vogelei@nmtsun.nmt.edu (Todd Vogelei) (06/02/89)
I know this was hashed and rehashed just a short time ago but I never thought I'd need it. I'm face with a situation where I need a keyboard and monitor in two places, one over my music studio stuff, one at my desk right in the studio. One I need to 'fly' on articulated arms for work when standing over things, one at a desk. I thought of two macs but cost is too much. What I really need is 1 mac in two places at once. So, anyway, I don't want to buy a monitor card, just neeed to split the video for identical screens. I would like any advice on low cost monitors that I can do this with, I have an apple standard RGB with apple card in my mac II. I also would like to know if I am likely to experience problems having two extended keyboards and two kensington turbo mice plugged into the ADB at one time. I would only use one set at a time. Info on practical limits for cable lengths would be good too. Please E-mail as I doubt this is of general interest to the net at large. Todd vogelei@nmtsun
aland@infmx.UUCP (Dr. Scump) (12/29/89)
dorourke@polyslo.CalPoly.EDU (David M. O'Rourke) writes: >[and I've tried so hard to stay out of this... :-) ] > > You've obviously not ever used a system that allowed you to use two screens >effectivly. It's very nice to debug on one screen and run your code on the >other, just as much as simply having the extra screen real-estate. >... > You could've very easily picked some of the expanssion options that are >truely debatable for usefullness, but saying the ability to configure a >multi-screen system is not a USEFUL system just shows how closed minded and >un-imformed you really are. Uh, Dave, how much have you used PCs? As stated earlier, I have been running two monitors in my AT at home for quite a while, and I use them both for dual-screen debugging also. What makes you think the PC world is incapable of such magic? Tough to configure, too. Open the machine, add the mono card, screw it in, close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, no fuss. To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To switch back to EGA, run "mode co80". To enable the secondary monitor in the Informix-4GL debugger (for example), run "appl dev" (application device enable). Gee, that didn't hurt a bit. >David M. O'Rourke >Graduating in March of 1990, with a BS in Computer Science & need a Job. In a Mac-only shop, I suppose... -- Alan S. Denney @ Informix Software, Inc. "We're homeward bound {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland ('tis a damn fine sound!) -------------------------------------------- with a good ship, taut & free Disclaimer: These opinions are mine alone. We don't give a damn, If I am caught or killed, the secretary when we drink our rum will disavow any knowledge of my actions. with the girls of old Maui."
hodas@eniac.seas.upenn.edu (Josh Hodas) (12/31/89)
In article <2938@infmx.UUCP> aland@infmx.UUCP (alan denney) writes: >dorourke@polyslo.CalPoly.EDU (David M. O'Rourke) writes: >>[and I've tried so hard to stay out of this... :-) ] >> >> You've obviously not ever used a system that allowed you to use two screens >>effectivly. It's very nice to debug on one screen and run your code on the >>other, just as much as simply having the extra screen real-estate. >>... >> You could've very easily picked some of the expanssion options that are >>truely debatable for usefullness, but saying the ability to configure a >>multi-screen system is not a USEFUL system just shows how closed minded and >>un-imformed you really are. > >Uh, Dave, how much have you used PCs? As stated earlier, I have been running >two monitors in my AT at home for quite a while, and I use them both for >dual-screen debugging also. What makes you think the PC world is incapable >of such magic? > >Tough to configure, too. Open the machine, add the mono card, screw it in, >close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, no fuss. >To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To switch back to >EGA, run "mode co80". To enable the secondary monitor in the Informix-4GL >debugger (for example), run "appl dev" (application device enable). >Gee, that didn't hurt a bit. > >>David M. O'Rourke >>Graduating in March of 1990, with a BS in Computer Science & need a Job. > >In a Mac-only shop, I suppose... > >-- > Alan S. Denney @ Informix Software, Inc. "We're homeward bound > {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland ('tis a damn fine sound!) > -------------------------------------------- with a good ship, taut & free > Disclaimer: These opinions are mine alone. We don't give a damn, > If I am caught or killed, the secretary when we drink our rum > will disavow any knowledge of my actions. with the girls of old Maui." God forgive me.. I swore I was going to stay out of this argument. I thought I had resisted it long enough, as the volume was down to a trickle. But this note just P-sses me off. (It's not the first one, its just the straw that broke the camel's back. Alan, you clearly have no idea what this conversation is about. Yes, it is certainly true you can run your debugger on two screens. I wont deny that, I do it all the time when I do PC development. But the point is that this debugger had to be specifically designed for that use, and it is one of a very few applications that knows how to do