hzatz@tybalt.caltech.edu (Harold R. Zatz) (12/20/89)
In article <47500020@uxe.cso.uiuc.edu> spirit@uxe.cso.uiuc.edu writes: > >Does anybody have any idea IF or WHEN HP is going >to consider manufacturing an HP-IB Optical disk >drive??? > > John Kemp Well, I just got back from an HPUX 7.0 class at the local HP office. They had on display as a working demo an HP optical disk drive with the infamous HP manual and X manual browser running. This was a read-only optical drive. I don't know when you can buy one :-), but the driver for the optical drive is supposed to be included in HPUX 7.0. The drive will cost $1990. Optical disks are 20-50 times slower than hard drives. Since I have the HPUX 7.0 release booklet in front of me, I may as well let you people know what is actually in it. (1) Rumors to the contrary, Series 800's in general cannot go diskless with HPUX 7.0. Only a new machine, the HP9000/815 can boot diskless. I was informed at the meeting that other series 800's will not go diskless in the immediate future. The 815's have a different backplane that allows the communication card direct access to the memory bus, which allows diskless operation. (Don't ask me-- I'm not really sure why a LAN card couldn't be made to work anyway, if slower.) (2) On 9000/800's, C goes to ANSI standard. On 9000/300's a preprocessor will be provided for ANSI C. All include files on both machines will be ANSI C standard. (3) BIND domain nameserver comes with ARPA services. (named & named support) (4) Many job control functions are changed to bring some compliance with POSIX-- setpgrp, setpgrp2, ioctl, SIGCONT, and lots of other stuff. (5) X goes to 11R3. The class' instructors were also... how shall I say... amused by MIT's recent release of 11R4. 11R4 will probably come with HPUX 8.0 mid to late in the year. (6) A new concept called "dynamic swap" will allow you to use free space in a filesystem as extra swap space, used only on demand. (7) C2 security and auditing is supported. (8) Remote backups (rdump & rrestore) are supported. There was lots of other stuff, but these are the high points. Remember-- you heard it here last. --Harold "Twas brillig and the slithy toves BITnet: hzatz@citromeo.bitnet Did gyre and gimble in the wabe; UUCP: !ucbvax!hzatz@egg.gg.caltech.edu All mimsy were the borogoves, ARPAnet: hzatz@egg.gg.caltech.edu And the mome raths, outgrabe..." USmail: Dabney House 1-58 / Caltech I'm Harold R. Zatz, a.k.a. "H". Pasadena, CA 91126
mck@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Doug_McKenzie) (12/21/89)
>(1) Rumors to the contrary, Series 800's in general cannot go diskless with > HPUX 7.0. Only a new machine, the HP9000/815 can boot diskless. I was > informed at the meeting that other series 800's will not go diskless > in the immediate future. The 815's have a different backplane that allows > the communication card direct access to the memory bus, which allows > diskless operation. (Don't ask me-- I'm not really sure why a LAN card > couldn't be made to work anyway, if slower.) Nothing inaccurate here, but I wanted to clarify the connection between S800s and diskless. S800's can now (7.0) act as servers to diskless nodes, the nodes may be S300s only, 815s only, or a mixture of 300s and 815s. Also, the Series 600 (i.e. the 635), can be used as a server to S300s and/or 815s. The 635 is basically a lower-priced 835 with "restrictions" such as number-of-logins; it's binary compatible with S800s. Doug McKenzie HP-UX Support mck@hpdstma OR ...!hplabs!hpdstma!mck
joseph@hpuplca.HP.COM ( Joseph Hohl ) (12/23/89)
> Well, I just got back from an HPUX 7.0 class at the local HP office. They > had on display as a working demo an HP optical disk drive with the infamous > HP manual and X manual browser running. This was a read-only optical drive. > I don't know when you can buy one :-), but the driver for the optical drive > is supposed to be included in HPUX 7.0. The drive will cost $1990. Optical > disks are 20-50 times slower than hard drives. > > --Harold > > I'm Harold R. Zatz, a.k.a. "H". Pasadena, CA 91126 Harold, what you saw was not HP's 'optical' disk it was our 'CD ROM'. CD ROM uses the same technology as the audio CDs. CD ROM is a great low cost distribution for documentation and software. Even though the CD ROM is considerably slower than a traditional magnetic disk, it can be faster than getting up, finding a manual somewhere in the office, and looking up the information you need assuming you know where to look. The CD ROM can be a network resource allowing multiple users to access a single drive. The CD ROM is available on HP-IB and is being shipped currently. Joseph
daveg@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Dave Gutierrez) (12/28/89)
Yes the 7.0 release supports the MO media. Please contact me directly for ordering information. I am posting this reply from home and do not have access to the info right now. The drive works great and the media is cheap considering each side can hold 300+ Mb of data. Regards: daveg@hpfclg (This is not an advertisement for HP, just trying to help)
wayne@dsndata.uucp (Wayne Schlitt) (12/28/89)
