chad@anasaz.UUCP (Chad R. Larson) (02/10/90)
A couple of years ago, I posted to this group the source to a utility
I wrote. I was beaten up rather roughly for having done so. My
recollection is that this group was gatewayed onto the Internet
somehow and that someone there had a restriction on source and/or
binaries floating by. They threatened (or were required, I forget) to
break the gateway rather than allow programs to transit their systems.
Is this still so? Are binaries or source postings discouraged (or
worse, punished)? Is this group constrained to be discussions of old
systems and mutual help in supporting them?
Please let me know. I've got a couple of other (semi)nifty programs I
have written that I'm willing to place in the public domain. They are
CP/M specific, so I can see no reason to clutter up some other source
newsgroup with them, but I'd post them here. If that is not a good
idea (for political or other reasons beyond our control), I'd like to
start the formal voting procedure to establish a group for source
and/or binaries postings that are for CP/M and MP/M systems.
We, like the MS-DOS people, have the luxury of binary compatability
across most of our systems. I'll bet there is a ton of useful goodies
we have all written that we should be able to share. How 'bout it?
I'll show you mine, if you'll show me yours....
-crl
--
Chad R. Larson ...{mcdphx,asuvax}!anasaz!chad or chad@anasaz.UUCP
Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020
(602) 870-3330 "I read the news today, oh boy!" -- John Lennonw8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL (Keith Petersen) (02/11/90)
Chad, binary/source postings are inappropriate for any discussion
group, but especially for those gatewayed to mailing lists on the
Internet side.
The comp.os.cpm newsgroup is gatewayed to the Info-Cpm mailing list.
Many mailing list subscribers have disk quotas and some are charged
for disk storage.
There is an excellent public domain archive at SIMTEL20 which is
accessable by all readers of this newsgroup. The problem is that for
the past two years there has only been ONE reader who has sent a
program contribution to the archives. I can't do it all myself.
If you have public domain CP/M programs you want to share with others,
please send a message to me asking for upload instructions.
Keith
--
Keith Petersen
Maintainer of SIMTEL20's CP/M, MSDOS, & MISC archives [IP address 26.2.0.74]
Internet: w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.Army.Mil, w8sdz@brl.arpa BITNET: w8sdz@NDSUVM1
Uucp: {ames,decwrl,harvard,rutgers,ucbvax,uunet}!wsmr-simtel20.army.mil!w8sdzchad@anasaz.UUCP (Chad R. Larson) (02/12/90)
In article <KPETERSEN.12565398949.BABYL@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL> w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL (Keith Petersen) writes: +--------------- | Chad, binary/source postings are inappropriate for any discussion | group, but especially for those gatewayed to mailing lists on the | Internet side. +--------------- I guess, in my imprecise way, that was what I was asking...Is this newsgroup an appropriate forum for source and/or binary postings? What makes this a "discussion group"? +--------------- | There is an excellent public domain archive at SIMTEL20 which is | accessable by all readers of this newsgroup. +--------------- I'm sure it is very easy to get some things off SIMTEL20 if you are an Internet participant and can use FTP. I'm not. I have tried to use the gateway server at North Dakota(?) on three or four occasions, following the proceedures posted and never gotten anything back (not even a "F.O." message). I gave it up as unworkable, due to whatever reason (broken mailers, bad paths, terminal stupidity on my part). Anyway, having to pull indexes (if you ever figure out how), examine the one line descriptions to try to guess if you might want the <whatever>, then pulling <whatever> to examine it in its fullness just isn't quite the same as reading the news, scanning the posted source as it sails by your face and typing "s" to rn when you see something you like/want/need (like I can do in all the other sources newsgroups). [An aside to Keith--let's make e-mail contact. Maybe you can teach me how to work the gateway.] So, I'll renew my query. Are source and/or binary postings a no no in this group (beginning to sound like it)? If so, I'll start the formal discussion and voting procedure to establish a group exclusively for program postings. This group can serve as the discussion group for the postings in addition to its current charter and Keith will have another place to glom programs for his archive. If the formal vote fails for lack of interest, I'll pipe down. +--------------- | Keith +--------------- -crl -- Chad R. Larson ...