jdm@ut-emx.UUCP (Jim Meiss) (04/16/88)
About 6 weeks ago I received an announcement that the all new, fantastic version 4.0 of Dollars and Sense was now available--and for registered users a mere $50 too!! The brochure promised a 2-3 week delivery if you called the 800 number ( 800-443-0100). Well I did...and they billed my credit card... but it didn't arrive :-((. I called today and they said they "found bugs"-- in the code. Gee whiz, can you imagine that? I wonder if they've heard of the time honored programmers method called "debugging" :-)( ? Well the word from them is that the shipping date is still 2-3 weeks away if you are naive enough to buy that! This vaporware business is spreading almost as fast as viruses! Beware. Jim Meiss jdm@emx.utexas.edu jdm%uta.MFENET@nmfecc.ARPA -------------------------------------------------------------------------
kateley@Apple.COM (Jim Kateley) (04/18/88)
In article <1729@ut-emx.UUCP> jdm@ut-emx.UUCP (Jim Meiss) writes: > > About 6 weeks ago I received an announcement that the all >new, fantastic version 4.0 of Dollars and Sense was now available--and >for registered users a mere $50 too!! At least they let you know about it, I had to call them countless times before I got thru and could order it! > The brochure promised a 2-3 week delivery if you called the 800 >number ( 800-443-0100). Well I did...and they billed my credit card... >but it didn't arrive :-((. I called today and they said they "found bugs"-- >in the code. Gee whiz, can you imagine that? I wonder if they've heard >of the time honored programmers method called "debugging" :-)( ? There were some nasty bugs in 4.0, the main one for me was it bombing in the middle of a session under Multifinder! > Well the word from them is that the shipping date is still 2-3 >weeks away if you are naive enough to buy that! This is news to me, I received version 4.0 about 4 weeks after I ordered it, and then about a month after that I received 4.1 automatically!! The postmark on my 4.1 disk is March 16th. This was suprising, as I had given up on 4.0 and its bugs, and I had not gotten around to calling them and asking what was going on. > > Beware. 4.1 seems to work ok, but I'm still going by SEAO (save early and often...) > Jim Meiss > jdm@emx.utexas.edu > jdm%uta.MFENET@nmfecc.ARPA -- Jim Kateley UUCP: {sun, voder, nsc, mtxinu, dual}!apple!kateley S,P,HnS! DOMAIN: kateley@apple.COM Applelink: kateley1 Disclaimer: What I say, think, or smell does not reflect any policy or stray thought by Apple Computer, Inc.
gregl@ozvax.TEK.COM (Greg Lacefield) (04/23/88)
Jim Kateley writes: >In article <1729@ut-emx.UUCP> jdm@ut-emx.UUCP (Jim Meiss) writes: >> >> About 6 weeks ago I received an announcement that the all >>new, fantastic version 4.0 of Dollars and Sense was now available--and >>for registered users a mere $50 too!! I read about it in MacUser. So I called their 800-number back in March. The price is technically $49.95 + $5.00 shipping. I had them bill it to my VISA. "Would you like 2-day air on that, sir?" Sure, why not, so tack on another $5.00 for a total of $59.95. "All right, sir, you should receive that by Monday, Tuesday at the latest." (This was a Friday.) Wonderful. Thank you. >>...and they billed my credit card... >>but it didn't arrive :-((. Deja vu. The following Wednesday came and no software. I got on the phone to them, inquiring as to the status of my order. "Well, sir, you'll have to call our 213-number for that." OK, spend my own money to find out where my order is. What the heck, just one phone call. So I did. "Oh, sir, did you order from our 800-number?" Yes, as a matter of fact. "Well, didn't they tell you that it takes another week before the order arrives at our warehouse so we can process it?" No, they didn't. If they'd done that I wouldn't have ordered 2-day air. "Well, sir, that is the case, but you should have your package by early next week." So I wait... ...and wait... ...and wait... >>I called today and they said they "found >>bugs"-- >>in the code. Gee whiz, can you imagine that? I wonder if they've heard >>of the time honored programmers method called "debugging" :-)( ? ...and wait. Wednesday, TWO WEEKS LATER, and no software. I'm pretty steamed by now, and call them to let them know. "Oh, sir, what's happened is that our programmers found a bug in version 4.0 and your order has been held up until they can fix it." That's OK, ship it anyway. "I'm sorry, sir, we can't do that. All orders have been placed on hold. But you can just be patient and it will be there." SURE...We all know how easy it is to debug and release code on time, now don't we? >There were some nasty bugs in 4.0, the main one for me was it bombing >in the middle of a session under Multifinder! I just want my software. I can understand not shipping it if there are major bugs in the bowels of the program itself, regardless of the environment it is operating in. But to me, this instance has a work-around, i.e. DON'T RUN IT WITH MULTIFINDER. If there are these kinds of bugs, they should just include a note inside the packages stating as such. Then I won't even TRY to run D&S under Multifinder. They should then announce that they will be shipping a free upgrade to registered users as soon as the bugs are fixed. But, Jim is right, what they REALLY need is competent programmers and testers so software with MAJOR problems doesn't even get out the door. Microsoft is as guilty as anyone else; witness Word 3.0. (I know that's low, but I'm pretty upset with Monogram in general...read on...) >> Well the word from