irf@kuling.UUCP (Bo Thide') (03/27/91)
Now that the Snakes (HP9000/700 series HP-PA 1.1 RISC workstations) are let
loose, the official HP info has become available. Some of this info follows.
There are three models, the desktop (114mm*508mm*470mm) 720 (Cobra) and
730 (King Cobra) and the deskside (610mm*220mm*595mm) 750 (Coral). They
come initially with HP-UX 8.01 to be upgraded to HP-UX 8.05 in June. Later
OSF/1 will be available.
Clock: 50 MHZ (720) or 66 MHz (730, 750)
Cache: 128 kB instr/256 kB data (720, 730), 256 kB instr/256 kB data.
Interfaces: SCSI-II, EISA, LAN, RS-232 (to 460.8 kbaud), HP-HIL, Centronics.
HP-IB optional (via EISA!).
Monitors: 72 Hz, 19" 1280x1024 8-bit grayscale (GRX) or 8+8 color planes (CRX).
Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA.
Languages: C, C++, Pascal, FORTRAN, ANSI C, Assembler. FORTRAN compiler
with "+800" option for series 800 compatibility. Series 800
binaries run on 700 series.
Performance (with HP-UX 8.05) and comparison with other workstations:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
SPEC Khorner- Linp2P x11- Dhry-
mark int fp stones MIPS MFLOPS perf stone2.0
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 72.2 51.0 91.0 143974 76 22 10460 114680
HP9000/720 G/CRX 55.5 39.0 70.2 119213 57 17 8244 87000
IBM 6000/550 54.3 34.5 73.5 n/a 56 23 n/a n/a
IBM 6000/320 24.6 16.3 32.4 54661 29.5 8.5 1520 45250
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 18.5 19.0 18.5 26456 24.2 3.7 3256 38760
DECstation 3100 11.3 11.8 10.9 15285 14.9 1.6 1702 23470
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 21.0 20.2 21.5 27142 28.5 4.2 n/a 35590
Sun SPARCstation IPC 11.8 12.4 11.4 13329 15.7 1.7 n/a 22830
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Linp2P = Linpack Double precision, 100*100 FORTRAN BLAS, rolled.
x11perf = geometric mean of the x11perf1.2 component tests (excluding 1
and 500 pixel tests).
Selected x11perf Tests:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
10 pixel 10*10 TR create & map
Dots lines rects text subwins (50 kids)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 1630000 911000 278000 273000 6000
HP9000/720 G/CRX 1260000 874000 272000 245000 4500
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 370000 455000 256000 90900 1750
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 101100 147000 83500 49000 1050
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Graphics Performance:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
2D floating 3D floating pt
pt vectors/s vectors/s (peak)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 1120000 1150000
HP9000/720 G/CRX 1120000 1150000
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 300000 300000
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 450000 240000
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sequential Disk Access Rates:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Read (kB/s) Write (kB/s)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/700, 1*210MByte disk 1120 1140
HP9000/700, 1*420MByte disk 1520 1510
HP9000/700, 2*210MByte disk 2070 1800
HP9000/700, 2*420MByte disk 2460 2140
Sun SPARCstation 2, 207MByte disk 744 794
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
ANSYS SP-3 results (smaller = better):
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU seconds
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cray 2 27
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 49
DEC VAX9000 65
HP9000/720 G/CRX 66
IBM 6000/540 68
DECstation 5000 145
IBM 6000/320 107
Sun SPARCstation 1+ 311
Sun SPARCstation 2 225
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP numbers were measured with series 800 compiler code. No series 700
specific optimizations used.irf@kuling.UUCP (Bo Thide') (03/27/91)
Now that the Snakes (HP9000/700 series HP-PA 1.1 RISC workstations) are let
loose, the official HP info has become available. Some of this info follows.
There are three models, the desktop (114mm*508mm*470mm) 720 (Cobra) and
730 (King Cobra) and the deskside (610mm*220mm*595mm) 750 (Coral). They
come initially with HP-UX 8.01 to be upgraded to HP-UX 8.05 in June. Later
OSF/1 will be available.
Clock: 50 MHZ (720) or 66 MHz (730, 750)
Cache: 128 kB instr/256 kB data (720, 730), 256 kB instr/256 kB data.
Interfaces: SCSI-II, EISA, LAN, RS-232 (to 460.8 kbaud), HP-HIL, Centronics.
HP-IB optional (via EISA!).
Monitors: 72 Hz, 19" 1280x1024 8-bit grayscale (GRX) or 8+8 color planes (CRX).
Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA.
