cs162fed@sdcc18.ucsd.EDU (Grobbins) (10/13/87)
In article <467@auscso.UUCP> mentat@auscso.UUCP (Robert Dorsett) writes: >Speaking of 90-day warranties, how's THAT for manufacturer confidence in its >products? "Apple Computer: we have the same warranties for our products as >the most minor Taiwanese junk electronics manufacturer." :-) Nothing to smile over there. New cars are often sold at smaller margins than Macs, and rattles in cars are fixed free for a year. If your Mac dies after 100 days, you're out of luck (or at least out of several hundred more dollars.) How about if all of us who have had our equipment die prematurely (though just not prematurely enough) send a friendly little note to John Sculley explaining that, if we're going to pay a premium for buying un-cloned equipment from a cash-rich company, we expect a reasonable assurance that we're buying hardware we can rely on. Think it's worthwhile? Would it accomplish anything? Grobbins cs162fed@sdcc18.ucsd.edu ..sdcsvax!sdcc18!cs162fed
psych@watdcsu.waterloo.edu (R.Crispin - Psychology) (10/15/87)
In Canada the Apple warranty is 90 days but we also get 9 months of AppleCare after that period for free. The effective warranty is therefore 1 year. I don't mind paying a little more for the extra service. Richard Crispin Dept. of Psychology University of Waterloo Waterloo, Ont. Canada N2L 3G1 (519)885-1211 ext 2879
tedj@hpcilzb.HP.COM (Ted Johnson) (10/16/87)
I second that thought! I have had two hard disks die on my Mac SE HD20
(one was DOA, the other made horrible scraping noises on boot up so the
dealer replaced it), and the third hard disk is starting to make the
same scraping noises as the second. In addition, I have had the analog
board replaced (have you ever stuck a piece of paper into a fan? That's
the kind of noise my fan made one day when I powered it up. Rather than
unsolder the fan, the dealer replaced the whole analog board). My mouse
is also "double-clicky", but it happens fairly rarely, so I just ignore it.
I think the Mac is a great machine, but I can't really recommend it to my
friends who are quavering between spending 1/3 as much on a PC clone, because
-Ted
P.S. BTW, yes, the upper left corner of my
screen *does* shimmer if you look at
it too closely. :-(
P.P.S.Yes, the fan does sound like a screaming viking, :-(
but I have a stereo which is louder! :-)
***********************************************************
Ted C. Johnson
Hewlett-Packard, Design Technology Center
Santa Clara, CA
(408)553-3555
UUCP: ...hplabs!hpcea!hpcid!tedj
***********************************************************
the Mac's hardware is so *unstable*! The 90 day warranty does little to
reassure them also. Let's see some REAL warranties (a year) for Apple stuff!tedj@hpcilzb.HP.COM (Ted Johnson) (10/16/87)
Sorry about that ^^^. I hate vi! -Ted
mentat@auscso.UUCP (Robert Dorsett) (10/17/87)
In article <3959@watdcsu.waterloo.edu> psych@watdcsu.waterloo.edu (R.Crispin - Psychology) writes: >In Canada the Apple warranty is 90 days but we also get 9 months of AppleCare >after that period for free. The effective warranty is therefore 1 year. I >don't mind paying a little more for the extra service. I do. I think AppleCare's a rip-off. It's expensive, and over a period of time will inevitably cost more than any conceivable hardware failure, short of dropping the machine off the roof of a building. If a computer's going to break, it'll probably break within the first 90 days. I try to run the suckers into the ground during that period, keeping them on most of the time, etc...:-) I'd be much more inclined to keep the money I'd otherwise pay for Applecare in the bank. Anyone care to estimate how much money Apple makes from Applecare? -- Robert Dorsett {allegra,seismo}!sally!ut-ngp!walt!mentat University of Texas at Austin {allegra, seismo}!sally!ut-ngp!auscso!mentat
bc@mit-amt.MEDIA.MIT.EDU (bill coderre) (10/17/87)
> (Request for estimates of profits omitted)
Jeez. We're talkin' a service here, not a bought good. AppleCare is
the "no-brain" solution. Any problem, just send the machine in and you
get it or another working, quick.
