merchant@dartvax.UUCP (02/27/87)
Chatted with our local Apple person in New York and he gave me some interesting information on Apples prices. First off, the prices for the 512K Enhanced and the Plus are staying the same. Personally, I find this to be a major league disappointment. But I'll muddle. The price for the Macintosh SE, retail, will be $2769.00. This is the machine with two floppy drives. The Macintosh SE with a built-in hard drive is $3500ish. No mention was made of an upgrade price from a Plus/512KE/512K. The price for the Macintosh II (with two floppy drives) is $3769.00. Of course, just like IBM land, you have to buy the monitor which will run anywhere from $500 to $1000. By the way, the base price for the Macintosh II with a hard drive is $5369. Maybe it's just me, but I think Apple might end up pricing themselves out of sight. Maybe I'll pick up some Commodore stock. (Saw the specs on the Amiga 2000 -- IBM compatible with a card, accepts IBM cards, pretty graphics, and $1500ish) -- "How does it feel Peter Merchant to be without a home?"
earleh@dartvax.UUCP (02/28/87)
In article <5751@dartvax.UUCP>, merchant@dartvax.UUCP (Peter Merchant) writes: > Chatted with our local Apple person in New York and he gave me some interesting > information on Apples prices. > > > Maybe it's just me, but I think Apple might end up pricing themselves out of > sight. Maybe I'll pick up some Commodore stock. (Saw the specs on the Amiga > 2000 -- IBM compatible with a card, accepts IBM cards, pretty graphics, and > $1500ish) > -- > "How does it feel Peter Merchant > to be without a home?" Maybe Apple will price themselves right out of sight, I don't care. I have my 512 KE, I can draw pictures with it, I can talk to real computers with it, and, unlike some people I know, I am aware that it is not a Sun. (I don't mean you, Peter.) Who knows how long it will last before I have to send it off to the computer junkyard? This reminds me of the situation with Volvo. Before I got my '67 Dodge, I had a '64 Volvo. Real sweet, lots of power, classy looks. The thing had cost $600 new, I believe. I finally sold it to some hippies for $500 in '80 or '81, I forget which. In 1987, a new Volvo probably cost 20 or 30 times what that thing cost new. Dodge tells the same story: my Dodge van probably cost $2000 new, if that, and what do they cost now? (I wouldn't even consider purchasing a new Chrysler product, they look funny.) Can Apple equal this performance? You betcha. Will I be able or willing to buy Apple products in the 90's? Not unless they put in a system error handler and cursor keys that work when the shift key is held down. Color and two disk drives and an enormous monitor is nice, but will the thing have any real improvements? Probably not, but my Mac will most likely still be running as long as I need it, and I can put up with the way it is now. By the way, I have seen some blurbs on the new Macs, but I have not seen these points addressed: a) Does the thing have any responsive system error handler? -> Is an attempted divide by zero an occasion for reboot? (Imagine if Seymour Cray did this...) b) Do the cursor keys become arithmetic operators when the shift key is held down? Inside Macintosh: "The left-arrow key will produce a plus sign whenever the shift key is held down, in order to confuse the user, and there is not anything the programmer can do about it. This is a good example of integrated architecture." c) Does it have multi-tasking, or not? (I don't care, I use it as a terminal emulator 90% of the time anyway. I just thought I would throw that in.) If regular people cannot afford the new Macs, that is no cause for alarm if you already own one. Most of the people here have new Volvos, and I get to work every day in my '67 Dodge. Most of the people here have "plus"s, and my 512 gets the job done. Now you're probably thinking "Boy, this sucker is really against progress, I bet he brushes his teeth with a twig and dresses his kids in animal skins." Well, that's my business if I do, but I'm just trying to point out that a useful possession can retain its usefulness even though there are newer, flashier models on the showroom floor. Buy the Amiga, decide that Apple is not worth it, and sell your 512, plus, or 128. Maybe someone who recognizes real value will buy it... Enjoy the spring, it may be your last!
