Info-Atari16@Score.Stanford.EDU (Info-Atari16 Digest) (12/06/86)
Info-Atari16 Digest Friday, December 5, 1986 Volume 86 : Issue 36
This weeks Editor: Bill Westfield
Today's Topics:
RE: Illegal and wrongful postings
Mac Sack
Re: Magic sac problem
Re: Magic sac problem
Veron, Veroff
Atari Developer's Kit
Atari and BREAKOUT.ACC
more about breakout.acc
atari fest
Re: Gem Kermit
Re: No Flight Simulator for Monochrome S - (nf)
Colour questions
Atari Fair article
Re: Illegal and wrongful postings
Lost ATARI16 mail
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 86 18:58:55 EST
From: MCOHAN%UMass.BITNET@WISCVM.WISC.EDU (Michael Cohan, U of
Subject: RE: Illegal and wrongful postings
To: Info-atari16@su-score.arpa
mnetor!lsuc!jimomura@seismo.css.gov (Jim Omura) writes:
> The TI59 is a different problem. It is likely that the display, which
> uses the TI logo and shows the desk accessory as a TI59 infringes Texas
> Instruments' trademarks. Even if the program is public domain (it is in fact
> unmarked and we don't have source code to see if the sourcecode was marked
> public domain), the Trademark is likely a registered mark and even if it was
> not registered, should not have been used.
The TI59 is public domain. I know the person who wrote it.
[Of course, it may have been illegal for your friend to use TI tradmarks
in his program without TI's permission... --BillW ]
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 18:48:17 GMT
From: zen!zooey.Berkeley.EDU!c160-fk@cad.Berkeley.EDU (Duy Le)
Subject: Mac Sack
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
Hello there,
I am thinking of buying Mac Sack soon. Could someone please give answers to
the following questions:
1. Does it turn ST into Macintosh completely?
2. Does it work on my 1 meg 520ST?
3. Do I need to transfer my work from the ST to Macintosh in order to
print my work out?
4. Are there any bugs in Mac Sack that I should know?
As you can see, I am new to this product. Any comments regarding this product
is appreciated.
Duy
------------------------------
Date: 3 Dec 86 18:14:00 GMT
From: ames!rutgers!pyrnj!mirror!st!inmet!dwyer@cad.Berkeley.EDU
Subject: Re: Magic sac problem
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
Where can one obtain a "Magic Sac"?
An electronic or physical mail address should suffice.
thanks
matt
uucp: {bellcore,harvard!ima,ihnp4}!inmet!dwyer
internet: ima!inmet!dwyer@CCA-UNIX.ARPA
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 4 Dec 86 22:40:42 est
From: Eric Terrell <terrell@ohio-state.ARPA>
To: info-atari16@su-score.arpa
I apologize for posting the breakout desk accessory, which according
to Neil Harris is not public domain.
I got the program from GEnie (which Neil uses) with the understanding
that it was public domain.
Neil is right about the program being unfinished. Does Atari plan
to market the program (is there a market for an itty bitty game)?
If the program is not public domain, what exactly is its legal status?
Terrell
------------------------------
Date: 3 Dec 86 15:16:37 GMT
From: gatech!akgua!mcnc!ravi@seismo.css.gov (Ravi Subrahmanyan)
Subject: Re: Magic sac problem
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
In article <1986Dec1.212909.18049@utcs.uucp> pete@utcs.UUCP (Peter Santangeli) writes:
>In article <1836@alvin.mcnc.UUCP> ravi@mcnc.UUCP (Ravi Subrahmanyan) writes:
>>......
>> a) Run magic.prg and put in a mac disk with system
>> files and boot off it.
>> b) Eject the disk.
>> c) Put in another disk which has my applications and
>> hope the Sac will take it (I've tried pressing F1).
>
> ....it only lets you eject a disk THROUGH SOFTWARE. i.e., you must:...
> 1) either choose the "EJECT" option from the finder's menu's, or
> type <Ctrl><e>.
> 2) The magic sac will respond by displaying a flashing "A" in the upper
> right corner of the screen. At this point you may eject the actual
> diskette.
> 3) Insert the other diskette. The ST/MagicSac will now read in the
> directory and desktop information from the new diskette.
> Pete Santangeli
But but but but (Baaaawwwwll).... (sniff). It doesn't do that!