{mcdphx,asuvax}!anasaz!chad or chad@anasaz.UUCP Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 (602) 870-3330 "I read the news today, oh boy!" -- John Lennon
ianj@sactoh0.UUCP (Ian R. Justman) (02/13/90)
In article <1289@anasaz.UUCP>, chad@anasaz.UUCP (Chad R. Larson) writes: > > I'm sure it is very easy to get some things off SIMTEL20 if you are an > Internet participant and can use FTP. I'm not. I have tried to use the > gateway server at North Dakota(?) on three or four occasions, following > the proceedures posted and never gotten anything back (not even a "F.O." > message). I gave it up as unworkable, due to whatever reason (broken > mailers, bad paths, terminal stupidity on my part). I'm not an Internet participant either, but I have the facilities to get those files from SIMTEL20. I have a couple of shell script files that I use here, and at one point, I posted them for those who wanted them. I'll post it again, plus I'll mail you a copy. Keith: You might want to keep a copy of this just in case... #-------- BEGIN ----------------- # 'file' is location of a temporary file file=/usr/tmp/simreq # 'me' is my mail address me=ames!pacbell!sactoh0!ijsys!ianj # 'listserv' is address of list server listserv=ames!vm1.nodak.edu!listserv # print help if they goofed if (test "$#" -ne "3") then echo "USAGE: getsimtel <disk> <directory> <filename>" echo echo "EXAMPLE: getsimtel pd1 msdos.filedocs simibm.arc" exit fi echo "Processing SIMTEL request . . . . please wait a minute." echo echo "/PDGET MAIL $1:<$2>$3 ( UUENCODE" > $file # mail our request, 'fastmail' from ELM product fastmail -r $me -F $me -s Request $file $listserv echo "getsimtel done" echo echo "SIMTEL request sent. Please wait a day or so for receipt." rm $file #--------- END -------------------------- That's for the North Dakota ListServer. Here's the other one I use. #-------- BEGIN ----------------- # 'file' is location of a temporary file file=/usr/tmp/simreq # 'me' is my mail address me=ames!pacbell!sactoh0!ijsys!ianj # 'listserv' is address of list server listserv=ames!vm.ecs.rpi.edu!listserv # print help if they goofed if (test "$#" -ne "3") then echo "USAGE: getsimtel <disk> <directory> <filename>" echo echo "EXAMPLE: getsimtel pd1 msdos.filedocs simibm.arc" exit fi echo "Processing SIMTEL request . . . . please wait a minute." echo echo "/PDGET MAIL $1:<$2>$3 ( UUENCODE" > $file # mail our request, 'fastmail' from ELM product fastmail -r $me -F $me -s Request $file $listserv echo "getsimtel done" echo echo "SIMTEL request sent. Please wait a day or so for receipt." rm $file #--------- END -------------------------- OK, that ought to help. As far as getting listings of files, you might want to look at the fastmail line, and if you have one of those helpfiles that Keith posted, that will show you syntax of the /PDDIR command. I'm trying to work on a shell script to do the job for me, but I've got to learn a few more things about the Bourne shell. Enjoy! -- Home: Ian Justman |UUCP:(1) My CP/M machine. |"One of the few 6612 Whitsett Drive | (2) My host. |die-hard CP/M North Highlands, CA |(1) !pacbell!sactoh0!ijsys!ianj |addicts left on this (916) 344-5360 95660|(2) !pacbell!sactoh0!ianj |planet"
michaelk@copper.WR.TEK.COM (Michael D. Kersenbrock) (02/13/90)
Actually I did the same thing a few years ago. Keith then gave the secrets
for usenet access to simtel.
I had deposited quite a few pieces of S/W to the Simtel CP/M archive, but
at one point the programs I mailed Keith were bouncing, and I could no
longer get them deposited.
However, since then, I've been IBM pc-klone'd, and married. So, I'm not
so interested in CP/M anymore, and I've less time to generate software.
