twakeman@hpcea.CE.HP.COM (Teriann Wakeman) (10/04/88)
WHAT IF??
While reading postings relating to university discounts, and the gap between
the information age haves and have-nots I started wondering...
What if Apple were to start a new program - a Mac-head-start program.
What I am envisioning would be a program that would offer low end
Macintoshes at or below university consortum prices to primary and
secondary school students {yes I know this means to parents of school
childern and this discriminates against people who do not have children in
school}. And what if these low end Macs were offered with a low interest
time payment plan. Suppose the payments were low enough that low income
families could afford an entry level Mac. What would happen??
Business sales should be unaffected. University consortum sales would
probably decrease since incoming students would be more likely to have
a Mac before they get into college. Adults who want the latest Mac
technology will still buy what they can afford from wherever they can get
it cheapest. Revineue would be lost from families with children who would
normally purchase a low end Mac. There of course would be more overhead
within Apple to administer the program.
but what would be gained??
Families that otherwise could not afford a Mac would have them. Both children
and adults would be exposed to an easy to learn and use computer. Children
could learn how to use a computer rather then becoming computer phobic as
they grow up. Adults would have an edge to get over any phobia they might
have about computers. This could be a tool to help break the proverty
cycle in many families. It has been said that the "computer for the rest of
us" slogan never ment computer for the economic disadvantaged. It ment that
the Mac was a computer that could be easily learned and used by the casual
user. It has also been said that the casual user can not afford a Mac.
What if "the computer for the rest of us" was streached to include low
end Macs for families with children who might not otherwise be able to
afford a Mac?
What could Apple gain from such a program? How about being able to keep
production lines for the oldest least expensive Mac runing at full capacity?
How about the Mac system, by being the first system a child & many adults
are exposed to, setting the future expectations for these users? How about
creating increased product loyalty and increased feelings of good will.
How about a Mac lead information revolution among the rest of the
population. How about a step twords the dreams of many 60's and 70's computer
pioneers. What about a big step of making Macintosh not only a household
name but also a household product?
What if Apple dares to be great, instead if trying to become another IBM?
TeriAnn
Disclamer: I would not be able to benifit directly from the inactment of
my proposal. but I sure would like to see the effect on society.twakeman@hpcea.CE.HP.COM (Teriann Wakeman) (10/04/88)
I keep getting the feeling that there are really two Apple Computer companies, One composed of people oriented people who want to help make the world a better place. People who are concerned about disabled people, or the computer gender gap in schools. I also see a IBMish company concerned with maximizing profits at all costs who as they grow cast off the hackers and individual change agents who made Apple what it is as Apple's main source of income becomes business. Oh well, there are two sides to each coin, and I am sure that there are way more then two sides to Apple.Apple, Please, in your rush to become a fortune whatever with the largest cash reserve, don't lose sight of your humanist side. It's humanist attitudes and actions that make a really great company great. TeriAnn
tbetz@dasys1.UUCP (Tom Betz) (10/06/88)
Quoth twakeman@hpcea.CE.HP.COM (Teriann Wakeman) in <430049@hpcea.CE.HP.COM>: |WHAT IF?? | |While reading postings relating to university discounts, and the gap between |the information age haves and have-nots I started wondering... | |What if Apple were to start a new program - a Mac-head-start program. | |What I am envisioning would be a program that would offer low end |Macintoshes at or below university consortum prices to primary and |secondary school students {yes I know this means to parents of school |childern and this discriminates against people who do not have children in |school}. And what if these low end Macs were offered with a low interest |time payment plan. Suppose the payments were low enough that low income |families could afford an entry level Mac. What would happen?? What if you were to call Sun Remarketing at 800-821-3221 or 801-752-7631 and ask them about their reconditioned Mac 512k and Mac+ and Lisa/Mac XLs (with their own HFS) for very cheap? You want time payments? They take Visa, MasterCard, and Optima. Apple will never do it for you... you're gonna have to settle for used. But it still works like new. -- "If I found the truth I would tell you and you |Tom Betz would have me shot." -- Carlos Fuentes -- |ZCNY, Yonkers, NY 10701-2509 Those who purchase a little safety at the price of |UUCP: tbetz@dasys1.UUCP or liberty will soon have neither liberty nor safety. | ...!cmcl2!phri!dasys1!tbetz