bytebug@fritz.UUCP (03/04/87)
In article <5751@dartvax.UUCP> merchant@dartvax.UUCP (Peter Merchant) writes: >Chatted with our local Apple person in New York and he gave me some interesting >information on Apples prices. The following information comes from talking with a friend who attended Apple's Dealer briefing yesterday. >First off, the prices for the 512K Enhanced and the Plus are staying the same. >Personally, I find this to be a major league disappointment. But I'll muddle. Considering that the new machines will take awhile to get into full production, I don't find this hard to believe. If it were up to me, I'd probably wait until late summer to drop the prices, and in fact, as soon as Mac SE production is in full swing, would probably drop the 512KE and let the Mac Plus be the low-end entry. >The price for the Macintosh SE, retail, will be $2769.00. This is the machine >with two floppy drives. The Macintosh SE with a built-in hard drive is >$3500ish. No mention was made of an upgrade price from a Plus/512KE/512K. The Mac SE will come in two configurations: the base SE with mouse and 2 800K floppy drives will indeed be $2769, and the SE with mouse, 800K floppy and 20MB internal winchester is $3569. Memory for both units is 1MB, expandable to 4MB. Surprising to me is the fact that a keyboard is now an accessory; the low end keyboard which is supposed to resemble the ][GS keyboard is $129 and a extended keyboard which resembles the IBM-RT keyboard is $229. I doubt that upgrade from a low-end Mac is possible, and given Apple's past performance in this area, I wouldn't hold my breath. Also of note is the fact that the Mac SE has about a 20% performance boost over a Mac Plus. There's also an "Accessory Access Port" so modifications to the Mac case won't be needed to get cables from inside the Mac to the outside world. The Mac SE should be available to all dealers to order now. >The price for the Macintosh II (with two floppy drives) is $3769.00. Of >course, just like IBM land, you have to buy the monitor which will run anywhere >from $500 to $1000. By the way, the base price for the Macintosh II with a >hard drive is $5369. The base configuration for the Mac II will be CPU, mouse, and 800K floppy, is priced at $3769. Again, you'll need a keyboard, priced as above. The video card is $499. A monochrome display is $399, while a 12" high-res RGB display is $999. The hard disk configuration of CPU, mouse, 800K floppy and 40MB internal SCSI drive is $5369. Memory for both units is 1MB, expandable to 8MB. A 68881 floating point processor is standard, and there's a socket for a 68851 memory management unit. There's a 6-slot NuBus for expansion. Given the memory management unit, it's not surprising that Unix will be available for the Mac II. And then there's the display. 640 by 480 resolution, with 1, 4 or 8 bits per pixel, to select from 16 million different colors (8 bits per primary color). I guess that the images that they displayed were pretty fantastic, because my friend hadn't stopped drooling as of last evening. The Mac II will only be available at selected dealers capable of the higher level of support needed for this sophisticated machine. Apple will be spending March renegotiating contracts with their dealers, and the first machines aren't expected to ship until late April. The machines shipped then will probably only be demo machines (one per ownership group), with full production not expected until late summer. Apple plans to offer 20MB (at $999), 40MB (at $1599), and 80MB (at $2699) internal SCSI drives. You should be able to add your own 5 1/4 SCSI drive. External drives of 20MB (at $1299), 40MB (at $1999), and 80MB (at $3199) were also announced. A SCSI tape drive for backups was also announced. And for those who can't live without one, a 5 1/4 360K floppy drive is now available (at $129 for SE and $399 for Mac II). >Maybe it's just me, but I think Apple might end up pricing themselves out of >sight. Maybe I'll pick up some Commodore stock. (Saw the specs on the Amiga >2000 -- IBM compatible with a card, accepts IBM cards, pretty graphics, and >$1500ish) These machines are aimed at corporate America, and as such, the prices don't seem much different the the machines that are already being sold for business. -- Roger L. Long FileNet Corp {hplabs,trwrb}!felix!bytebug
jww@sdcsvax.UUCP (03/04/87)
The current macs are definitely *****NOT***** upgradeable. Several
interviews with people (like Glassee) made this clear. Something
about too many tradeoffs.
Most developers say 'why would you bother?' for the Plus->SE. As
for the II, you can buy a prodigy. It would be nearly impossible
to take a Plus and add 6 huge slots to it, and I'm sure to take
advantage of the II design, you need those slots.
Or, to be tactless, your Plus is only worth $1500 on the open market.
Its salvage value is negligible compared to the $5,400 price of a
II with keyboard, display card, color monitor and 1 floppy.
One good thing to be said for Steve Jobs: the no-slot, everything
built-in, tiny monochrome display Mac is certainly cheaper than
any Open Mac will be.
--
Joel West
{ucbvax,ihnp4}!sdcsvax!jww (ihnp4!gould9!joel once I fix news)
jww@sdcsvax.ucsd.edu if you mustshap@sfsup.UUCP (03/09/87)
In article <3739@fritz.UUCP>, bytebug@fritz.UUCP writes: > > Surprising to me is the fact that a keyboard is now an accessory; the low end > keyboard which is supposed to resemble the ][GS keyboard is $129 and a > extended keyboard which resembles the IBM-RT keyboard is $229. I doubt that > upgrade from a low-end Mac is possible, and given Apple's past performance Neither the keyboard or the mouse will be compatible, according to the Apple propaganda. Each now runs on a new bus (the mouse tracks the cursor much better). Essentially your old mac is a throwaway.
gwangung@milton.acs.washington.edu (Roger Tang) (02/24/90)
Anybody have a list of the new prices on the Macs and Laserwriters they cut prices on? I assume that's why the educational discount prices were cut earlier this month, but I haven't seen a good list of what the new prices are....
gbrown@tybalt.caltech.edu (Glenn C. Brown) (02/24/90)
gwangung@milton.acs.washington.edu (Roger Tang) writes: > Anybody have a list of the new prices on the Macs and Laserwriters >they cut prices on? No, But KTWV's news this morning said that Apple announced a 17% price cut on their most popular CPU's. --Glenn
mithomas@bsu-cs.bsu.edu (Michael Thomas Niehaus) (02/26/90)
Here are the details of Apple's retail price decreases, as hacked from their
official press release.
