habs@inesc.UUCP (Henrique A. de Barros Silva) (03/08/90)
I would appreciate some help on the following. For a few reasons, machines running TCP/IP in our local network still use the old BSD 4.2 broadcast address format, i.e. host portion of the address all zeros, instead of the BSD 4.3 format, with the host portion with all ones. The problem here is that we don't know HOW TO CHANGE the format of the broadcast address in a HP9000 running HP-UX. We tried everything (even ifconfig, of course), but did not succeed. What are we missing?! Thank you for any help. --Henrique.
timg@hpgnd.HP.COM (Tim GILL) (03/15/90)
>The problem here is that we don't know HOW TO CHANGE the format of the >broadcast address in a HP9000 running HP-UX. We tried everything (even >ifconfig, of course), but did not succeed. What are we missing?! Well the reason you don't know HOW TO CHANGE the format of the broadcast address is that you CAN'T CHANGE IT. Sorry about that, but it is fixed to conform to the *STANDARD*. I would suggest contacting your HP engineer for additional help, unless some kind soul has a fix. Tim Gill HP Grenoble Networks Division { Sentiments expressed here are mine.}
rogerk@mips.COM (Roger B.A. Klorese) (03/17/90)
In article <1300005@hpgnd.HP.COM> timg@hpgnd.HP.COM (Tim GILL) writes: > >>The problem here is that we don't know HOW TO CHANGE the format of the >>broadcast address in a HP9000 running HP-UX. We tried everything (even >>ifconfig, of course), but did not succeed. What are we missing?! > >Well the reason you don't know HOW TO CHANGE the format of the broadcast >address is that you CAN'T CHANGE IT. Sorry about that, but it is fixed >to conform to the *STANDARD*. I would suggest contacting your HP engineer >for additional help, unless some kind soul has a fix. What a crock of arrogance! Just about every "modern" TCP/IP implementation acknowledges that there will be pre-standard systems on the net, and permits setting of broadcast addresses. Why does HP think it "knows better" than the users? -- ROGER B.A. KLORESE MIPS Computer Systems, Inc. phone: +1 408 720-2939 MS 4-02 928 E. Arques Ave. Sunnyvale, CA 94086 rogerk@mips.COM {ames,decwrl,pyramid}!mips!rogerk "I'm the NLA" "Two guys, one cart, fresh pasta... *you* figure it out." -- Suzanne Sugarbaker
dfc@hpindda.HP.COM (Don Coolidge) (03/20/90)
>What a crock of arrogance! Just about every "modern" TCP/IP implementation >acknowledges that there will be pre-standard systems on the net, and >permits setting of broadcast addresses. Why does HP think it "knows better" >than the users? Ahem... Yes, it can be interpreted somewhat arrogantly (though not intended that way). Unfortunately, so can your response. Care to think it over a bit, and perhaps post in a somewhat calmer manner? For the record (as someone who actually does kernel networking code development in that area) [ oh, yes - for _my_ record, not necessarily legally HP's ]: 1) The current HP-UX networking code is based on 4.2BSD, not 4.3BSD. The ability to arbitrarily configure your interface's broadcast address is a standard part of the 4.3 networking release, but not of 4.2. If by "modern" you mean "4.3", then you're correct. By that standard, HP's networking code is not yet "modern" in that it does not yet have all of the 4.3BSD features (nevertheless, it has many). It is, however, of considerably higher quality (less bugs) than are most 4.3BSD products. (Also, 4.3BSD is about to suddenly become no longer "modern" with the release of 4.4BSD) 2) Patches are available for the 6.5 and 7.0 (both Series 300 and 800) HP-UX releases that provide that capability. Users wanted it, so we provide it. Contact your HP rep for more details, as the first respondent suggested. 3) The problem noted by the original poster is one that can only happen in the presence of even less "modern" networking implementations - those based purely on 4.2BSD, with no 4.3 enhancements. HP-UX sends ones (the standard), but also recognizes zeroes. All those other braindead implementations are *broken*, and should be replaced, regardless of what HP, or any other vendor, does - they violate the Internet standard for broadcasts. They also almost certainly don't have SlowStart, or congestion avoidance, or fast retransmit with exponential backoff, or any of the other good-citizen VJ-Karels/TCP algorithms, all of which HP has (starting in 7.0). HP most definitely doesn't think it knows better than the users. We listen to what they have to say. In response to their requests, we're adding more and more 4.3BSD features with each release, and are tracking 4.4BSD to see what happens there. We're not all the way there yet, but we're on our way, and getting better (and more "modern" ;-) )with each release. - Don Coolidge