Languages: C, C++, Pascal, FORTRAN, ANSI C, Assembler. FORTRAN compiler
with "+800" option for series 800 compatibility. Series 800
binaries run on series 700 machines.
Performance (with HP-UX 8.05) and comparison with other workstations:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
SPEC Khorner- Linp2P x11- Dhry-
mark int fp stones MIPS MFLOPS perf stone2.0
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 72.2 51.0 91.0 143974 76 22.9 10460 114680
HP9000/720 G/CRX 55.5 39.0 70.2 119213 57 17.2 8244 87000
IBM 6000/550 54.3 34.5 73.5 n/a 56 23 n/a n/a
IBM 6000/320 24.6 16.3 32.4 54661 29.5 8.5 1520 45250
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 21.0 20.2 21.5 27142 28.5 4.2 n/a 35590
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 18.5 19.0 18.5 26456 24.2 3.7 3256 38760
DECstation 3100 11.3 11.8 10.9 15285 14.9 1.6 1702 23470
Sun SPARCstation IPC 11.8 12.4 11.4 13329 15.7 1.7 n/a 22830
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Linp2P = Linpack Double precision, 100*100 FORTRAN BLAS, rolled.
x11perf = geometric mean of the x11perf1.2 component tests (excluding 1
and 500 pixel tests).
Selected x11perf Tests:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
10 pixel 10*10 TR create & map
Dots lines rects text subwins (50 kids)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 1630000 911000 278000 273000 6000
HP9000/720 G/CRX 1260000 874000 272000 245000 4500
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 370000 455000 256000 90900 1750
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 101100 147000 83500 49000 1050
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Graphics Performance:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
2D floating 3D floating pt
pt vectors/s vectors/s (peak)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 1120000 1150000
HP9000/720 G/CRX 1120000 1150000
DECstation 5000/200PXGT 300000 300000
Sun SPARCstation 2GX 450000 240000
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sequential Disk Access Rates:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Read (kB/s) Write (kB/s)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP9000/700, 1*210MByte disk 1120 1140
HP9000/700, 1*420MByte disk 1520 1510
HP9000/700, 2*210MByte disk 2070 1800
HP9000/700, 2*420MByte disk 2460 2140
Sun SPARCstation 2, 207MByte disk 744 794
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
ANSYS SP-3 results (smaller = better):
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU seconds
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cray 2 27
HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 49
DEC VAX9000 65
HP9000/720 G/CRX 66
IBM 6000/540 68
DECstation 5000 145
IBM 6000/320 107
Sun SPARCstation 1+ 311
Sun SPARCstation 2 225
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
HP numbers were measured with series 800 compiler code. No series 700
specific optimizations used.nazgul@alphalpha.com (Kee Hinckley) (03/27/91)
In article <1998@kuling.UUCP> irf@kuling.DoCS.UU.SE (Bo Thide') writes: >Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA. ^^^^^^^^^^^^ I don't believe this. 1.2 uses the R5 Intrinsics, and while HP is a consortium member and the contractor doing the 1.2 work I can't believe that any of that stuff is stable enough to use. It's not even in beta yet from OSF. If they are releasing it then it's sure to change before the official release. (And we won't even talk about bugs.) -- Alfalfa Software, Inc. | Poste: The EMail for Unix nazgul@alfalfa.com | Send Anything... Anywhere 617/646-7703 (voice/fax) | info@alfalfa.com I'm not sure which upsets me more: that people are so unwilling to accept responsibility for their own actions, or that they are so eager to regulate everyone else's.
jbb@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Jim B. Byers) (03/28/91)
>Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The Series 700s will have Motif 1.1. We will not have delivered 1.2
into OSF's hands in that time frame.
Jim Byers
Interface Technology Operation
Hewlett Packard
Utsukushi ya shoji-no ana-no Ama-no-gawa
Issa (1762-1826)
A lovely thing to see:
through the paper window's hole,
the Galaxy.