-Michael
APPLE REDUCES PRICES ON MACINTOSH SE LINE
AND LASERWRITER II PRINTERS
CUPERTINO, California--February 22, 1990--Apple Computer,
Inc. announced today that it will decrease the suggested
retail price in the United States on all models of its
Macintosh SE and SE/30 personal computers and
LaserWriter IINT and IINTX printers.
"We are lowering prices in the U.S. so that we can bring
the Macintosh personal computing experience to more people,"
said David Hancock, senior vice president of marketing,
Apple USA. "These actions further improve the value to
our customers for our mainstream personal computers and
our LaserWriter II family. The pricing changes will allow
us to reach more people in price/performance categories
where customer demand is growing," said Hancock.
[More marketing mumbo-jumbo deleted.]
The new U.S. pricing structure will be effective
immediately. Current and previous suggested retail prices
for the computers and printers are listed below.
Previous New
SRP SRP $F %F
Macintosh SE (dual floppy) $2,869 $2,569 -$300 -10.5
Macintosh SE (1MB/20HD) $3,469 $2,969 -$500 -14.0
Macintosh SE (2MB/40HD) $4,069 $3,369 -$700 -17.0
Macintosh SE/30 (floppy) $4,369 $3,869 -$500 -11.0
Macintosh SE/30 (1MB/40HD) $4,869 $4,369 -$500 -10.0
Macintosh SE/30 (4MB/80HD) $6,569 $5,569 -$1,000 -15.0
LaserWriter IISC $2,799 $2,799 -$0 -0.0
LaserWriter IINT $4,999 $4,499 -$500 -10.0
LaserWriter IINTX $6,999 $5,999 -$1,000 -14.0
--
Michael Niehaus UUCP: <backbones>!{iuvax,pur-ee}!bsu-cs!mithomas
Apple Student Rep ARPA: mithomas@bsu-cs.bsu.edu
Ball State University AppleLink: ST0374 (from UUCP: st0374@applelink.apple.com)blob@apple.com (Brian Bechtel) (02/26/90)
In article <2109@milton.acs.washington.edu> gwangung@milton.acs.washington.edu (Roger Tang) writes: > Anybody have a list of the new prices on the Macs and Laserwriters > they cut prices on? From the press release, available via ftp from apple.com (130.43.2.2): before after $change %change Mac SE (floppy) 2,869 2,569 -300 -10.5 Mac SE (1/20) 3,469 2,969 -500 -14.0 Mac SE (2/40) 4,069 3,369 -700 -17.0 Mac SE/30 (floppy) 4,369 3,869 -500 -11.0 Mac SE/30 (1/40) 4,869 4,369 -500 -10.0 Mac SE/30 (4/80) 6,569 5,569 -1000 -15.0 LW IISC (no change) 2,799 2,799 LW IINT 4,999 4,499 -500 -10.0 LW IINTX 6,999 5,999 -1000 -14.0 --Brian Bechtel blob@apple.com "My opinion, not Apple's"
c9a-ai@dorothy.Berkeley.EDU (Class Account) (02/27/90)
I heard that Apple has just lower the prices on their SE line. Does anyone know what the new educational prices are and when will they be effective? I heard that the new SE dual drives is $300 cheaper. Yan Or c9a-ai@dorothy.Berkeley.EDU c60b-dr@buddy.Berkeley.EDU
dwl@typhoon.Berkeley.EDU (David Lee) (03/04/90)
In article <1990Feb23.203413.14740@spectre.ccsf.caltech.edu> gbrown@tybalt.caltech.edu (Glenn C. Brown) writes: >gwangung@milton.acs.washington.edu (Roger Tang) writes: > >> Anybody have a list of the new prices on the Macs and Laserwriters >>they cut prices on? > >No, But KTWV's news this morning said that Apple announced a 17% price cut >on their most popular CPU's. > >--Glenn From what I've heard, the Apple price cuts went into effect February 1, less than a week after I purchased my SE/30. Does anyone know if Apple offers any kind of retroactive refund to people who bought a computer within a certain time period before the price cuts? Thanks, David dwl@ocf.Berkeley.EDU