them is that the shipping date is still 2-3 >>weeks away if you are naive enough to buy that! This is absolute HORSESH*T!! I ordered mine over 5 weeks ago, and they have really F*CKED UP, according to this: >This is news to me, I received version 4.0 about 4 weeks after I >ordered it, and then about a month after that I received 4.1 >automatically!! The postmark on my 4.1 disk is March 16th. >This was suprising, as I had given up on 4.0 >and its bugs, and I had not gotten around to calling them >and asking what was going on. So where is MY copy?? Wait, it's not over yet. Then, about a week ago, I was reconciling my VISA balance (kept in D&S 1.3) with that of my bank via phone (electronic information, that kind of thing). Amazingly, there was about a $60 discrepancy between the two. So I called the bank and inquired as to the transactions that had taken place on my account in the last month. (I haven't received my statement yet). "Well, Mr. Lacefield, I show that you have ...(such and such transaction)..., $59.95 on March (something) to Monogram, then $59.95 AGAIN to Monogram the following week." These IDIOTS have charged me TWICE for something they promised I would have over the weekend and HAVE NOT DELIVERED FIVE WEEKS LATER!!!! What do you think I did next? On the phone I get, PIS*ED as all hell, to their 213-number, informing them of their "error". "Oh, sorry, sir, we'll reverse the charges just as soon as you send us your statement pointing out our mistake." You IMBECILES!! Don't you track your customer's transactions? Can't you just look it up yourself? "No, sir, we need proof." That's IT. What kind of a way is THIS to support your customers. In my book, Monogram gets a big fat ZERO (0) on a scale of 1 to 10. Not only did I have to make four phone calls to them (and still haven't received my order), but now I have to endure finance charges on two VISA transactions with nothing to show for either one. Let me remind you that at no time in this scenario has Monogram mad any attempt to contact ME about the status of my order. You can bet that this company will receive a nice little package from me, including my VISA statement, my phone bill, and a carbon copy of a letter to the Better Business Bureau. And they will reimburse me for the extra transaction, the finance charges associated with BOTH transactions, all the toll calls I made to them, and the stamps I use to send them the whole schmear. And I will NEVER do business with Monogram software AGAIN. I wish the best of luck to anybody who does. They will need it. ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------- Greg Lacefield gregl@ozvax.gwd.tek.com ...!tektronix!ozvax!gregl
ras@skippy.UUCP (Bob Surtees) (04/23/88)
From article <585@ozvax.TEK.COM>, by gregl@ozvax.TEK.COM (Greg Lacefield): > > ... > ... > And I will NEVER do business with Monogram software AGAIN. I wish the > best of luck to anybody who does. They will need it. It has been some time since I have dealt with this company that I can't remember all of the circumstances except that, as an outcome of my experience with them, I vowed never to deal with ever again. One thing I do remember is that a second disk, to use as a backup because the original was copy protected, did not arrive in the mail as promised. I did receive an empty package in its place. Check the packaging if and when you do get your order delivered to see if it's not empty! -- Bob Surtees (ras@skippy.UUCP) Home = 42.51'N 71.25'W Digital Equipment Corporation UUCP (...!decvax!skippy!ras) Nashua, NH DNET (SKANDA::SURTEES)
thisted@gargoyle.UChicago.EDU (Ronald A. Thisted) (04/25/88)
From article <585@ozvax.TEK.COM>, by gregl@ozvax.TEK.COM (Greg Lacefield): > > These IDIOTS have charged me TWICE for something they promised I would > have over the weekend and HAVE NOT DELIVERED FIVE WEEKS LATER!!!! > > You can bet that this company will receive a nice little package from me, > including my VISA statement, my phone bill, and a carbon copy of a letter > to the Better Business Bureau. And they will reimburse me for the extra > transaction, the finance charges associated with BOTH transactions, all > the toll calls I made to them, and the stamps I use to send them the whole > schmear. > > Run, don't walk, to your nearest mail box, and send copies of your Visa bill and everything you included in your posting to the company that bills you for your VISA card. If you do this IN WRITING within 60 days of the original billing, then they must treat those charges and the finance charges related to them as a disputed item. In all probability they will charge these fees back to Monogram. If you don't do this, Monogram may never come through for you, and may even go bankrupt, leaving you as one among many creditors to file for 2cents on the dollar in Federal district court somewhere. If you wait until it is clear that Monogram won't give you satisfaction, it may be too late for the bank to charge them back. This happened to me once; I kept giving the company the benefit of the doubt until their phone was disconnected. At that point the Bank just said, "sorry, sir." [Federal law requires the bank to credit your account for a disputed item if you contact them in writing within the specified time. It also requires mail-order companies to provide you in writing with the option of cancelling an order that they are unable to ship within 30 days. It sounds to me like Monogram is in trouble, and the longer you wait, the more likely you are to be in trouble too.] Ron Thisted Dept of Statistics/ The Univ of Chicago