iyengar@gradient.cis.upenn.edu (Anand Iyengar) (03/28/91)
In article <1998@kuling.UUCP> irf@kuling.DoCS.UU.SE (Bo Thide') writes: >Now that the Snakes (HP9000/700 series HP-PA 1.1 RISC workstations) are let >... >Cache: 128 kB instr/256 kB data (720, 730), 256 kB instr/256 kB data. Are these external caches (sound too big to be on chip)? How much (if any) delay does a cache access cost? Anand. -- "The nearer your destination, the more you're slip-sliding away..." iyengar@grad1.cis.upenn.edu --- Lbh guvax znlor vg'yy ybbx orggre ebg-guvegrrarg? --- Disclaimer: It's a forgery. -- "The nearer your destination, the more you're slip-sliding away..." iyengar@grad1.cis.upenn.edu --- Lbh guvax znlor vg'yy ybbx orggre ebg-guvegrrarg? ---
perry@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Perry Scott) (03/29/91)
>Now that the Snakes (HP9000/700 series HP-PA 1.1 RISC workstations) are let >loose, the official HP info has become available. Some of this info follows. Yeah. Now HP-ites can talk about it, too. :-) >Performance (with HP-UX 8.05) and comparison with other workstations: This must have been a a pre-release version - 8.05 isn't on the streets yet. Your mileage will vary (you guess which direction). >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > SPEC Khorner- Linp2P x11- Dhry- > mark int fp stones MIPS MFLOPS perf stone2.0 >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >HP9000/730,750 G/CRX 72.2 51.0 91.0 143974 76 22.9 10460 114680 >HP9000/720 G/CRX 55.5 39.0 70.2 119213 57 17.2 8244 87000 >IBM 6000/550 54.3 34.5 73.5 n/a 56 23 n/a n/a >IBM 6000/320 24.6 16.3 32.4 54661 29.5 8.5 1520 45250 >Sun SPARCstation 2GX 21.0 20.2 21.5 27142 28.5 4.2 n/a 35590 >DECstation 5000/200PXGT 18.5 19.0 18.5 26456 24.2 3.7 3256 38760 >DECstation 3100 11.3 11.8 10.9 15285 14.9 1.6 1702 23470 >Sun SPARCstation IPC 11.8 12.4 11.4 13329 15.7 1.7 n/a 22830 >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Linp2P = Linpack Double precision, 100*100 FORTRAN BLAS, rolled. >x11perf = geometric mean of the x11perf1.2 component tests (excluding 1 > and 500 pixel tests). Remember, MIPS really means Mostly Insignificant Performance Statistic. Another interesting number, SPECS/MIPS, measures what the system actually does with raw CPU power - it's of some interest to us software types. If a vendor overstates their MIPS rating, it really shows up here. Here are those numbers: Machine SPECS/MIPS ============================================= HP9000/730,750 G/CRX .950 HP9000/720 G/CRX .974 IBM 6000/550 .970 IBM 6000/320 .833 Sun SPARCstation 2GX .737 DECstation 5000/200PXGT .764 DECstation 3100 .758 Sun SPARCstation IPC .752 Perry Scott HP Ft. Collins, Colorado
jbc@hpcupt3.cup.hp.com (Jeff Caldwell) (03/30/91)
>HP numbers were measured with series 800 compiler code. No series 700 >specific optimizations used. >---------- If you truly only used the 800 compilers to generate the code wait until you see the Series 700 compiler numbers- there are significant differences. The ability to use the Series 800 compilers to generate perfectly usable code for use on the Snakes boxes gives me a good feeling. When HP says upward compatibility is maintained, HP means it. -Jeff Caldwell
harry@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney) (04/03/91)
Kee Hinckley writes: >>Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA. ^^^^^^^^^^^^ > I don't believe this. And well you shouldn't. I don't know where the original information came from, but it is most definitely wrong. HP-UX 8.0 contains OSF/Motif 1.1 code, with all critical/serious fixes from 1.1.1 rolled in. > 1.2 uses the R5 Intrinsics, and while HP is a > consortium member and the contractor doing the 1.2 work I can't believe > that any of that stuff is stable enough to use. I also seriously doubt that our OSF contract would allow us to ship the code before release to other OSF members, but I must admit to ignorance of the contract details. Harry Phinney harry@hp-pcd.cv.hp.com
renglish@cello.hpl.hp.com (Bob English) (04/05/91)
peter@ficc.ferranti.com (Peter da Silva) writes: > In article <31@titccy.cc.titech.ac.jp> mohta@necom830.cc.titech.ac.jp (Masataka Ohta) writes: > > HP-UX or any other SysV based OS is too painful to administrate. > What have you been smoking? I want some. I don't think he's been smoking anything. If most of the systems he works with are BSD-based, a single SysV based machine, or a new group of them will be painful to administer. Many of the scripts that he's written won't work correctly, and the user community will complain that things don't work as they used to. --bob-- renglish@hplabs Not speaking for anyone.
