. It's even stickier than what was there before you sprayed it all over. I've 'ruined' stuff with this. Ruined means that I had to _really_ take things apart and clean properly. Much more trouble than just doing it right in the first place. (For an old clock, I'd use some sort of real solvent, followed by proper lubrication using a fine machine oil.) >IMHO use water for cleaning the keyboard, and use WD-40 afterwards to fix >it if it does not work. Water's cool. Just save WD-40 for what it's good for: Cutting into rusty car parts and door hinges, curing squeaks in large machinery, air freshener... For a keyboard, I'd use just water (if it will cut whatever), followed by maybe an ethyl or isopropyl alcohol rinse and dry. It is crucial that prompt _complete_ drying take place. This will probably involve disassembly of the keyboard. I "pepsi-syndromed" an old computer of mine, and tub-dunked the keyboard to get it off. It took days to dry by itself before it worked again, and it stopped working after a few more weeks. I ended up taking _every_ little keyswitch apart (after desoldering them from the board) and cleaning the green corrosion off the contacts in the switches. Yuck. +----------------+ ! II CCCCCC ! Jim Cathey ! II SSSSCC ! ISC-Bunker Ramo ! II CC ! TAF-C8; Spokane, WA 99220 ! IISSSS CC ! UUCP: uunet!isc-br!jimc (jimc@isc-br.isc-br.com) ! II CCCCCC ! (509) 927-5757 +----------------+ "With excitement like this, who is needing enemas?"
berger@clio.sts.uiuc.edu (Mike Berger) (05/17/91)
henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: >In article <0094836B.DA657A80@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu> ieeug330@Eagle.oscs.montana.edu (Mark Wistey) writes: >>Someone claimed that the best way to clean a contaminated (e.g. soda pop) >>computer keyboard was to disconnect it and run it under tap water. I thought >>water was enough of a solvent to cause damage to circuit boards... >Clean, fresh water is not very corrosive. It may be worth trying as a >last resort. I'd recommend taking the keyboard apart, though, so you can >rinse the innards directly and so they will dry relatively quickly. Water >sitting on the board for a while is bad news. *---- First, there isn't much more corrosive than coke or pepsi! If you're cleaning that off a keyboard, don't worry about what water might do. Secondly, I'll verify that clean water isn't very corrosive. It's also not very electrolytic. I just started cleaning up a foot of water in my basement from the latest flood - it was high enough, unfortunately, to get some of the stuff up on pallets. The biggest worry about clean water is what it deposits behind. Eliminate that concern by rinsing and drying. In this case, the basement electrical circuit was submerged (ie. uninsulated live contacts were completely underwater) but it remained live (and so did I) so I could fix the sump pump and plug it back in and drain the basement. -- Mike Berger Department of Statistics, University of Illinois AT&TNET 217-244-6067 Internet berger@atropa.stat.uiuc.edu
abeals@catnip.berkeley.ca.us (Andrew Scott Beals) (05/18/91)
phil@brahms.amd.com (Phil Ngai) writes: >I once tried to clean a VT220 keyboard with water. Never worked again. I thought folks at AMD cleaned their VT220 keyboards with coffee. Or that's what *I* remember at least. I would have liked to clean mine with lead. -- Andrew Scott Beals KC6SSS abeals@catnip.berkeley.ca.us ...!apple!catnip.berkeley.ca.us!abeals
chuck@hplvec.LVLD.HP.COM (Chuck Bade) (05/21/91)
I see lots of different advise here, which should clearly indicate there are different solutions (no pun intended) to this problem. The truth is that not all keyboards are created equally, (i.e. mechanical vs optical, mylar film, etc) so the clean-up technique should be suitable to the equipment involved. If you are paid a decent salary for the time you spend at your keyboard, you would probably save them money by pitching the thing and grabbing a new one "off the shelf". What is your time worth? I speak only for myself and not the company. One of our engineers here tries to recycle blank white paper in the LaserJet and usually ends up jamming it, then everyone else (many of them well paid engineers) waits for their printouts, while I try to un-jam it. Chuck Bade HP Integrated Circuits Business Division Specialty Technology Fab, Loveland chuck@hpfire.hp.com (telnet/303) 679-3649