it on the PC. On the mac any application can run on anny monitor (caveat, a very few poorly written programs may map their window to a particular location, this is a serious flaw in those programs). This helps, not just with individual programs that use lots of windows, (for instance when I am TeXing I keep my preview window open on my Portrait display while I type on my 13" color screen) but also when using several programs together. I might bring up MacWrite II on the main screen (portrait) then bring up MacDraw to do a diagram. It opens onto the main screen, but I just drag it over to the small screen, so I can see both programs at once. Again the poin is not that a very few programs on the PC can use this capability. THe point is that you have no idea how useful a general feature it is until you have used a well designed system that lets you use it at will. Josh ------------------------- Josh Hodas (hodas@eniac.seas.upenn.edu) 4223 Pine Street Philadelphia, PA 19104 (215) 222-7112 (home) (215) 898-5423 (school office)
mgodwin@rpp386.cactus.org (Mike Godwin) (12/31/89)
I don't think anyone is disputing that PCs can run multiple monitors. I know from my own experience that a multiple-monitor configuration is really the better choice for using PC-AutoCad. But the Macintosh enthusiasts here were not talking about multiple- monitor capability, but, rather, VIRTUAL monitor capability. That is, they were talking about having all the monitors connected AND acting like a single monitor. For example, one can, under such a system, click-and-drag a graphic object from one screen to the other, without touching the keyboard, and without doing anything to tell your system that you're going to be working on B monitor rather than A monitor right now. From my own experience, with both PCs and Macs, desktop publishing is one application for which Mac's virtual-monitor capability provides a clear advantage. (I was about to say "a clear and indisputable" advantage, but then I realized who I was talking to.) -- Mike Godwin UT Law School | "... and first I put my arms around him yes mgodwin@rpp386.cactus.org | and drew him down to me so he could feel my (512) 346-4190 | breasts all perfume yes and his heart was cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!mgodwin | going like mad and yes I said yes I will Yes."
folta@tove.umd.edu (Wayne Folta) (12/31/89)
[Referring to two monitors on an IBM AT:] >Tough to configure, too. Open the machine, add the mono card, screw it in, >close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, no fuss. >To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To switch back to >EGA, run "mode co80". To enable the secondary monitor in the Informix-4GL >debugger (for example), run "appl dev" (application device enable). >Gee, that didn't hurt a bit. I don't think it is so easy to do this in general. Your Mono/color system is pretty easy. What about a multi-color system? How would you change monitors then (co80a, co80b?)? And when you do change monitors, you have to give a special command. On a Mac, you simply move the cursor to the screen you want (you define the geometry: how the two monitors logically abut). I am speaking from gross IBM ignorance--I have no substantial IBM experience, I mainly watch IBM-using friends. But, I have just watched a friend attempt to get an internal modem to work with his other cards... How he wasted hours with DIP switches and jumpers. Are monitors that much easier? I owned an original PC, and I know they were designed for a co80/mono system, but I wonder what magic you would have to do to get an arbitrary combination, and how easy it would be to switch. (CONFIG.SYS time?) A desktop publishing magazine I read did a test to prove a point: they got a dozen Mac monitors and randomly chose combinations of five monitors, put their boards in a Mac II, and booted the thing. They all worked. Of course, no one would use five monitors, but the point was that NuBus cards are self-configuring and are compatible. You don't change jumpers, worry about interrupt levels, edit system configuration files... IBM has moved in this direction with its MCA, I believe. -- Wayne Folta (folta@cs.umd.edu 128.8.128.8)
tdrinkar@cosmos.acs.calpoly.edu (Terrell Drinkard) (12/31/89)
In article <2938@infmx.UUCP> aland@infmx.UUCP (alan denney) writes: >Tough to configure, too. Open the machine, add the mono card, screw it >in, close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, If what you say it true, no switches to set, no jumpers to configure, no lines to add to the config.sys file, nothing added to the autoexec.bat file, no interrupt conflict problems, then this is a first for the PC world. Glad you've caught up with the rest of us. >no fuss. To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To >switch back to EGA, run "mode co80". To enable the secondary monitor >in the Informix-4GL debugger (for example), run "appl dev" (application >device enable). Gee, that didn't hurt a bit. I won't even go into how that looks to a Mac driver! :-) > Alan S. Denney @ Informix Software, Inc. "We're homeward bound > {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland ('tis a damn fine sound!) Terry Disclaimer et la Signaturo: Hell no, I'm not responsible for what I say! If everyone were responsible for what they said, we'd have had a balanced budget in 1984.