I've used Macs, and that's what I expected, but what I see it
1) I eject the disk by choosing the EJECT option in the finder.
2) "A" flashes, I push the button and get the disk out; the icon
becomes dim.
3) I put in a new disk: The (old) icon becomes bright again.. the
%$#^$%# thing just assumes that I put the ejected disk back in,
and if I'm using the motivator, cheerfully rewrites all 400K
or whatever back onto the disk. Nice, but I didn't get the
Sac to be a magic-format duplicator!
All help will be greatly appreciated; I'm desperate now. Thanks Pete,
-ravi
------------------------------
Date: 5 Dec 86 08:05:52 GMT
From: sdcc6!sdcc3!ee173fes@sdcsvax.ucsd.edu (STEPHEN SIMON)
Subject: Veron, Veroff
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
A while ago somebody posted uuencoded versions of two programs to
set and unset the verify flag for disk access. At the time I
couldn't get them to work, but didn't really care too much. I have
since learned the error of my ways. Could someone PLEASE, PLEASE,
PLEASE post the source for these programs or tell me how to write
them? I am dying over slow disk accesses. I think I can get uudecode
to work now, if people only have the executables, but the source is
really what I want.
BTW, can someone tell me what TOS error #35 is? Is it not enough
memory?
Finally . . .
What is the word on Microsoft Write? I've heard rumors of Microsoft
pulling out of Atari (a fight between Tramiel and the Pres??) and am
worried about the future of Write. It would be a bad time if we
lost them! Remember, these were _rumors_!! Anybody got any _real_,
_solid_ news??
John Ogawa
(on a friend's account for December)
Write mail to me here until Jan 1, then write to:
ucbvax!sdcsvax!sdcc6!ix181
------------------------------
Date: 3 Dec 86 19:52:26 GMT
From: zsr%psuvm.bitnet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU
Subject: Atari Developer's Kit
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
There has been a lot of talk on the net about the Atari Developer's kit
and what is included. As a slightly cracked user who broke down and bought
the kit, I'd like to share my views on it and its relative worth.
First, I'll discuss the documentation. The documentation looks like
a pre-release draft of the Atari documentation, or more accuratly, an
ever-so-slightly modified version of the PC GEM docs. In the copy that I
got (by the way, I can only speak of *my* copy of the kit...) there was a
note from Atari to "disregard references to CP/M-86K"...was Atari actually
considering shipping the ST with CP/M instead of TOS? (shudder)
The docs are useful (I only have the Abacus "Internals" book, so I
needed something...) but they are somewhat dissappointing. The version that
I got had *none* of the figures in the VDI & AES manuals--just blank spaces
above the captions. In addition, two of the sample programs were missing
(although they did appear in source form on the disks). There were some
neat docs (like "The Hitchiker's Guide to the BIOS") and some good hardware
docs (data sheets for the LSI chips, sound chip, Floppy controller,
interface chips...but nothing for the 68000 (shucks)). There is a really
off-the-wall docs for the Line-A handler (the author was either stoned or
just having one hell of a good time writing them...). There is the standard
DRI C manual (that says there is no floating point support, although Atari
seems to have included the Motorola F.P. library--thanks guys!). There is
a guide to GEMDOS (that includes neat things like disk directory formats
and other assorted goodies). Only the VDI & AES manuals seemed incomplete,
and the page count came out to something like 1100 pages.
The disks (five of them, single-sided) contained all kinds of goodies...
some of which even worked well. The C compiler has been discussed many times
on the net, but I'll outline a typical session for the uninitiated:
1. Use MicroEMACS (ME.PRG, no source included) to edit the program
2. From GEM Desktop (the Command shell is the pits...) run the BATCH
program to invoke a batch file (included) that runs the compiler
and assembler. The compiler has a C pre-processor stage, and then
a two-stage compiler (each a separate program), and then the
assembler is called. All intermediate files generated by the
passes are erased.
3. From the GEM Desktop invoke the batch file that links your object
file and the standard GEM object libraries (the batch files are
included for applications as well as desk accessories.
4. The above step also runs a program called RELMOD that generates a
GEM .PRG file that can be double-clicked from the desktop.
Either a hard disk, two floppies or a 720K RAM disk are needed to do this
procedure (without changing disks, that is...).