tecot@Apple.COM (Ed Tecot) (11/06/88)
In article <430050@hpcea.CE.HP.COM> twakeman@hpcea.CE.HP.COM (Teriann Wakeman) writes: >I keep getting the feeling that there are really two Apple Computer companies, >One composed of people oriented people who want to help make the world a >better place. People who are concerned about disabled people, or the computer >gender gap in schools. I also see a IBMish company concerned with maximizing >profits at all costs who as they grow cast off the hackers and individual >change agents who made Apple what it is as Apple's main source of income >becomes business. Oh well, there are two sides to each coin, and I am >sure that there are way more then two sides to Apple.Apple, Please, >in your rush to become a fortune whatever with the largest cash reserve, >don't lose sight of your humanist side. It's humanist attitudes and actions >that make a really great company great. Actually, we are one Apple that wants to help make the world a better place. As idealists, we want to change the world, one person at a time. As egocentric realists, we feel that our very existence is essential to make those changes. A large cash reserve is one way to ensure our existence in the future. It allows us to pump even more money into research and development to produce Macs that do more at a lower cost. In 1984, I was shopping for a new car. One automobile I was considering was a Nissan 200SX, for $9500. That same car, with minor styling changes, is now $14,000. By comparison, the original Macintosh cost $2499 in 1984. A Mac Plus is now $1799. If Nissan had followed our lead, you could get a 300ZX for $7200. Of course, I am neglecting the fact that the automobile industry is much more mature; that technical advances are much less significant nowadays compared to semiconductors and software. But the essence is the same. You are complaining because you see a toy you can't afford. I can sympathize with you, there's a house in San Francisco I'd like to have but never will because 1) it's not for sale, and 2) it's probably worth about 1.5 million dollars. However, I don't see where a company interested in changing the world can come off mortgaging its very existence just so some technology junkies can have their toys. Personally, I'd rather take that money and put it to a good use instead, such as donations to the Children's Discovery Museum in San Jose, or donations to schools and worthwhile charities, wouldn't you? _emt
stanbach@Apple.COM (Francis Stanbach) (11/07/88)
>to produce Macs that do more at a lower cost. In 1984, I was shopping for >a new car. One automobile I was considering was a Nissan 200SX, for $9500. >That same car, with minor styling changes, is now $14,000. By comparison, The name is the only part of the 240SX that resembles the 200SX. Francis Francis Stanbach 723676(^%&5yugHBNvkhjgIYG&$43$DgfcvMHG Software Engineer &$!#)87sfbhf07y-7^&*0&^767-6776076&^67 Communications Product Development (&%^$33DfgvkhgGCI%R9 YPIUY067HJHG4231- Apple Computer, Inc. ^!%&^%-827=817=28712-98618752gvvkgvFFI
zimerman@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Jacob Ben-david Zimmerman) (11/07/88)
NOTE: THIS ARTICLE IS A)A RESPONSE AND B) AN EMOTIONAL OUTBURST. IF YOU ARE NOT INTERESTED, HIT N NOW! In a preceding article, it was mentioned that "The name is the only way that the 240sx is similar to the 200sx"...paraphrased from memory. Anyway, this was in response to an Apple person's message defending Apple against some criticism. THIS ARTICLE IS NOT A FLAME, but I believe that the comparison of cars was not really the point. I would just like to take the time to say to Apple: Keep it up guys, you're doing a heck of a job. Even if I don't agree with your price manipulations, I think you produce great computers, and I felt I had to respond to all the various 'Black Apple' statements on the board. A question: Most of the yelling at Apple has been in respone to what seems to me to be higher management decisions. Does anyone at Apple know how many of the truly exalted types read the Net? just curious...anyway, to summarize... I LOVE MY MAC! AND THE ONLY WAY ANYONE IS GONNA GET IT OR MY COMPUTING DOLLARS (JOBS INCLUDED) IS TO PRY THEM FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS!!! <whew.> Ok. sorry all for the outburst. Any flames to me about using up net bandwidth, even though i don't agree with you, :-), at least email them to me rather than use up more bandwidth yourself. Night All. -JBZimmerman! -- ___________ | "A flute with no holes is not a flute. A donut || | with no holes is a danish." || ||acob Zimmerman!+> <zimerman@phoenix.Princeton.EDU> INTERNET === | <zimerman@PUCC> BITnet
twakeman@hpcea.CE.HP.COM (Teriann Wakeman) (11/10/88)
Since it was a posting of mine from way back when that started this item,
I would like to make some clarifications.