bcw@rti.UUCP (Bruce Wright) (12/31/89)
In article <21548@mimsy.umd.edu>, folta@tove.umd.edu (Wayne Folta) writes: > I don't think it is so easy to do this in general. Your Mono/color system > is pretty easy. What about a multi-color system? How would you change > monitors then (co80a, co80b?)? And when you do change monitors, you have to > give a special command. On a Mac, you simply move the cursor to the screen > you want (you define the geometry: how the two monitors logically abut). You're right -- it isn't so easy to do this in general. For most video adapter combinations (that's probably more accurate than "monitors" in this context), the only thing that works is one of {CGA | EGA | VGA} combined with one of {MDA | Hercules}. That is, you can't mix CGA and EGA (unless maybe you run the EGA in monochrome-text-only mode and don't use it for color or graphics ... I haven't tried this combination because it's sort of perverse, so I don't know if it would work, but I see no obvious reason why it wouldn't; in any event you could only use one EGA in this mode -- and no MDA's -- before the available addresses would be used up). So the limit on a PC with "stock" video cards is 2 cards. That's for standard adapters. On another discussion thread I mentioned that I had seen a special adapter that would allow multiple EGA or VGA adapters on a single machine. The adapters definitely know about each other -- they have a special "bank switching" technique which makes one or another of them "go away" from the point of view of the PC software. I saw this used to make a multiuser PC with an EGA or VGA for each user (rather than running users off the serial ports). It's rather expensive (I seem to remember something over $1000 for each adapter), but it might be cheaper than multiple PC's if you're running high-end machines. But this technique doesn't work in general -- you can't use it with just any video adapter you find. Bruce C. Wright
rewing@Apple.COM (Richard Ewing) (12/31/89)
In article <2938@infmx.UUCP> aland@infmx.UUCP (alan denney) writes: >dorourke@polyslo.CalPoly.EDU (David M. O'Rourke) writes: >>[and I've tried so hard to stay out of this... :-) ] >> >> You've obviously not ever used a system that allowed you to use two screens >>effectivly. It's very nice to debug on one screen and run your code on the >>other, just as much as simply having the extra screen real-estate. >>... >> You could've very easily picked some of the expanssion options that are >>truely debatable for usefullness, but saying the ability to configure a >>multi-screen system is not a USEFUL system just shows how closed minded and >>un-imformed you really are. > >Uh, Dave, how much have you used PCs? As stated earlier, I have been running >two monitors in my AT at home for quite a while, and I use them both for >dual-screen debugging also. What makes you think the PC world is incapable >of such magic? > >Tough to configure, too. Open the machine, add the mono card, screw it in, >close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, no fuss. >To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To switch back to >EGA, run "mode co80". To enable the secondary monitor in the Informix-4GL >debugger (for example), run "appl dev" (application device enable). >Gee, that didn't hurt a bit. > >>David M. O'Rourke >>Graduating in March of 1990, with a BS in Computer Science & need a Job. > >In a Mac-only shop, I suppose... > >-- > Alan S. Denney @ Informix Software, Inc. "We're homeward bound > {pyramid|uunet}!infmx!aland ('tis a damn fine sound!) > -------------------------------------------- with a good ship, taut & free > Disclaimer: These