I still have my CP/M system however (albeit with only 256K of it's former
1-Meg left -- the PC has the DRAM chips now), and can transfer files to
my PC.
I could still rummage around some weekend and find a pile of
never-distributed programs (some pretty neat and useful, and some like my
Unix compatible 16-bit uncompress were neat, but not useful) that I
generated, but I'm not sure if my mail connection to Keith has been
"fixed" -- and I have no convenient way to distribute them otherwise.
Nor, am I entirely sure I remember which were deposited and which
weren't. :-)
Alas....
P.S. - It takes no time at all to go from knocking your head on the 64K limit
to knocking your head on the ~640K "limit". Sigh.
--
Mike Kersenbrock
Tektronix Microprocessor Development Products
michaelk@copper.WR.TEK.COM
Aloha, Oregonbudden@nosc.NOSC.MIL (Rex A. Buddenberg) (02/13/90)
Chad, Keith is exactly right in his description of the way things run. He has also done yeoman work over several years to post summaries of the Simtel20 CPM listings to this newsgroup for those of us who are interested in current submissions. Additionally, Kieth maintains a private BBS where he also has most things posted -- I'll let him explain how that works, only mention it here because that's a way to get the software if Simtel20 won't work for you. If you are hanging so far off the internet that you can't FTP, then your solution is not to corrupt the system but to fix your connection. Rex Buddenberg
w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL (Keith Petersen) (02/14/90)
Chad, please don't encourage people to post binaries or I'll have
to request that the Usenet<->Internet gateway be turned off for
comp.os.cpm<->Info-Cpm.
I am the Info-Cpm mailing list maintainer and I am the one who gets
all the complaints from Internet users when their disk qoutas are
exceeded or they have to pay extra fees for large files they don't
want to receive. This does not work like Usenet where the news goes
into the spool directory and is not counted against anyone's quota.
What makes a "discussion group"? The Usenet guidelines say any
newsgroup should be treated as a discussion group unless it has
"binaries" or "sources" as a part of its group name. The same
guidelines state that it's a no-no to post binaries or sources to
groups other than those so designated.
We have a tremendous resource in the SIMTEL20 archives. Rather than
trying to start a binary newsgroup, I hope you will try to find out
how to use the file server and help other non-Internet users to do the
same.
Keith
--
Keith Petersen
Maintainer of SIMTEL20's CP/M, MSDOS, & MISC archives [IP address 26.2.0.74]
Internet: w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.Army.Mil, w8sdz@brl.arpa BITNET: w8sdz@NDSUVM1
Uucp: {ames,decwrl,harvard,rutgers,ucbvax,uunet}!wsmr-simtel20.army.mil!w8sdzdaveg@usource.SARASOTA.FL.US (Dave Goodman) (02/14/90)
I am posting the following for David Goodenough <dg@lakart.uucp>, who is temporarily unable to post to this group. Replies to him, please. --- cut here --- cut here --- cut here --- cut here --- cut here --- Subject: binary/source postings Newsgroups: comp.os.cpm anasaz!chad (Chad Larson) says: > A couple of years ago, I posted to this group the source to a utility > I wrote. I was beaten up rather roughly for having done so. My > recollection is that this group was gatewayed onto the Internet > somehow and that someone there had a restriction on source and/or > binaries floating by. They threatened (or were required, I forget) to > break the gateway rather than allow programs to transit their systems. > > Is this still so? Are binaries or source postings discouraged (or > worse, punished)? Is this group constrained to be discussions of old > systems and mutual help in supporting them? This is somewhat the case. Although my true identity is dg@lakart.UUCP, I get this via the Internet mailing list INFO-CPM. Even though I would love to see binaries and source posted here, I have to agree with the Internet people that limits need to be placed: lakart.UUCP is now a CP/M machine, and I don't have infinite space on my spool drive (D:) which is where my mail hangs out. On the other side of the coin, I would agree that a mechanism for posting source and binaries would be useful (I'd kill for the opportunity