In article <5570355@hpfcdc.HP.COM> daveg@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Dave Gutierrez) writes: > > The drive works great and the > media is cheap considering each side can hold 300+ Mb of data. > actually i have a few questions about the optical discs that i havent been able to get a straight answer from my sales rep. 1) do you have to physically remove the disc and flip it over to get, or does it just act like two different discs? 2) how do you know which side is which? 3) is it possible to read cd-rom discs with the erasable optical disc? 4) if than answer to 3 is no, can you obtain the documentation products on the optical discs? 5) i have been considering getting one of these for backup purposes. are they better than the dat tapes and/or the 8mm exabyte tapes for this purpose? thanks much for any info... -wayne
mark@hpcpbla.HP.COM (Mark Simms) (01/03/90)
>> 5) i have been considering getting one of these for backup purposes. >> are they better than the dat tapes and/or the 8mm exabyte tapes for >> this purpose? The advantages of optical discs for backup are: Very large amount of data available without human intervention provided you have the autochanger. Media can be mounted as a filing system which makes recovery very easy. The disadvantages are: Media costs per megabyte are much higher than for DAT/8mm tapes. Interchange of data with other manufacturer's systems is impossible. If you keep only a few backup copies, then the optical discs are a great solution. Otherwise, the media costs start making a big difference. If you have a particularly large installation to back up, you may consider backing up to optical discs and then copying the backup to a tape medium. Otherwise, I would suggest a tape backup. Mark Simms, CPB ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Opinions expressed are my own and are not intended to be an official statement by Hewlett-Packard Company ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Name: Mark Simms Position: Software Development Engineer Organisation: Hewlett-Packard Computer Peripherals Division Email US: mark%hpcpbla@hplb.hpl.hp.com UK: mark%hpcpbla@hplb.hp.co.uk Address: Filton Road, Bristol BS12 6QZ, United Kingdom
tsu@hpcupt1.HP.COM (Stanley Tsu) (01/03/90)
I'd like to point out that there are two products being discussed here: CD-ROM and Magneto-Optical (MO). CD-ROM is, as Joseph Hohl pointed out, is essentially the same as audio CD-ROM. The online HP-UX documentation product is available in CD-ROM format. I believe this is the product that Harold Katz saw a demo of. On the other hand, MO is a removeable, read-write-able optical disk that offers large storage (650Mb). It's a new storage technology that neatly fits between fast but expensive online disks and cheap, large capacity but slow tape drives. HP offers 2 MO drives, Series 6300 Model 650/A and Model 20GB/A. The 650/A is like a floppy disk drive (one mechanism, one removeable disk) except it holds a lot more than a typical floppy. The 20GB/A can hold up to 32 optical disks, yielding 32x625Mb=20Gb capacity. For more information, contact your local sales rep. Wayne Schlitt asks about MO: > 1) do you have to physically remove the disc and flip it over to get, > or does it just act like two different discs? > > 2) how do you know which side is which? You don't have to flip it over and you don't have to know which side is which. You mount each side as a file system. Everything else is functionally transparent to the user. The driver takes care of all the details. > 3) is it possible to read cd-rom discs with the erasable optical > disc? No. > 4) if than answer to 3 is no, can you obtain the documentation > products on the optical discs? Your support personnel should have this information. If they don't, they should contact the Peripherals Sales Center. > 5) i have been considering getting one of these for backup purposes. > are they better than the dat tapes and/or the 8mm exabyte tapes for > this purpose? > > > thanks much for any info... > > -wayne > ---------- #include <std/disclaimer.h> Stanley Tsu General Systems
mike%jaguar.utah.edu@cs.utah.edu (Mike Hibler) (01/04/90)
In article <-286539972@hpcupt1.HP.COM> tsu@hpcupt1.HP.COM (Stanley Tsu) writes: >Wayne Schlitt asks about MO: >> 1) do you have to physically remove the disc and flip it over to get, >> or does it just act like two different discs? >> >> 2) how do you know which side is which? > >You don't have to flip it over and you don't have to know which side >is which. You mount each side as a file system. Everything else is >functionally transparent to the user. The driver takes care of all >the details. Are you sure about this? The "HP Series 6300 Model 650/A Rewritable Optical Disk Drive User's Guide" says: "Because the disk drive contains only one read/write head assembly, the cartridge must be ejected, turned over, and re-inserted to access the second side." Empirical evidence seems to back this up. I have tried various minor device numbers (with different volumes, different units) under HP-UX 6.5 and it certainly appears that you cannot get to the other side. Maybe its different under 7.0? I have seen documentation for the autochanger (20GB/A) which says that it has two drive mechanisms and hence you could mount two "surfaces" at once. Is that what you are refering to?
tsu@hpcupt1.HP.COM (Stanley Tsu) (01/10/90)
Mike Hibler writes: >In article <-286539972@hpcupt1.HP.COM> tsu@hpcupt1.HP.COM (Stanley Tsu) writes: >>You don't have to flip it over and you don't have to know which side >>is which. You mount each side as a file system. Everything else is >>functionally transparent to the user. The driver takes care of all >>the details. > >Are you sure about this? The "HP Series 6300 Model 650/A Rewritable Optical >Disk Drive User's Guide" says: > > [ rest of comment deleted ] I was referring to the 20GB/A only. Sorry if I was misleading.