opinions are mine alone. We don't give a damn, > If I am caught or killed, the secretary when we drink our rum > will disavow any knowledge of my actions. with the girls of old Maui." I think you're missing the point here. No one said that a PC is incapable of running two or more monitors; I've seen it done. However, I think the point is that in a Mac multiple monitor scenario, you can use it for far many different purposes in *any* application. Essentially, the two (or more) monitors combine together to produce one *big* virtual space in which windows can be dragged to and fro, or even overlap from one screen to another (or more) without any complaints or special configuration from the application. Most PC setups in which I have seen multiple moniTors involve weird or custom situations in which the application must know how to deal with both screens. I mean, having the debugging window over on another screen is nice, but not everybody deals with Codeview all his life to use this luxury. On the Mac, it doesn't matter what you run, or how you run it, or whether one monitor is color, and the other monichrome. "Mode mono"??? "Mode co80"? "app dev"?!??? What the hell is that? And why should I have to know that? EXERCISE: Get a copy of Wingz (easy for those of you at Informix). Get a Mac with two monitors. Open a mondo-big Wingz spreadsheet on the Mac. Drag the window to cover both monitors. Continue working. -- __________________________________________________________________________ |Disclaimer: I run 125 INITs. Nothing I say can be seriously considered. | | | |Internet: REWING@APPLE.COM-----------------------Rick Ewing | |ApplelinkPE & MacNet Soon!------------------Apple Computer, Inc. | |Applelink: EWING--------------------100 Ashford Center North, Suite 100 | |Compu$erve: [76474,1732]--------------------Atlanta, GA 30338 | |GENIE: R.EWING1--------------------------TalkNet: (404) 393-9358 | |USENET: {amdahl,decwrl,sun,unisoft}!apple!rewing | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
ron@woan.austin.ibm.com (Ronald S. Woan) (01/03/90)
I'd like to clear this up once and for all with a summary of what has been said on this subject: 1. Original (pro-MAC) poster notes that MACII supports multiple monitors as one contiguous (i.e. same picture spans multiple monitors) video space. He is right. We can't do this in the MSDOS world (at least I've never seen it done for general software, of course you can always doctor your own software to do this). In the MSDOS arena we can only have dissimilar multi-monitors (i.e. color and mono displays) hooked simultaneously without special drivers and exotic hardware. That's all you need for multi-screen debugging; I love debugging graphics programs from my monochrome monitor. I am willing to concede that this is a neat feature of the Mac II? that is difficult to duplicate even with UNIX (AIX or Interactive are the ones I am familiar with) and X-Windows. However, how many people really need an application to span multiple monitors? Its aweful difficult to visualize a picture crossing monitor boundaries though it make for a neat effect at dance clubs. Just go out and get a bigger one. If you just want a pseudo-contiguous workspace across monitors (mouse moves off one monitor to the next at the edges), which is a far more normal task, this is easily done with any of the X-Window implementations by running multiple servers and having a client that effects the switch when the mouse cursor reaches the proper edge. Anyway, PC-Clones make a marvelously cost-effective UNIX box for less than the price of a base MAC II system configuration. Previous posting have confirmed that $3500 