When I was at a newspaper, we paid a LOT of money for 4 hour downtime
service. The technicians kept about a spare terminal and half a
computer in the closet there. It was worth it, since if we missed one
day's publication, we'd be out of business.
For some people, this is a vital service, and worth the bucks. To the
Joe who'd rather fix it himself, it's an utter waste. Nobody's forcing
you to buy it.
Seems like everybody is begrudging Apple for making money. Why?.......bckamath@reed.UUCP (Sean Kamath) (10/21/87)
Well, I don't know, but last I remember the price of a Mac logic board
was $125, and Applecare was only $90. And since a lot of mac Logcs and
Powers died in a year, not 90 days, it was worth it. But since the //'s
are built a *little* bit more reliably, (mostly simplicity-wise. Now
real screen stuff, etc) it might be about 20 years before you have a
problem that costs more than $90. . .
Sean kamath
--
UUCP: {decvax allegra ucbcad ucbvax hplabs ihnp4}!tektronix!reed!kamath
CSNET: reed!kamath@Tektronix.CSNET || BITNET: reed!kamath@Berkeley.BITNET
ARPA: tektronix!reed!kamath@Berkeley <or> reed!kamath@hplabs
US Snail: 3934 SE Boise, Portland, OR 97202 (I hate 4 line .sigs!)mcdonald@sfu_cmpt.cs.sfu (10/21/87)
I don't know what Apple does in the U.S., but here in Canada, all Macs come
with a free 90-days worth of AppleCare--in effect extending the warranty to
one year. I always thought it was a strange way of doing it, but no
complaints . . .
Ken McDonald
{...!ubc-vision!sfuess ess etriuof rudolph@uiucdcsm.cs.uiuc.edu (10/22/87)
According to my simple calculations, 72% of logic boards would have to die within the first year to make a $90 "insurance premium" on a $125 item statistically worthwhile. I find it *** extremely *** hard to believe that the percentage is that high. (I have had my Mac for 3 years with no problems ever.) I think Applecare is an incredible ripoff!!!! rudolph@m.uiucdcs.edu
isle@dartvax.UUCP (Ken Hancock) (10/24/87)
In article <8400004@uiucdcsm> rudolph@uiucdcsm.cs.uiuc.edu writes: > >According to my simple calculations, 72% of logic boards would have to >die within the first year to make a $90 "insurance premium" on a $125 >item statistically worthwhile. I find it *** extremely *** hard to >believe that the percentage is that high. (I have had my Mac for 3 >years with no problems ever.) I think Applecare is an incredible >ripoff!!!! > >rudolph@m.uiucdcs.edu I think it's quite unfair to slander Apple's attempt at offering insurance to users. Do you do the same to people who offer Auto Insurance or Fire insurance? Sure, it's obvious that the probability of your Apple breaking down is small. Apple makes GOOD products! (I still have an Apple II+ at home that's been working fine for 8+ years!) You've made a decision NOT to buy AppleCare because you don't think it's worth it. I know people who HAVE bought AppleCare, had a disk drive fail, and had it replaced for free. That $90 save them $190. Apple's offering you a simple choice...take it or leave it based on your observations, but don't give them cr*p for giving you a choice. Ken -- Ken Hancock UUCP: isle@dartvax BITNET: isle@u2.dartmouth.edu DISCLAIMER: If people weren't so sue-happy, I wouldn't need one!
