128a-3db@e260-3b.berkeley.edu (Jonathan Dubman) (04/23/89)
>mithomas@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Michael Thomas Niehaus) writes: >According to the May issue of MacUser, MacPaint is in its last version. >MacPaint's features are to be included in the next version of MacDraw, which >should be announced later this year. Yogen Dalal, Claris' vice president of >product development, is the person credited with making this statement. >I can see Bill Atkinson cringing at the death of his child... >-Michael Niehaus GOOD NEWS: MacPaint isn't dead, it's just taking on a new form. BAD NEWS: Swiss-Army-Knife software that tries to be all things to all people is often hard to use and confusing for the beginner. MacPaint 2.0 is harder for little kids to use than the original version. The original, elegant MacPaint is, in a sense, already dead. FIX: All complicated applications should have a "beginner mode" with fewer accessible features. We've already seen this in some applications. PREDICTION: Claris is smart. They'll do something like this. (Have they already?) -Jonathan Dubman
krazy@claris.com (Jeff Erickson) (04/24/89)
From 128a-3db@e260-3b.berkeley.edu (Jonathan Dubman): >mithomas@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Michael Thomas Niehaus) writes: >>According to the May issue of MacUser, MacPaint is in its last version. >>MacPaint's features are to be included in the next version of MacDraw, which >>should be announced later this year. Yogen Dalal, Claris' vice president of >>product development, is the person credited with making this statement. >>I can see Bill Atkinson cringing at the death of his child... > > GOOD NEWS: MacPaint isn't dead, it's just taking on a new form. > BAD NEWS: Swiss-Army-Knife software that tries to be all things to all > people is often hard to use and confusing for the beginner. > MacPaint 2.0 is harder for little kids to use than the original > version. The original, elegant MacPaint is, in a sense, > already dead. > FIX: All complicated applications should have a "beginner mode" with > fewer accessible features. We've already seen this in some > applications. > PREDICTION: Claris is smart. They'll do something like this. > (Have they already?) Your suggestion has some merit, but in all honesty, I don't expect it to happen. We try our best to make our applications easy to use as every level. I'm going to be sorely pissed if this version of MacDraw appears and the little kids can't understand it. I'm also going to be sorely pissed if I have to CONFIGURE it to be that easy. For a look at what Yogen's talking about, take a look at the graphics module of AppleWorks GS. It's both a paint program and a draw program. At the same time, not in separate layers, not with bitmap "objects". The integration isn't seamless, but it closer than any program on the Mac. It's also a first attempt at a program of its kind. [Of course, I can neither confirm nor deny the existence of any future Claris products. And since I didn't hear Yogen say anything, I can't tell you what exactly he said. (Of course, I could go ask him. His office is about 50 feet from here....) I know nawtink!!] -- Jeff Erickson Claris Corporation | Birdie, birdie, in the sky, 408/987-7309 Applelink: Erickson4 | Why'd you do that in my eye? krazy@claris.com ames!claris!krazy | I won't fret, and I won't cry. "I'm a heppy, heppy ket!" | I'm just glad that cows don't fly.
suitti@haddock.ima.isc.com (Stephen Uitti) (04/26/89)
>> GOOD NEWS: MacPaint isn't dead, it's just taking on a new form. >> BAD NEWS: Swiss-Army-Knife software that tries to be all things to all >> people is often hard to use and confusing for the beginner. >> MacPaint 2.0 is harder for little kids to use than the original >> version. The original, elegant MacPaint is, in a sense, >> already dead. Isn't the paint stuff in Hypercard essentially MacPaint, with few or no frills? Sure, Hypercard is the BeAllAndEndAllOfSwissArmyKnife software, and i didn't know how to get it to do painting right away, but... >> FIX: All complicated applications should have a "beginner mode" with >> fewer accessible features. We've already seen this in some >> applications. uSoft Word 3.xx has "short menus". I'm not sure if this is the kind of thing you are talking about. I find that they don't really help. I don't learn anything new if i don't see the entries & play. >For a look at what Yogen's talking about, take a look at the graphics module >of AppleWorks GS. It's both a paint program and a draw program. At the >same time, not in separate layers, not with bitmap "objects". The integration >isn't seamless, but it closer than any program on the Mac. It's also a >first attempt at a program of its kind. I have Canvas 2.0. It does paint & draw. It does bitmap objects. It is seemless in that any tool that could possibly be used for both a draw object and a paint object can be used for either. Objects can be converted. Bitmaps can be of various resolutions, even in the same document. Canvas gives the user plenty of control over everything. I don't see how you'd do that without "bitmap objects". I'd have to look at it. Canvas has layers, but unlike SuperPaint 1.x (i haven't played with the new one enough), the layers are just layers - a real handy extension. One layer can be grayed while you trace over it in another layer, etc. Canvas has infinite options, infinite capability. It doesn't take long to do simple things. It takes awhile (and you may want to get hints from the manuals) to do more complex things. If i thought a paint/draw program should be able to do something, Canvas has been able to do it. Canvas is big, and having at least 2 MB of RAM in your box helps alot. Canvas, uSoft Word, Hypercard, and other big programs are not for everyone. It seems that there should be a market for tiny programs, such as the original MacPaint, especially if they can be sold for real cheap. There are probably people out there who would buy MacPaint for $15, (or even a small color version, such as a Kiddie Color Paint that didn't require the user to set the screen to 4 bit color...), who don't need or want the $300 SwissArmy version. Stephen.
shap@polya.Stanford.EDU (Jonathan S. Shapiro) (04/26/89)
I just got off the phone with Claris. The MacPaint merge rumor is untrue. Claris says that in the long term they plan to add some bitmap features to MacDraw, but there are no plans to withdraw MacPaint. Jon
shani@TAURUS.BITNET (05/01/89)
In article <23492@agate.BERKELEY.EDU>, 128a-3db@e260-3b.berkeley.edu (Jonathan D > BAD NEWS: Swiss-Army-Knife software that tries to be all things to all peopl > is often hard to use and confusing for the beginner. > -Jonathan Dubman That's true, of course, but putting draw and paint in one application is not such a bad idea. Take SuperPaint for instance... I guess that's what gave apple the idea :-) O.S.
channellr@yvax.byu.edu (05/03/89)
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