will get you a decent 25MHz base UNIX configuration. Actually, even a real IBM machine could make sense for those in the University setting. Last time I looked, IBM was offering ~40% University discount to students (at Berkeley when I was there last year) on '386 hardware and tossing in full AIX/PS2 (TCP/IP, NFS, X-Windows, etc..) for only an additional $250 (discount of something like $2000). I believe that they would even pre-install the software like Sun. On the OS2 front, there was some talk on making OS2 POSIX compliant next year which is not possible with MultiFinder 7.0 because it does not support pre-emptive context switching. Check it out in Byte. Ron +-----All Views Expressed Are My Own And Are Not Necessarily Shared By------+ +------------------------------My Employer----------------------------------+ + Ronald S. Woan (IBM VNET)WOAN AT AUSTIN, (AUSTIN)ron@woan.austin.ibm.com + + outside of IBM @cs.utexas.edu:ibmchs!auschs!woan.austin.ibm.com!ron +
daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) (01/03/90)
in article <17514@rpp386.cactus.org>, mgodwin@rpp386.cactus.org (Mike Godwin) says: > Keywords: Multiple monitors, virtual monitors > Xref: cbmvax comp.sys.ibm.pc:45442 comp.sys.mac:48678 > But the Macintosh enthusiasts here were not talking about multiple- > monitor capability, but, rather, VIRTUAL monitor capability. That > is, they were talking about having all the monitors connected AND > acting like a single monitor. That's certainly a cool feature of the Mac OS. But do they actually call it a "Virtual Monitor" facility? That doesn't sound like what it really does for you. The Amiga's Intuition interface has a feature that's more like what I'd think of as virtual monitors -- it can support any number of separate monitor displays on a single monitor, via kind of a superwindow called a Screen. Any number of windows live on each screen; screens don't overlap each other, windows do. This is really useful for avoiding excessive numbers of windows on the single screen most WIMP interfaces provide (even if that single screen can spread across multiple physical monitors). Does the Mac OS allow anything like this under Multifinder? It probably should. > Mike Godwin UT Law School | "... and first I put my arms around him yes -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
mgodwin@rpp386.cactus.org (Mike Godwin) (01/03/90)
In article <9191@cbmvax.commodore.com> daveh@cbmvax.commodore.com (Dave Haynie) writes: >> But the Macintosh enthusiasts here were not talking about multiple- >> monitor capability, but, rather, VIRTUAL monitor capability. That >> is, they were talking about having all the monitors connected AND >> acting like a single monitor. > >That's certainly a cool feature of the Mac OS. But do they actually call >it a "Virtual Monitor" facility? That doesn't sound like what it really >does for you. The Amiga's Intuition interface has a feature that's more >like what I'd think of as virtual monitors -- it can support any number of >separate monitor displays on a single monitor, via kind of a superwindow >called a Screen. Any number of windows live on each screen; screens don't >overlap each other, windows do. Heh. Sorry if I've treaded on someone else's nomenclature. I don't know just where I got the phrase "virtual monitor" in reference to this Mac feature, but I don't think I just made it up. --Mike -- Mike Godwin UT Law School | "... and first I put my arms around him yes mgodwin@rpp386.cactus.org | and drew him down to me so he could feel my (512) 346-4190 | breasts all perfume yes and his heart was cs.utexas.edu!rpp386!mgodwin | going like mad and yes I said yes I will Yes."