earleh@dartvax.UUCP (Earle R. Horton) (10/25/87)
In article <8400004@uiucdcsm>, rudolph@uiucdcsm.cs.uiuc.edu writes: > > According to my simple calculations, 72% of logic boards would have to > die within the first year to make a $90 "insurance premium" on a $125 > item statistically worthwhile. I find it *** extremely *** hard to > believe that the percentage is that high. (I have had my Mac for 3 > years with no problems ever.) I think Applecare is an incredible > ripoff!!!! > > rudolph@m.uiucdcs.edu Statistically speaking, all insurance is an incredible ripoff. How else do you think insurance companies justify selling it? Statistically speaking, lottery tickets are a ripoff, too, but people buy them. No matter what the statistics say, somebody does win the lottery, and somebody somewhere (maybe not you or me) blows out three power supply boards in the month after his warranty runs out. If a person would rather pay twice (or four times, or ten times) the expected rate of repair costs in order to obtain the feeling of security that comes with having an insurance policy, then he has purchased something which is of value to him. True, his expected rate of return is, I don't know, maybe ten dollars for ninety dollars spent, but his maximum possible rate of return is much higher. This doesn't excuse the incredibly high rates which exist for all types of insurance, but maybe it does explain how insurance companies can get away with charging them. You get at least two intangibles when you buy insurance: You get a nice security blanket, and you get the opportunity to gamble. Not everyone who buys insurance cashes in, but everyone does get the security blanket, and a lottery ticket (policy) too. (I didn't even consider Applecare, I know how much these electronic gizmos are really worth.) -- ********************************************************************* *Earle R. Horton, H.B. 8000, Dartmouth College, Hanover, NH 03755 * *********************************************************************
alex@comp.vuw.ac.nz (Alex Heatley) (10/26/87)
In article <870012@hpcilzb.HP.COM> tedj@hpcilzb.HP.COM (Ted Johnson) writes: >the Mac's hardware is so *unstable*! The 90 day warranty does little to >reassure them also. Let's see some REAL warranties (a year) for Apple stuff! Here in New Zealand (or Aotearoa as some of us prefer) we *do* get a one year warranty with our Apple gear. What happens is that you get the ordinary 90 day warranty and then, if you fill out a AppleCare form, you get nine months of AppleCare free. Of course, at the end of your year, they send you a reminder to renew your AppleCare, so it's a good marketing shitck as lots of people do renew. But it does give you an extra nine months of burn-in on your Mac. (given the number of hardware failures we have at this university, I sometimes wonder if the Macs that fail the factory burn-in aren't simply repackaged and sold to us :-)) Regards -- Alex Heatley : CSC, Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand. Domain: alex@comp.vuw.ac.nz Path: ...!uunet!vuwcomp!alex Trolls can often be found under bridges ... or in Computing Departments.
borton@net1.ucsd.edu (Chris Borton) (10/28/87)
In article <13038@comp.vuw.ac.nz> alex@comp.vuw.ac.nz (Alex Heatley) writes: >Here in New Zealand (or Aotearoa as some of us prefer) we *do* get a one year >warranty with our Apple gear. What happens is that you get the ordinary 90 day >warranty and then, if you fill out a AppleCare form, you get nine months of >AppleCare free. Similar case in West Germany, only I don't believe they do it through the AppleCare route--you just get a 1 year warranty, standard. This might even be required by law. Certainly seems much more realistic than 90 days. -cbb Chris "Johann" Borton, UC San Diego ...!sdcsvax!net1!borton borton@net1.ucsd.edu "Letztes Jahr in Deutschland, noch ein Jahr hier, en dan naar het Nederland!
jcc@ut-ngp.UUCP (10/29/87)
From what I've seen here at Texas' microcomputer lab, it would appear that AppleCare should be mandatory. Already, of some 20 mac SEs that I oversee, 2 have gone in for video bye-bye (similar to the problem on the mac +...) and another one or two are exhibiting behavior indicating that failure within the next few weeks is imminent. We've also had a drive failure and 2 other hardware-related problems... on different macs. Seeing how the macs performed wonderfully throughout the warranty period and then started fritzing around the 100-day point, it can easily be argued that AppleCare is as mandatory as seats in a car. Without it, hardware failures will surely run above the cost of AppleCare within the covered time. --chris Disclaimer: I and the views above in no way represent those of the Computation Center or the Microcomputer Lab support group.