bayes@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Scott Bayes) (01/01/88)
Just a note on a recent pleasant mail order experience for Mac software. Tuesday this week (Dec 29) I ordered TML Pascal from Programs Plus (see MacUser Jan issue). 3 good experiences: The oder taker was very pleasant and professional It cost only $59 instead of the $68 in the ad + $3 S&H It arrived today (Thurs Dec 31)! Not affiliated with Programs Plus, just a VERY satisfied customer. Scott Bayes Somewhere in Colorado
gnome@oliveb.olivetti.com (Gary) (01/03/88)
> > Tuesday this week (Dec 29) I ordered TML Pascal from Programs Plus (see > MacUser Jan issue). 3 good experiences:... > Not affiliated with Programs Plus, just a VERY satisfied customer. > Scott Bayes I'll second that! They are one of the best mail-order places I've ever dealt with. The only thing that is sometimes a problem (with all large mail-order places) is that they often don't get new products onto their product file right away. A case in point -- "Power Up" from SPC. (It's a disk optimizer) I ended-up getting it from SPC because they were local, but had to pay more... Anyway, once again, Programs Plus is the best that I've seen lately! Gary
gillies@uiucdcsp.cs.uiuc.edu (01/04/88)
O.k., before you gush mounds of praise on Programs+, I have to repeat
my gripe: I had the worst experience with Programs+ I've ever had
ANYWHERE ANYTIME IN MY ENTIRE LIFE!
1. The lady on the phone took down the wrong address. Luckily they
called back and my mom corrected it.
2. I waited two weeks, called in about "What's going on with my
order?" They had no idea. In fact, they have to CALL YOU BACK once
they track it down (> 1 hour later). I think their order-tracking
system sucks.
3. The next business day (over a weekend) I got a letter stating my
order could not go through because my credit card number was wrong
too! The order-taker got nearly EVERYTHING WRONG (see #6 below).
4. I called with the correct credit card number. They assured me the
order is going out "that day". Two hours later they called me back,
"I'm sorry, your VISA card has insufficient credit. We just cancelled
your order *click*".
5. I was so pissed, I called VISA, they told me my credit card was
fine, I called Programs+, they said "it doesn't work right in front of
me" so I had my mom call in HER credit card. When she called they
said "Oh, it just worked -- we don't need your card number".
6. The next day the order arrived. They send me a modem and THE
WRONG CABLE!!!! I said "Mac 2". How could they confuse this with
Macintosh 512K??? IDIOTS!!! I KNEW THEY WOULD FIND ANOTHER WAY TO
SCREW ME OVER ONE LAST TIME!!!
If this doesn't show some terrible incompetance, I don't know what
does. SO: If you have good luck with Programs+, remember: You GOT
LUCKY! If your salesperson sounds like an idiot, HANG UP! Don't get
SCROD like I was!
Don Gillies {ihnp4!uiucdcs!gillies} U of Illinois
{gillies@p.cs.uiuc.edu}donna@aoa.UUCP (Donna Albino) (01/04/88)
I'm glad you had good experience with Programs Plus, but I do know of at least one person who swears he will never order from that place again because of problems he's had with them. He, and I, always order from MacConnection. If you order by 8pm on a workday, you will have your order in your hands by noon the next day. And their prices are superb!
deragon@acf8.UUCP (John Paul Deragon) (01/05/88)
I agree Mac Connection is my mail order house for all macintosh products. I ordered Apache strike from Mac Connection last monday at around 4:50 in the afternoon, it was in my hands the next day at 10:30 in the morning! overnight delivery for only 3$. Mac Connection also has the most courteous and patient sales staff anywhere.
graefe@tramp.Colorado.EDU (GRAESE WILLIAM S) (01/05/88)
In article <11010002@hpfcdc.HP.COM> bayes@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Scott Bayes) writes:
=Just a note on a recent pleasant mail order experience for Mac software.
=
=Tuesday this week (Dec 29) I ordered TML Pascal from Programs Plus (see
=MacUser Jan issue). 3 good experiences:
=
= The oder taker was very pleasant and professional
=
= It cost only $59 instead of the $68 in the ad + $3 S&H
=
= It arrived today (Thurs Dec 31)!
=
=Scott Bayes
=Somewhere in Colorado
I ordered mine from Mac Connection and got it the NEXT day. Same price, too.
Mac Connection has an EXCELLENT track record, and I recommend it highly.
Std. disclaimers, of course.
!---------graefe@tramp.Colorado.EDU------------------------! ,---. !
! Bill |(insert something terribly witty, humorous, )! | _ _ !
! GraeFe, Jr.|(and inspiring in this space: )! `-+-' | !
!---------{sunybcs, hao}!boulder!tramp!graefe--------------! `---' !bayes@hpfcdc.HP.COM (Scott Bayes) (01/06/88)
Correction to the original Mail Order Delight note: I got the software the next day. A cosmic ray must have discharged a memory cell somewhere... Scott Bayes Still contending that Programs Plus was VERY GOOD Your mileage may vary.
wimp@sphinx.uchicago.edu (Jeff Haferman) (01/06/88)
One person said MacConnection was great; another said Programs Plus was
great. I agree on both counts. I have ordered from several firms, and
on overall satisfaction (inventory, price, speed of delivery, courtesy,
hours of business, toll-free numbers), these two places are far and away
the best.