jml@tw-rnd.SanDiego.NCR.COM (Michael Lodman) (01/04/90)
In article <2938@infmx.UUCP> aland@infmx.UUCP (alan denney) writes: >Uh, Dave, how much have you used PCs? As stated earlier, I have been running >two monitors in my AT at home for quite a while, and I use them both for >dual-screen debugging also. What makes you think the PC world is incapable >of such magic? >close the machine, turn on the power. No switches to set, no muss, no fuss. >To switch primary monitor to the mono, run "mode mono". To switch back to This is sort of an accident of addressing spaces in the PC. The mono cards use a different base I/O address than do the color cards. I'm not sure if this was an accident of design, or a wanted feature. However, it does explain why only mono & (cga|ega|vga) will work. The BIOS will write to only one of the I/O spaces depending on the video mode set. Some programs bypassing the BIOS may use both monitors, but, it does not seem very useful as very few programs take advantage of it. The MAC's ability to use multiple monitors in a powerful way is one of the few enviable features of that system. -- +-----------------------------------------------------------+ | Michael Lodman Mike.Lodman@SanDiego.NCR.COM | | NCR Corporation - Distributed Systems Lab - San Diego | | 9900 Old Grove Rd. San Diego, CA. 92131 (619) 693-5353 | +-----------------------------------------------------------+
lsr@Apple.COM (Larry Rosenstein) (01/04/90)
In article <1232@awdprime.UUCP> ron@woan.austin.ibm.com (Ronald S. Woan) writes: > the ones I am familiar with) and X-Windows. However, how many people > really need an application to span multiple monitors? Its aweful > difficult to visualize a picture crossing monitor boundaries though it > make for a neat effect at dance clubs. Just go out and get a bigger > one. In a lot of cases, 2 small monitors will cost less than one large one, especially if you have to junk an existing monitor. Or, if you have an extra monitor lying around, then on a Mac II all you need is the video card to drive it. Being able to position 2 monitors side by side and drag windows from one to another is very handy. You can have one monitor in black and white and another in color, for example. Also, there are applications in which a little extra screen width is helpful (for those extra long comments) and it is nice to be able to use both monitors for one window. Larry Rosenstein, Apple Computer, Inc. Object Specialist Internet: lsr@Apple.com UUCP: {nsc, sun}!apple!lsr AppleLink: Rosenstein1
drc@claris.com (Dennis Cohen) (01/04/90)
lsr@Apple.COM (Larry Rosenstein) writes: >In article <1232@awdprime.UUCP> ron@woan.austin.ibm.com (Ronald S. Woan) >writes: >> the ones I am familiar with) and X-Windows. However, how many people >> really need an application to span multiple monitors? Its aweful >> difficult to visualize a picture crossing monitor boundaries though it >> make for a neat effect at dance clubs. Just go out and get a bigger >> one. >In a lot of cases, 2 small monitors will cost less than one large one, >especially if you have to junk an existing monitor. Or, if you have an >extra monitor lying around, then on a Mac II all you need is the video >card to drive it. >Being able to position 2 monitors side by side and drag windows from one >to another is very handy. You can have one monitor in black and white and >another in color, for example. Also, there are applications in which a >little extra screen width is helpful (for those extra long comments) and >it is nice to be able to use both monitors for one window. Larry left out one of the best features of multiple monitors, if you're a programmer. You can designate one of them as the MacsBug screen (hold down the option key in the Monitors cdev) and MacsBug or Jasik's "The Debugger" will use that screen as the debugger screen -- this means that you can have an inexpensive (relatively) monitor set up for debugging without hiding the running app which you are trying to debug. The Debugger really takes advantage of the feature, giving you the choice of "Split Screens", in which case the debugger is always visible on the second monitor; or "Save Screen" in which case it pops up only when you enter the debugger (this is the way MacsBug works with it). I tried a large monitor and I've tried two "normal" sized monitors, and I'll take the two-monitor setup, for my purposes, every time. If I were doing page layout work, schematic design, or some other similar application, I would probably opt for the big monitor (except price-wise). Dennis Cohen Claris Corp. **************************************************** Disclaimer: Any opinions expressed above are _MINE_! ****************************************************
ron@woan.austin.ibm.com (Ronald S. Woan) (01/05/90)