straka@ihlpf.ATT.COM (Straka) (04/25/88)
In article <352@skippy.UUCP> ras@skippy.UUCP (Bob Surtees) writes: >From article <585@ozvax.TEK.COM>, by gregl@ozvax.TEK.COM (Greg Lacefield): || ... || And I will NEVER do business with Monogram software AGAIN. I wish the || best of luck to anybody who does. They will need it. |It has been some time since I have dealt with this company that I can't |remember all of the circumstances except that, as an outcome of my experience |with them, I vowed never to deal with ever again. One thing I do remember |is that a second disk, to use as a backup because the original was copy |protected, did not arrive in the mail as promised. I did receive an empty |package in its place. FLAME ON! Sounds sort of like the experience I had with ProVUE, purveyors of OverVUE. When my order arrived, (cute little floppy with one of those little shutter stickers (yes, intact)) I found that the disk contained not OverVUE 1.2, but a system folder and COPY II MAC, version something-or-other. However, in this case they CHEERFULLY sent me the right copy of their software when I sent in the original disk. (If they hadn't, maybe I could have sent it to Central Point for an update? :-)) Does this perhaps have something to do with PC software houses that do marginal ports to the Mac? :-) Perhaps they don't seem to have enough energy left over for the Mac business after the attention they seem to lavish over their PC business. PS: When OverVUE's print drivers refused to work with the latest laserwriter drivers, and ProVUE said: "Sure it's fixed, just send in the original, plus ~$10 to cover handling.", I said "It's time to go out and buy some REAL database software, not some hack like OverVUE." And I did. Anybody want to buy an almost current version of OverVUE? :-( FLAME OFF! Boy, that feels better! -- Rich Straka ihnp4!ihlpf!straka Advice for the day: "MSDOS - just say no."
vita@sunbarney.steinmetz (Mark F. Vita) (04/26/88)
In article <352@skippy.UUCP> ras@skippy.UUCP (Bob Surtees) writes: >From article <585@ozvax.TEK.COM>, by gregl@ozvax.TEK.COM (Greg Lacefield): >> >> ... >> ... >> And I will NEVER do business with Monogram software AGAIN. I wish the >> best of luck to anybody who does. They will need it. > >It has been some time since I have dealt with this company that I can't >remember all of the circumstances except that, as an outcome of my experience >with them, I vowed never to deal with ever again. One thing I do remember Well, since people are having such problems with Monogram, I figured I'd put in a plug for MacMoney, from Survivor Software. It's a good product, and seems to have all the features one would need in such a program (although I am admittedly not a "power user" when it comes to financial management programs.) The best part is that Survivor appears to have a very reasonable upgrade and support policy. I bought my copy in November from MacConnection for $42. I used it for a few months, and then in January, I read that there was a new version 3.0 coming out, so I gave them a call to see what the upgrade cost would be. To my surprise, they said the upgrade was free; all I had to do was send them a letter requesting the upgrade. I did, and sure enough, three or four weeks later a package showed up with the new software, a new manual, the whole wad. I think I got my $42 worth.... The newest version is $69 from MacConnection, which is still cheaper than Dollars & Sense. I suggest that disgruntled D&S users may want to check it out. Disclaimer: Of course, I have no relationship with Survivor Software other than as a satisfied customer. ---- Mark Vita ARPA: vita@ge-crd.ARPA General Electric Company UUCP: vita@desdemona.steinmetz.UUCP Corporate R & D vita@desdemona.steinmetz.ge.com Schenectady, NY desdemona!vita@steinmetz.UUCP
cooper@odin.ucsd.edu (Ken Cooper) (04/26/88)
While plugs are being made for financial software, I purchased Managing Your Money about three weeks ago, and find it an *excellent* program. I haven't tried out MacMoney, but I have tried out Dollars and Sense, and MYM has a superior interface. It covers just about anything you might want to do with your home finances (I use it for tracking checking accounts, home purchasing, expense accounts, stock purchases, mutual funds, tax estimation, cash flow projection, net worth evaluation) in a very intuitive and straightforward manner. The "author" of the program (Andy Tobias -- he basically wrote up a wish list, and had others program it for him) is available for support on CompuServe, and responds very quickly to questions. The cons: it is the most expensive of the lot (MacConnection: $129), and does not have the same liberal upgrade policy as Survivor (they offer the "Deluxe Support Package" in the box for an additional $49, which entitles you to one free upgrade). Disclaimer: I have no connection with the makers of MYM, I am just a satisfied customer. Ken Cooper ARPA: cooper%cs@ucsd.edu UUCP: ...!ucsd!sdcsvax!cooper COMPUSERVE: 71571,407
jdm@ut-emx.UUCP (Jim Meiss) (04/28/88)
Just called Monogram again (4/28/88). They still claim that Dollars and Sense version 4.?? (greater than the buggy 4.1) is two to three weeks from shipping. Apparently the bugs in 4.0 had to do with Multifinder compatability and in 4.1 had to do with writing checks. I couldn't get them to send me 4.1...even though I never use it to write checks. They also were extremely vague about whether those "lucky" people who got 4.1 or 4.0 would ever see a copy of the new version, if and when it ever comes out! Jim Meiss jdm@emx.cc.utexas.edu