The Resource Construction Set and Shape Editor are worth their weight in
gold (even though there were **NO** docs for the RCS) but are not perfect.
They do work, however, and save much time in designing resource files.
The utilities include an Archiving utility (for libraries, not like the ARC
utility) for object files, a debugger (at assembly level, not C Source level),
assorted programs to look at maps and tables in object files, a KERMIT program
(for file transfer to and from a mainframe), and several others that I can't
remember at the moment. If there is interest shown on the net, I'll post a
listing of the directories of the disks with a small description of the files.
So is it worth $300? Not really, but it was necessary to do any real
work with the machine. It needs **much** polishing and improvements
(not to mention GDOS and such...), but it is a good start. I'm sorry for
boring those of you who already have the kit, but I was in a public
benefactor mood today. The ST is an incredible machine--all it needs is some
more high-quality software (in the DEGAS tradition). Best of luck to all
who work with the ST (not because you need it, but because it's time for it
to be recognized as the dynamo it really is).
"There is a theory which states that | Christopher Johnson
if ever anyone discovers exactly | ZSR @ PSUVMB, PSUVMA, PSUVM
what the Universe is for and why | ^^^^^^
it is here, it will instantly be | Penn State University
replaced by something even more | Berks Campus
bizarre and inexplicable. |
|
There is another which states that |
this has already happened." |
|
(Doug Adams, "The Resturaunt |
at the End of the Universe") |
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 86 08:55:19 cst
From: moore@ncsc.ARPA (Moore)
To: info-atari16@su-score.ARPA
Subject: Atari and BREAKOUT.ACC
This situation is getting out of hand: How can you tell if the fantastic
new piece of software you picked up off an RBBS is commercial or public
domain? You can't, unless you get the source along with it (know what
that will do to your long distance phone bill???). And don't give me
that line about a copy- right notice showing on the screen: I downloaded
a copy of BREAKOUT from some (I'll never tell) BBS, and there ain't no
copyright notice on it!
Regardless of the illegalities involved in posting something that's
copyrighted even if you don't know that is the case, netters need to
keep this in perspective: do you really believe the guy would have
posted the thing if he knew it was copyrighted? The *only* reason I
haven't posted DB Master One, which I got from a "Public Domain" BBS, is
because I can't get a straight (or at least, consistent) answer on if it
is pd or not.
I don't mean the following as a jab at Neil, or anyone else, because I
don't know whose job it is to police the net (certainly not Neil's), if
it is anyone's; it should be said, though, that a couple of people
(myself included) posted *several* queries to the net concerning
BREAKOUT, well before BREAKOUT itself was posted; wasn't that the time
to shout "illegal!", rather than after the thing had been posted?
Unfortunately I can't offer any solutions for the paranoia that is so
prevalent these days concerning software copying; but this is getting
ridiculous.
Jim
Moore@NCSC.arpa
(i've got heaps of pd s/w on my host, but it might not *really* be pd, so you
can't have it, nyahh!!)
[Oh be reasonable, Neil wasn't threatinging to have people arrested,
systems shut down, hosts removed from the net, universities sued, or
any of that - He just commented that a posted program was NOT PD, and
should not have been posted, and would people please be more careful.
This seems to be completely reasonable to me... --BillW]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 5 Dec 86 09:53:07 est
From: Eric Terrell <terrell@ohio-state.ARPA>
To: info-atari16@su-score.arpa
Subject: more about breakout.acc
I am told that this program was available (perhaps still is) from ATARI's
own BBS in Sunnyvale!
Terrell
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 08:40:56 GMT
From: ihnp4!chinet!cabbie@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Richard Andrews)
Subject: atari fest
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
In article <1449@ihuxi.UUCP> store2@ihuxi.UUCP (Wilcox) writes:
>
>The following list of Atari computer fairs is taken from the January
>1987 issue of ANTIC. If you live near one of the locations, you can
>probably get more information from a local users group.
>
> February 21,22 Denver, Col. Regency Hotel
> March 13-15 Allentown, PA Holiday Inn
> April 4-6 Buffalo, NY
> April 10,11 Salt Lake City, UT
> May 8-10 Dallas, TX Dallas Infomart
> May 15-17 Seattle, Wash Seattle Center Flag Pavilion
> August 29,30 Detroit, MI Southfield Civic Center
>
>In addition, initial plans are being laid for fairs in New York City, Boston,
>St. Louis, metropolitan New Jersey and here in the Chicago-Milwaukee area
>which will probably be in the fall of '87 as it looks now.
