tim@hoptoad.UUCP (09/01/87)
In article <3841@well.UUCP> alcmist@well.UUCP (Frederick Wamsley) writes: >I thought the absence of data structures in Hypertalk was a serious problem >until one of my coworkers pointed out that a card is a structure, with >individually addressable fields. >-- >Fred Wamsley {dual,hplabs}!well!alcmist;well!alcmist@lll-crg.arpa; >CIS 72247,3130; GEnie FKWAMSLEY;ATT Mail fwamsley; other uucp >uw-beaver!uw-june!bcsaic!asymet!fred; USPS - why bother? Yes and no. First, fields are the HyperCard objects I have the most trouble with; it doesn't seem to be possible to use "target" in handling messages to them, passing them actually passes the text so that resetting them doesn't do anything globally, and if they are used in a "structured" hidden way, then you have to put in utility scripts to deal with them conveniently. Second, it is often neccessary to impose more structure than a per-card structure. For instance, suppose you have a number of polygons in a card. Each polygon is stored as a hidden field that has a list of the corners, one per line, in x,y (item) format. So then you can get point n by saying "line n of field f", and the x of that by saying "item 1 of line n of field f". What you have are not data structures, but arrays. Much less powerful, much less readable, much less maintainable. You can build data structures on top of arrays, but I wouldn't place any bets on the performance of an *interpreted* system using such techniques. What is really needed is an addition of real data structures to the language. I think a form letter metaphor would work quite well and be true to Apple's design goals. -- Tim Maroney, {ihnp4,sun,well,ptsfa,lll-crg,frog}!hoptoad!tim (uucp) hoptoad!tim@lll-crg (arpa)
barnett@im4u.UUCP (Lewis Barnett @ home on the range) (09/01/87)
In article <1987Aug31.113607.2189@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu> wbell@gpu.utcs.UUCP (Warren Bell) writes: > >(This isn't exactly related to the above discussion...) >How many dealers (outside of the West Coast) have HyperCard right now? >I have been calling the usual mail order places, and they don't have >it, nor do they know if or when they will get it. One place said they >heard that it won't be available until late September or early October! The University of Texas's AUC outlet yesterday told me they would have it in mid-October. A local Mac supplies/software shop (not an official Apple dealer) told me they didn't know when they'd have it. Of the two dealers listed under "Apple Computers" in the Austin phone book, one couldn't tell me anything, the other said, "beginning of next week." (i.e. after Labor Day) Lewis Barnett,CS Dept, Taylor Hall 2.124, Univ. of Texas, Austin, TX 78712 "A man is like a rusty wheel on a rusty cart, He sings his song as he rattles along and then he falls apart." Richard Thompson -- barnett@im4u.UTEXAS.EDU, barnett@im4u.UUCP, {ihnp4,harvard,seismo,gatech,ctvax}!im4u!barnett
jjs@burdvax.UUCP (09/01/87)
in article <2116@im4u.UUCP>, barnett@im4u.UUCP (Lewis Barnett @ home on the range) says: > > In article <1987Aug31.113607.2189@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu> wbell@gpu.utcs.UUCP (Warren Bell) writes: >> >>(This isn't exactly related to the above discussion...) >>How many dealers (outside of the West Coast) have HyperCard right now? >>I have been calling the usual mail order places, and they don't have >>it, nor do they know if or when they will get it. One place said they >>heard that it won't be available until late September or early October! Well, to increase the information flow regarding HC, a relatively small store in Bryn Mawr PA received 19 copies last Wednesday, Aug. 26. I managed to convince them to sell me a copy even though I hadn't bought my system from them. One other eastern PA dealer expected their first delivery on Thursday or Friday -- I don't know whether they got 'em or not. Jim Solderitsch USENET: sdcrdcf!burdvax!jjs {sjuvax,ihnp4,akgua,cadre}!psuvax1!burdvax!jjs ARPANET: jjs@burdvax.prc.unisys.com
jensen@ariel.unm.edu (K. Jensen CS.DEPT) (09/01/87)
In article <1987Aug31.113607.2189@gpu.utcs.toronto.edu> wbell@gpu.utcs.UUCP (War ren Bell) writes: > >(This isn't exactly related to the above discussion...) >How many dealers (outside of the West Coast) have HyperCard right now? >I have been calling the usual mail order places, and they don't have >it, nor do they know if or when they will get it. One place said they >heard that it won't be available until late September or early October! There are at least 4 Apple dealers here in Albuquerque. Three of them say they won't get HyperCard before mid-September; the other has it in stock now. Maybe it's who the dealer knows? Kris Jensen jensen@unmvax.UNM.EDU
sysop@stech.UUCP (Jan Harrington) (09/03/87)
Hypercard is a very hard thing to come by in the Boston area. Some local stores haven't even had a first shipment yet. One of my favorite dealers, the Acton Computer Center, got only _14_ copies. 10 of those were pre-sold; the other 4 went out with new Macs. Needless to say, I didin't get one. The best I could do was put a deposit on a copy in the next shipment (I'm #2 on the list)... Meanwhile, Hypercard has shown up on the Apple Developer's price list. It's discounted about 25%, but with the time lag involved, it doesn't seem worth it. It could take up to six weeks to get it from Apple; I'd rather pay full retail and get it sooner. Anybody else having such trouble finding Hypercard? (I'm jealous of all you souls who've been able to get your hands on it.) Jan Harrington, sysop Scholastech Telecommunications ihnp4!husc6!amcad!stech!sysop