to post QTERM V4.2g - it's now available.....), but I'd suggest that a (possibly moderated) newsgroup comp.os.cpm.programs would be needed. I purposely didn't say comp.os.cpm.sources or comp.os.cpm.binaries, since I believe that the most benefit would come from a newsgroup devoted to both. Your mission (should you chose to accept it) is to run the discussion, and the vote, and see if comp.os.cpm.programs can get created. I would, however, add the following: Keith Petersen (in a reply to the above posting by Chad Larson) says: > There is an excellent public domain archive at SIMTEL20 which is > accessable by all readers of this newsgroup. The problem is that for > the past two years there has only been ONE reader who has sent a > program contribution to the archives. I can't do it all myself. WRONG!!!!! - it is only by a miracle of UUCP <--> Internet and Internet <--> Bitnet gatewaying that I can get stuff from SIMTEL20. Keith, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE remember that many .UUCP sites _CAN'T_ FTP, and thus are cut off from SIMTEL20. I'm able to access the BITNET server at NDSUVM1, but even that's flakey at best: about 20 to 30% of requests I send wind up in the bit bucket somewhere. The day I'm able to hook lakart.UUCP (as it is now - pallio.UUCP originally) to the Intenet, and issue a FTP request will probably go down in history along with the day Eniac was first powered up: there is only so much a 4MHz Z80A can do :-) -- dg@lakart.UUCP - David Goodenough +---+ IHS | +-+-+ ..... !harvard!xait!lakart!dg +-+-+ | AKA: dg%lakart.uucp@xait.xerox.com +---+
ggray@wpi.wpi.edu (Gary P Gray) (02/15/90)
In article <1289@anasaz.UUCP> chad@anasaz.UUCP (Chad R. Larson) writes: >In article <KPETERSEN.12565398949.BABYL@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL> w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL (Keith Petersen) writes: > [Argument about posting binaries and sources here deleted] What about comp.sources.misc? I don't think that CPM will be able to really support a .binaries or .sources group (unless I an very mistaken) from the traffic I have seen on this group. the comp.*.misc groups might be able to handle the occasional post for CPM, and it will be easier all around. Someone might want to mail to the moderator (if there is one) of comp.sources.misc and see if CPM falls under his bailiwick. -- -- WARNING!!! The above opinions may be HAZARDOUS or FATAL if swallowed!!! -- "No Gnus is good news" | "To life... immoral!" "Ode to tuna!" _Carmina Burana_ by Orff, as mis-heard by me
tech@cs.AthabascaU.CA (Richard Loken) (02/17/90)
From article <KPETERSEN.12565398949.BABYL@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL>, by w8sdz@WSMR-SIMTEL20.ARMY.MIL (Keith Petersen): > Chad, binary/source postings are inappropriate for any discussion > group, but especially for those gatewayed to mailing lists on the > Internet side. I don't see why. So howcome?? > There is an excellent public domain archive at SIMTEL20 which is > accessable by all readers of this newsgroup. The problem is that for > the past two years there has only been ONE reader who has sent a > program contribution to the archives. I can't do it all myself. I on the usenet side am pleasantly accustomed to picking up my source right here without calling on servers. Any attempts to talk to Simtel20 have failed miserably, if Simtel20 can be accessed by those of use without Internet or Bitnet access please explain how in V-E-R-Y simple language. The obscure referemces to a gateway (snort@foo.bar.EDU) with equally obscure instructions to write help in the subject lines don't really help much. Hey, I live in a place where black bears are often seen it town and timber wolves are accessable within 40 km - we are cutoff from the leading edge. Meanwhile how about comp.source.misc or alt.source or we could start mailing floppies to each other - I don't mind that either. As for binaries, I am an old Unix v6 man, I like source. This organizatioan will not accept a binaries newgroup anyway. Do you suppose that CP/M is current enough to be noticed by the virus development community? :) ********* 73 ********** Richard Loken VE6BSV . **** .. **** Athabasca University .... **** Athabasca, Alberta Canada ..........**** tech@cs.AthabascaU.CA {alberta|decwrl}!atha!tech