>
> Kit Kimes
The Chicago Atari Fair will be held the weekend of the 26th of
July at the Ramada Inn O'Hare. I will post more info as it becomes
available. If anyone needs information as to booth availability, room
reservations, tickets, etc. You can post your messages thru the net and
I will reply via email (if possible).
Any opinions expressed above are my own. Rich Andrews
They can be yours too. Please send $19.95 to.....ihnp4!chinet!cabbie
------------------------------
Date: 5 Dec 86 01:00:22 GMT
From: mcvax!nikhefk!frankg@seismo.css.gov (Frank Geerling)
Subject: Re: Gem Kermit
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
I am to interested in the GEM-KERMIT please email it to me!!!!!!!
Frank Geerling
(frankg@nikhefk.uucp)
Usenet: {seismo, philabs, decvax}!mcvax!frankg@nikhefk
Normal mail: Frank Geerling
NIKHEF-K (PIMU)
Postbus 4395
1009 AJ Amsterdam
The Netherlands
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 18:09:00 GMT
From: mcvax!unido!exunido!uh@seismo.css.gov
Subject: Re: No Flight Simulator for Monochrome S - (nf)
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
The market is in good old Europe! Here in Germany nearly all ST are sold
with monochrome monitors.
Uwe Hoch
Computer Science Department, University of Dortmund
4600 Dortmund 50, P.O. Box 500500, W.-Germany
E-mail address: uh@exunido.uucp, uh@exunido.bitnet
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 12:30:40 GMT
From: mcvax!ukc!its63b!csan@seismo.css.gov (Andie)
Subject: Colour questions
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
Could some kind soul out there in netland pleeeeease give a list of what games
run on a mono system ?
Pretty please ?
Thanks
Andrew Ness . Department of Computer Science
EDINBURGH University.
ARPA: csan%ed.itspna@ucl-cs.arpa
UUCP: ...!seismo!mcvax!ukc!itspna!csan
JANET: csan@uk.ac.ed.itspna
% These are my own views and any resemblance to any coherent reasoning is
% probably a typo.
%
% "The back row strikes again!"
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 19:59:47 GMT
From: mimsy!aplcen!jhunix!ins_adjb@seismo.css.gov (Daniel Jay Barrett)
Subject: Atari Fair article
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
The December issue of MUSIC TECHNOLOGY magazine (a fantastic
magazine, by the way) has an interesting article on a major Atari
ST Fair.
MUSIC TECHNOLOGY MAGAZINE
7361 Topanga Canyon Blvd.
Canoga Park, CA 91303
-- Dan
------------------------------
Date: 4 Dec 86 16:39:29 GMT
From: decvax!mcnc!ravi@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Ravi Subrahmanyan)
Subject: Re: Illegal and wrongful postings
To: info-atari16@score.stanford.edu
In article <1407@lsuc.UUCP> jimomura@lsuc.UUCP (Jim Omura) writes:
>
> .... The 'BREAKOUT' desk accessory was *not* public domain. It was
>proprietary code from Atari. ..........
In defense of Eric, I must say that I too had a copy of
breakout.acc, which I fully believed to be a PD product, and which
I've given away to some other people; now this whole thing has me
worried because __ I got the acc from a local dealer, who has it in a disk
of PD software that he lets people copy __. I obviously can't *prove*
that's how I got it, but is it an authorised copy if the dealer gave
it away? Did Atari mean to sell it, or distribute it through dealers?
Is there a legal problem in such a case, ie. does my receiving it free
from the dealer mean I am not to give it away also (I can hardly
imagine the dealer would give it if he could sell it)?
-ravi
------------------------------
Date: 11:23pm Friday, 5 December 1986
Subject: Lost mail.
From: Bill Westfield <BillW@SU-SCORE.ARPA>
Several atari16 messages received at score between 4-DEC and 5-DEC
were accidently deleted. If you don't see a message you posted
recently, please send it again. Sorry for the trouble...
BillW
------------------------------
End of Info-Atari16 Digest
**************************
-------