The apparent dicotomy within Apple I was speaking {well typing} of had to do
with the seemingly conflicting messages I was getting from the people who
create Apple's MacIntosh products and the people who are currently running the
company.
The people within Apple that I personally know, have corresponded with over
the net, and have just known by reading their postings all seem to be
humanists with a dream of helping human kind and empowering people. I have
gotten a feeling that they consider their real job within Apple to be helping
and empowering human kind and that developing new computers &
software is the vehicle for accomplishing their real programme.
In the past, the image that the Apple company has shown the world was the
collective visions of its employees. It was this image that attracted many
of us to Apple in the first place.
The Apple company image that I mainly see now is that of a bigish company
that is selling commodities and trying to maximize their profits. Just a
well run Sucessful American company, like IBM, DEC, and SUN.
The rational that I hear is that as a company grows and matures it must grow
up. It must set asside idealistic dreams and focus on providing an image
that is acceptable to the other bigish businesses with which they do
business. Also when a company changes leadership, its personality will also
change. I get these reasions all the time in internal HP discussions on what
has happened to the HP way.
Being somewhat of a dreamer and idealist myself, I was lamenting the
apparent changes in the Apple company's image and making a plea to
individuals within Apple not to lose sight of your own personal dreams that
made your company great in the first place.
> A question: Most of the yelling at Apple has been in respone to what
>seems to me to be higher management decisions. Does anyone at Apple know
>how many of the truly exalted types read the Net? just curious...
It is my understanding that there is someone from Apple who reads the net
and prints out things that might interest higher management & distributes
same to their powers that be. That's why I occasionally get up on a
soapbox.
TeriAnnmce@tc.fluke.COM (Brian McElhinney) (11/10/88)
In article <20036@apple.Apple.COM> tecot@Apple.COM (Ed Tecot) writes: > A large cash reserve is one way to ensure our existence in the future. It > allows us to pump even more money into research and development to produce > Macs that do more at a lower cost. I hope you don't take offense, but after all these years, and hundreds of millions of dollars (?), just what has research and development accomplished? The Mac SE? How much R&D did it take to create a Mac+ clone? Oh boy does it ever "do more at a lower cost". (Sorry, couldn't resist that!) The Mac II? How many of those millions of R&D dollars did it take to bring out a 68020 box with 2 wait states and no DMA? Evolutionary software changes? Creating Multifinder, NFNTs, System 6.0.12, etc., is expensive, but is it *that* expensive? Revolutionary new software? Color QuickDraw is a nice piece of work, but why is the Palette Manager such a limited thing? Is anyone paying attention to what the R&D dollars are buying? Take a look at the MacDTS FracApp code and then imagine what PixelPaint must look like. The rumored virtual memory MacOS, with multitasking and IPC? Sounds like reinventing MACH and then tacking on the toolbox. Different, but not better. It also sounds a lot like OS/2... Now all those reorganizations, *they* must suck up some serious money! 1/2 :-) One man's opinion, Brian McElhinney mce@tc.fluke.com
david_islander_hughes@cup.portal.com (11/13/88)
While I agree in spirit with what Teriann has to say, the bottom line
is that the executives of Apple MUST answer to the people who OWN
the company - the stockholders.
The way for the end users such as ourselves to have a loud voice
in the compnay is to buy stock.
While our few shares taken individually are not paid attention to by
Scully, and the other 'profit-minded' individuals, i f those of us who own a fe
shares of stock were to band together through an association of 'vested
owners' and make our wishes known, we would have a LOUD voice.
Thanks to the the generous support of our government of interconnected
computers lioke ARPA/USENET/ (Portal is my entry) think of the THOUSANDS
of stockholders whoi can share opions and strategy.
"propsals" to Apple won't work - but owners' demands will!