--
Jeff Haferman Usenet: ...!ihnp4!gargoyle!sphinx!wimp
Bitnet: wimp%sphinx@UChicagostrypper@bsu-cs.UUCP (David Sparks) (01/07/88)
I, for one, wish to cast my vote for MacConnection. Their customer
support is superior to any I have dealt with. Service is prompt and
very professional. All orders I have placed with them have been in
hands by noon the following day. (usually earlier)
I switched to MacConnection after a very trying experience with
Programs +. I seriously wonder how some mail order houses remain in
business based on my experience with their telephone sale reps. i.e.
The people at Programs + could only give an approximate total cost for
an order I placed with them.
David Sparks UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee,uunet}!bsu-cs!strypperhallett@hamlet.steinmetz (Jeff A. Hallett) (01/07/88)
In article <1793@bsu-cs.UUCP> strypper@bsu-cs.UUCP (David Sparks) writes: >I, for one, wish to cast my vote for MacConnection. Their customer >support is superior to any I have dealt with. Service is prompt and >very professional. All orders I have placed with them have been in >hands by noon the following day. (usually earlier) > >I switched to MacConnection after a very trying experience with >Programs +. I seriously wonder how some mail order houses remain in >business based on my experience with their telephone sale reps. i.e. >The people at Programs + could only give an approximate total cost for >an order I placed with them. > >David Sparks UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee,uunet}!bsu-cs!strypper I'd recommend that you all give MacWarehouse a good opportunity. I've dealt with them. They are polite, speedy and haven't made a mistake yet. They have nearly the same policies as MacConnection. Some of their prices are a little less, some a little more, but I think the stock that they carry is more diverse (they have Red Ryder; MC doesn't). Jeffrey A. Hallett | ARPA: hallett@ge-crd.arpa Software Technology Program | UUCP: desdemona!hallett@steinmetz.uucp GE Corporate Research and Development | (518) 387-5654 +---------------------------------------+--------------------------------------+ | Credo Quia Absurdum Est | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
brad@pheasant.cs.utexas.edu (blumenthal @ home with the armadillos) (01/08/88)
Well, since I got most of my information from the net, I figured I'd
give some back. I hope the signal to noise ratio isn't too low.
I just upgraded my Mac from a 524 (that's a 512e with a Dove 1Meg
upgrade) to a 548S (that's a 2Meg upgrade with SCSI), and replaced my
old Tecmar 10Meg serial drive with a Jamine 20Meg SCSI drive. Here's
my experience (summary first, then the details, please see disclaimer
at the end before intiiating lawsuits):
Conclusions: A good experience overall. I'm glad I saved the $160 a
local store was charging (over the mail order price) to install the
Dove board. Dove is a very winning company with a winning product.
Jasmine makes a very winning product. Programs+ and ComputerWare are
suitably winning companies, but I'm not dedicating any shrines. The
Dove and Apple logic boards are tough. Given all the force I put on
those things, you could probably sit on one (carefully) and still have
it work. If you can take a chip out of a socket without breaking any
pins, you can do this upgrade.
Morals:
Moral 1: Don't order over the holidays. Your stuff will just
sit in the shippers's warehouses.
Moral 2: It never hurts to ask.
Moral 3: Accidents happen. Sometimes even the net is accurate. :-)
History: Since I had the 1Meg upgrade done at a local store, I
already had a fan installed (probably a necessity for the Dove memory
upgrades).
Ordering: I got the Dove upgrade from Programs+ since their price was
$20 to $40 less than MacConnection (depending on which ad you look
at). I got the Jasmine drive from ComputerWare, because, although
their price was about the same as ordering direct from Jasmine,
ComputerWare was shipping immediately, and Jasmine had an 8-10 day
delay.
I ordered on 30 Dec. '87. I paid the extra $3 to Programs+
for "Rush-Air-Delivery" from Fed Ex, and asked if this was a one day
service. The woman taking my order told me it was. It wasn't. I
called Fed Ex, and they had never heard of "Rush-Air-Delivery" ("We
have one-day service and two-day service.") Big deal. The Dove
upgrade arrived the second working day (4 Jan. 88). ComputerWare
charged about $15 for second day air from UPS (blue label) and the
drive arrived on 6 Jan. (4th working day, one week real time). (see
Moral 1)
Products: The Dove upgrade came with the wrong manuals. There was a
software manual (for users) inside the box, and an installation manual
that Programs+ had sent along with the box. The installation manual
was for upgrades to machines with the old ROMS (somewhat confusing,
since both that upgrade and the SCSI upgrade involve a second board
that fits over the ROMS). I called Dove, and talked to a very
competent woman who told me what manuals I needed (in addition to
chatting with me about some of the nuances of the upgrade board). I
asked if they could be sent next day (UPS red label this time) and she
said they could send it that way collect. I asked if the error was
Dove's fault or Programs+'s, and she said it was probably Dove's
packaging. I asked if Dove would foot the bill, since they had
packaged the wrong manuals, and after checking with her superviser,
she said "yes", again. (see Moral 2). The manuals did indeed arrive
the next day (5 Jan.).