In article <10784@claris.com>, drc@claris.com (Dennis Cohen) writes: |>Larry left out one of the best features of multiple monitors, if |>you're a programmer. You can designate one of them as the MacsBug |>screen (hold down the option key in the Monitors cdev) and MacsBug |>or Jasik's "The Debugger" will use that screen as the debugger |>screen -- this means that you can have an inexpensive (relatively) |>monitor set up for debugging without hiding the running app which |>you are trying to debug. I think that he left this out because in my original posting and in many followups it has been mentioned that we have done this in the PC world since before the MAC was born using a color and monochrome monitor setup on any stock IBM PC/clone. Many PC/MSDOS debuggers support this setup. Best yet take a cheap PC Clone, tie it to the async port and debug with Turbo Debugger remotely. Saves on crash recovery and error pinpointing if the application causes some nasty processor halt or memory mixup. |>I tried a large monitor and I've tried two "normal" sized monitors, |>and I'll take the two-monitor setup, for my purposes, every time. |>If I were doing page layout work, schematic design, or some other |>similar application, I would probably opt for the big monitor |>(except price-wise). Which relates to my original point that a window spanning multiple monitors is seldom used for any real purpose. Dragging from one monitor to another and having the mouse cursor zip from one monitor to the other is far more used. +-----All Views Expressed Are My Own And Are Not Necessarily Shared By------+ +------------------------------My Employer----------------------------------+ + Ronald S. Woan (IBM VNET)WOAN AT AUSTIN, (AUSTIN)ron@woan.austin.ibm.com + + outside of IBM @cs.utexas.edu:ibmchs!auschs!woan.austin.ibm.com!ron +
lsr@Apple.COM (Larry Rosenstein) (01/05/90)
In article <1258@awdprime.UUCP> ron@woan.austin.ibm.com (Ronald S. Woan) writes: > Which relates to my original point that a window spanning multiple > monitors is seldom used for any real purpose. Dragging from one > monitor to another and having the mouse cursor zip from one monitor to > the other is far more used. It may be seldom used, but there are cases where you need that extra inch of screen width and it's nice to be able to do it. Also, I would argue that this is the most natural use of multiple monitors from the user's point of view. Larry Rosenstein, Apple Computer, Inc. Object Specialist Internet: lsr@Apple.com UUCP: {nsc, sun}!apple!lsr AppleLink: Rosenstein1
gillies@p.cs.uiuc.edu (01/06/90)
In article rewing@Apple.COM writes: > Essentially, the two (or more) monitors combine together to produce > one *big* virtual space in which windows can be dragged to and fro, or > even overlap from one screen to another (or more) without any > complaints or special configuration from the application. > Most PC setups in which I have seen multiple moniTors involve weird > or custom situations in which the application must know how to deal > with both screens. You must be joking. Have you ever programmed the Mac for multiple monitors? It's no cakewalk. I am just beginning to write code for multiple monitors, and it seems to be the same old stupid story: 1. Check if you have multiple monitors. 2. If so, then invoke all sorts of special-case software to deal with them (like the size a window may zoom, and the way you paint the desktop). Furthermore, the mac provides no way to "simulate" multiple monitors on a single monitor, so it's just one more way to make your code undebuggable for the entire macintosh line. In a more general sense, Apple has found that by twiddling the software in each Macintosh model, software companies must buy one of each for testing. This must be wonderful for sales, and for keeping small-scale developers from entering the Mac-Software market. Don Gillies, Dept. of Computer Science, University of Illinois 1304 W. Springfield, Urbana, Ill 61801 ARPA: gillies@cs.uiuc.edu UUCP: {uunet,harvard}!uiucdcs!gillies
gillies@p.cs.uiuc.edu (01/11/90)
> Depends... what you should do is come up on the main monitor the first > time, then remember where you are moved to. Unfortunately the mac allows you to drag screens around in relation to one another, through the control panel. Then the "remembered" window would end up off-screen.
pepke@loligo (Eric Pepke) (01/11/90)
In article <126900143@p.cs.uiuc.edu> gillies@p.cs.uiuc.edu writes: >> Depends... what you should do is come up on the main monitor the first >> time, then remember where you are moved to. > >Unfortunately the mac allows you to drag screens around in relation to >one another, through the control panel. Then the "remembered" window >would end up off-screen. When this happens, you put the window in the same place you would put a new window, i.e. upper left corner of the screen with the menu bar, staggered. Eric Pepke INTERNET: pepke@gw.scri.fsu.edu Supercomputer Computations Research Institute MFENET: pepke@fsu Florida State University SPAN: scri::pepke Tallahassee, FL 32306-4052 BITNET: pepke@fsu Disclaimer: My employers seldom even LISTEN to my opinions. Meta-disclaimer: Any society that needs disclaimers has too many lawyers.