thom@dewey.soe.berkeley.edu (Thom Gillespie) (06/15/90)
Since the 'only' person Brendan is responding to is me, I'll respond In article <11064@claris.com> brendan@claris.com (Brendan McCarthy) writes: > >I'm not trying to pick on anyone in particular, but some opinions have been >expressed here that compell me to respond... > >Thom Gillespie (thom@dewey.soe.berkeley.edu) writes: >> 1) It seems like software piracy is here to stay, part of the culture > >This is an invalid argument. One cannot justify immoral behaviour just because >it is widespread in a culture. Try to apply this argument to behaviour like >murder to see how incorrect it is. >It is rationalisation, plain and simple. >Piracy is theft. Too people many people are ignorant of this, ... I am not trying to justify anything and I 'never' used the word 'immoral' -- you did -- I don't consider software piracy moral or immoral, I just consider it as part of our culture, our very western ownership oriented culture which loves to copy all media:music, text, video, software, and anything else which becomes copi-able. Software piracy is 'not' like murder. In a capitalist culture 'piracy is theft', in a communist culture 'ownership is theft'. I think this is from Proudhon, the French Social theorist. Sorry Brendan, nothing is absolute and God is not going keep the "software pirates" out of heaven and you'll solve nothing with this silly "moral" stuff. It will be the people who can think about piracy as advertising and the people who can think about "legalizing piracy". >> 2) Can anyone document a particular company which has gone out of business > because of software piracy as opposed to bad documentation, service, pro > duc etc? I imagine that microsoft, lotus, and claris are at the top of the > pirated companies -- their products are good > >I don't know of any companies that have gone out of business, but I do know >that 20% - 50% (depending on the location) of Claris software being used is >pirated. > Hey, I asked for companies which have gone out of business? And you give me unsupported numbers? Are you doing phone surveys in the hours you aren't doing R&D because of the software pirates? I'd like a citation to the raw data proving that Claris will be the first company to bite the dust because of the "PIRATES." If Claris bites the dust it will because Apple sucks their blood, because buggy products are shipped, because marketing misses the boat, and/or because Claris uses a voice messaging system for user support, not because of the "PIRATES". > >> 3) In the recent Whole Earth Quarterly David Bryne is asked about music > piracy, what does he think of it? He says, "He views piracy as advertisi > ng They steal his music -- and the distributor looses -- and they pay to > come to his concerts because they listen to his advertising all day long > good advertising for a good product. > >Maybe so, but the software industry and the music industry are very different. >For example, the ONLY way a software company generates income is by selling >software... there are no concerts to subsidize them. > >Once again, Thom, this isn't meant to be an attack on you at all. There were >just too many fallacious ideas expressed for me to hold my ire any longer. > It is true my ideas are fallacious, it is also true that your ideas are useless in dealing with this "problem" >As a software engineer, the software piracy harms me directly. As a software engineer (for Claris) nothing harms you, you are one of the economic elite in the world -- maybe not the valley, but the world... take a walk South of Market or on Telegraph avenue and you'll see people who have been harmed directly. > >Anyway, that's enought of a rant for now. > >Brendan Anyway, that's enought of a rant for now. Thom p.s. If it makes anyone happy I'm will to state the 'piracy is not theft' and 'software piracy is not a problem' -- in my head at least.
cy@dbase.A-T.COM (Cy Shuster) (06/15/90)
In article <37051@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU> thom@dewey.soe.berkeley.edu.UUCP (Thom Gillespie) writes: > >p.s. If it makes anyone happy I'm will to state the 'piracy is not theft' Tell it to a judge. How will you explain the difference? It's amazing how the ease of committing a crime, and the small chance of being caught, can warp some people's morals. When color copiers can do a good job on currency, how many will try it? (I understand the government is already copy-protecting our next release of currency!) --Cy-- cy@dbase.a-t.com Disclaimer: My job depends on my company being able to make a profit.