The Jasmine drive is everything it's said to be on the net
(see Moral 3). Most of the advertised "9 meg of PD software and
shareware" is stuff most net.pack.rats already have, but it's still
*very* nice.
Installation: Good clean fun. I have a little hardware experience. I
did a few breadboards and one wirewrap project in college; I've made a
couple of cables; and with the help of a friend, I replaced the power
supply in my Tecmar. As I said, If you can take a chip out of a
socket without breaking any pins, you can do this upgrade. My only
regret is that I didn't have a multimeter handy to test and adjust the
voltage while I had the Mac open, but since it ain't broke....
Anyway. Step 1, opening the Mac. Easy, just use the tools in the
MacSnap toolkit and follow the directions. I'm not making any
recommendations here, but if I were, I would definitely recommend
having a look inside the Mac. The signatures on the inside of the
back of the case make it pure Apple, inside and out. Step 2, removing
the Dove 524 upgrade: about what you'd expect from a daughter board
that takes about 30 pounds of pressure to snap on. It is removable,
but your heart will go up into your throat when you hear it start to
come loose. I just took it slow and careful, and it wasn't too bad,
if a little violent. Step 3, installing the SCSI board. Piece of
cake. The only gotcha is to be careful pulling the ROM chips out of
their sockets -- it's easy to bend pins (having done this before, I
was ready). Step 4, installing the new MacSnap board. I nearly broke
my thumbs on this one. It takes a *lot* of pressure to snap that
puppy down. I finally wound up using a pair of padded channel-lock
pliers to squeeze part of it together (something I do *not* recommend,
but it worked well for me), and even that didn't completely do it (see
below).
The Jasmine drive was plug and go. Slick. Slicker 'en snot.
Debugging: First law of computer science: Nothing works right the
first time. Symptom 1: Dark Screen. Bug: I forgot to reattach the
power and floppy drive connections to the mother board (wetware
error). Symptom 2: Funky stripes and no disk with "?" or sad mac on
power up. Bug: Damn board still wasn't all the way down. The black
things that fit over the logic board chips have to be *flush* with the
logic board, and it's tough to see all of them. My only clue was a
slight bulge in the bottom of the logic board. Push that down (again)
and "wallah:" one 2Meg mac with SCSI.
The Jasmine was shipped with System/Finder 4.1/5.3 (brother!
my head spins trying to keep up with the possible combinations), but
replacing them with 4.2/6.0 was no sweat. There's nothing special
about the Jasmine-supplied system.
Thanks to everyone who has reported their experiences, good and bad,
so I had some things to go by.
Take care, ARPA: brad@pheasant.cs.utexas.edu
Brad Blumenthal UUCP: {ihnp4, harvard}!im4u!pheasant!brad
Disclaimer: I am making no recommendations here, either for or against
doing any of this. Use this information at your own risk; I make no
warranty about its reliability or suitability for any purpose.
Opinions contained herein are my own and are just that: opinions.abe@j.cc.purdue.edu (Vic Abell) (01/08/88)
MacConnection is the premier mail order house. Evidence? On the same day in November I ordered a hard disk from them and a memory upgrade from Programs+. The disk arrived before noon the next day, priced exactly as indicated in their latest ad. Programs+, on the other hand, charged more for the memory upgrade than their latest advertised price; refused to ship it next day air, as stated in their ad; and took seven days to deliver it to me. My only regret is that MacConnection did not have the memory upgrade in stock.
cnc@hpcilzb.HP.COM (Chris Christensen) (01/08/88)
My wife ordered Studio Session from Mac Connection for me for Christmas. (I asked for a harddisk, but well...) She ordered it in desperation on Dec 23rd. We open gifts on Dec 24th and there it was under the tree, wrapped and everything (Joan did the wrapping). They could not guarentee overnight delivery due to the Christmas season, but they got it there anyway. Mac Connection gets my business.
cimeti@nucsrl.UUCP (Israel Cimet) (01/10/88)
> The Jasmine drive is everything it's said to be on the net >(see Moral 3). Most of the advertised "9 meg of PD software and >shareware" is stuff most net.pack.rats already have, but it's still >*very* nice. Here is a plug for the "Savings Zone". I ordered a CMS McStack 20 meg. hard drive from them (following the consensus of the net). It was delivered 2nd day air (cost = $4). To my surprise, the "zone" checked the drive before shipping and *included* about 17 meg. of PD, shareware, and demo programs. As in the Jasmine case, most was the usual stuff. However, most of it were the latest versions of the programs (which I have not seen even in Sumex or at BBSs). It really saved me a lot of downloading time. It also included their "electronic catalog" (about 1 meg.) which is a "hypercard-like" application with the description of all their products (with prices). I have ordered from them and from MacConnection and have no complaints so far. Yes, the usual disclaimers apply!!. ------------------------- I. Arieh Cimet Northwestern University