sblair@upurbmw.dell.com (Steve Blair) (04/05/91)
In article <1991Apr04.172441.22142@cello.hpl.hp.com>, renglish@cello.hpl.hp.com (Bob English) writes: |> If most of the systems he |> works with are BSD-based, a single SysV based machine, or a new group of |> them will be painful to administer. Many of the scripts that he's |> written won't work correctly, and the user community will complain that |> things don't work as they used to. |> |> --bob-- |> renglish@hplabs |> Not speaking for anyone. ************* I'm not trying to start a flame war or anything, but this statement Bob, is patently *mis-leading*. Just because things dont' 100% work the same thing the same way does not imply, or *mean* that there's something "wrong" with an operating system. For example: I've spent many, many years in BSD systems' environments. Now as a member of the UNIX groups at DELL, I find myself working in new ways. Very, VERY few things that worked before in BSD land don't work in SYS V.4 . I've got a csh that works great, my pick of cc's that I wish to utilize, as well as library, and include file support for both environments. When assisting new users, I give them the *choice* of deciding if they'd like things to be as the "knew & loved" in BSD land, or to explore new territories in SVR4. My scripts that worked on BSD systems work quite fine here, at least in DELL V.4, and programs that I used to run under X in BSD land were exceptionally trivial to have work in V.4 land. Please carefully evaluate an operating system's "particulars" before branding things that may well work as well, or better than other environments..... regards, -- Steve Blair DELL UNIX DIVISION sblair@upurbmw.dell.com ================================================================
mohta@necom830.cc.titech.ac.jp (Masataka Ohta) (04/05/91)
In article <1991Apr04.172441.22142@cello.hpl.hp.com> renglish@cello.hpl.hp.com (Bob English) writes: >> In article <31@titccy.cc.titech.ac.jp> mohta@necom830.cc.titech.ac.jp (Masataka Ohta) writes: >> > HP-UX or any other SysV based OS is too painful to administrate. >I don't think he's been smoking anything. If most of the systems he >works with are BSD-based, a single SysV based machine, or a new group of >them will be painful to administer. Many of the scripts that he's >written won't work correctly, and the user community will complain that >things don't work as they used to. If you love writing many scripts for system administration, SysV will offer generic mechanism to do so (run level and other complicated mechanism), I admit. But, my policy is to use the system with the least modification. I don't write many scripts. I am lazy. I know what to modify to setup BSD environment. /etc/rc* and some other files. Thus, I administrate one type of BSD based system (with extensions such as NFS and SysV commands, which dose not affect administration) from several different vendors, though there are small differences. But administration of SysV based systems (but having BSD features in different way, which affects administration, especially networking) is different vendor by vendor. If you administrate only one type of a machine, and OS version up dose not occur so often, SysV may not be so bad, though I still miss dmesg and fastboot. Masataka Ohta PS Followup-To: is directed to comp.unix.admin only.
irf@kuling.UUCP (Bo Thide') (04/06/91)
In article <101950198@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com> harry@hpcvlx.cv.hp.com (Harry Phinney) writes: >Kee Hinckley writes: >>>Software: X11R4, OSF/Motif1.2 (not 1.1!), VUE, NCS, NFS, 4.3BSD TCP/IP, ARPA. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> I don't believe this. > >And well you shouldn't. I don't know where the original information >came from, but it is most definitely wrong. HP-UX 8.0 contains >OSF/Motif 1.1 code, with all critical/serious fixes from 1.1.1 rolled The original information comes from the different HP brochures describing the three Snakes. I quoted this info in my initial posting. Apparently, these official HP documents are in error. Bo ^ Bo Thide'-------------------------------------------------------------- |I| Swedish Institute of Space Physics, S-755 91 Uppsala, Sweden |R| Phone: (+46) 18-303671. Telex: 76036 (IRFUPP S). Fax: (+46) 18-403100 /|F|\ INTERNET: bt@irfu.se UUCP: ...!uunet!sunic!irfu!bt ~~U~~ -----------------------------------------------------------------sm5dfw
renglish@cello.hpl.hp.com (Bob English) (04/09/91)
sblair@upurbmw.dell.com (Steve Blair) writes: > I've spent many, many years in BSD systems' environments. Now... > I find myself working in new ways. Very, VERY few things that worked > before in BSD land don't work in SYS V.4 . I've got a csh that works > great, my pick of cc's that I wish to utilize... That is all true, but it is also not the point. If I have a large number of different systems to administer and I have to keep track of the differences between them, it is much more painful than if I have only one. As a user who has used both, I care very little which one I use. If I were an administrator, I would become increasingly unhappy as the number of variants I had to simultaneously administer increased. I don't know which is harder or easier or whatever, but even if sysV were half as difficult to administer as BSD, the addition of sysV machines to a BSD world makes the administrator's job more difficult. --bob-- renglish@hplabs.hp.com I'm not even saying this. If HP could talk, it probably wouldn't, either.