blevins@hpccc.HP.COM (David Blevins) (06/23/87)
I will soon be buying a 520ST as a MIDI controller, and have been monitoring various ST info sources for a month or so. My main reservation about this machine is Atari's "attitude" towards its users and developers. I read something this weekend about Atari "not wanting a 1040 to be hooked up to a TV and used as a game machine" or some such rot. I believe that the CUSTOMER will determine what he wants to do with his computer, and doesn't need Atari's marketing dept. forcing him to use the machine only for REAL applications. (I will be buying a mono- chrome system, and thus will rely on the RF modulator to be able to play the many games that only run in color.) Thus I don't expect Atari to listen when I recommend that during manufacture of the 520 w/ the internal floppy, to please either populate the empty RAM locations with sockets, or tape the boards before wave solder to facili- tate easy upgrade to 1MB of RAM. Your customers will love you for the fore- sight you show in considering their future needs... I would love to be pleasantly surprised! dB hplabs!hpccc!blevins
brad@looking.UUCP (06/29/87)
In article <5330001@hpccc.HP.COM> blevins@hpccc.HP.COM (David Blevins) writes: >My main reservation about this machine is Atari's "attitude" towards its >users and developers. I read something this weekend about Atari "not >wanting a 1040 to be hooked up to a TV and used as a game machine" or some >such rot. I believe that the CUSTOMER will determine what he wants to do >with his computer, and doesn't need Atari's marketing dept. forcing him >to use the machine only for REAL applications. It's true that it's up to the customer, but this doesn't change the fact that the games are the worst thing to happen to the Atari, and that if the machine fizzles out, it will be due, in part, to the games. While Atari couldn't realisticly require developers buying the machine to sign licences stating they will not develop games, it would probably be a good idea. The Atari has better hardware than the Mac or Mac Plus. Yet it is still perceived by many to be a games machine, while nobody perceives the Mac as one. If there are lots of games, and any customers are buying the machines "to play games" then a games machine perception develops. The better the games are, the worse it is. Who ever heard of somebody buying an IBM or Mac to play games. Yes, there are many games available for these machines, but nobody thinks of them as the raison d'etre of the machine line. -- Brad Templeton, Looking Glass Software Ltd. - Waterloo, Ontario 519/884-7473
braner@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu (braner) (07/01/87)
[] I don't think it's the fact that some people write games for the ST that gives it a game-machine image. Lots of games are written for the Mac and the IBM! It's that the brand name 'Atari' has historically been firmly attached to video games. Perhaps Atari should have sold the ST under a different trade name (let's see: friend? Amigo? Oops, forget that...). Anyway, the fact that many (most?) ST's are sold with the MONOCHROME monitor is strong evidence for the serious use the ST is put to. Other obstacles to the development of business software on the ST? How about: no GDOS, 40 folders limit, no documentation... The biggest advantages of the Mac are the multitude of fonts, the application independent cut-and-paste (including graphics) and the device-independent graphics output. All this could be done on the ST --- with GDOS. The biggest advantages of the IBMs are cheap hard disks and a socket for a math chip. No comment. - Moshe Braner
kevin@LINDY.STANFORD.EDU (Kevin Burnett) (07/01/87)
In article <820@looking.UUCP> Brad Templeton writes: > >While Atari couldn't realisticly require developers buying the machine to >sign licences stating they will not develop games, it would probably be >a good idea. Ugh. If the ST didn't have good game-playing ability, I wouldn't own one right now. The ST was supposed to be a 'home' computer when it was brought out, i.e. be able to play 'Time Bandit' as well as run Publishing Partner or whatever. > >The Atari has better hardware than the Mac or Mac Plus. Yet it is still >perceived by many to be a games machine, while nobody perceives the Mac >as one. If there are lots of games, and any customers are buying the >machines "to play games" then a games machine perception develops. Oh no! A GAMES MACHINE! Actually, from the coverage the ST has gotten in magazines that aren't specific to one brand of computer, the things that seem to be mentioned the least are the games... >The better the games are, the worse it is. Who ever heard of somebody >buying an IBM or Mac to play games. Yes, there are many games available A very good example of a system that flies right in the face of this is the Apple II series. The Apple II machines had some of the *best* games available for any micro, but they weren't perceived as merely game machines. ... >the machine line. >-- >Brad Templeton, Looking Glass Software Ltd. - Waterloo, Ontario 519/884-7473 If this came out sounding like some sort of flame-thrower, sorry, it wasn't intended to sound nasty... -- Kevin Burnett Stanford Linear Accelerator Centre / Santa Clara Class of '88 Arpa: kevin@Lindy.Stanford.EDU Bitnet: KJBSF@SLACVM.BITNET Old-style UUCP: ...!decwrl!labrea!Lindy!kevin
ljdickey@water.UUCP (07/02/87)
In article <1583@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu> braner@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu (braner) writes: > >I don't think it's the fact that some people write games for the ST that >gives it a game-machine image. Lots of games are written for the Mac and >the IBM! It's that the brand name 'Atari' has historically been firmly >attached to video games. I think Moshe is right about this. On at least two occasions, I have mentioned Atari to friends when their kids were present. The kids got all excited and asked me if I got a 400 or an 800. Since then, I have been somewhat on the defensive. On another occasion, it was the parents who know about the games machines. There is a long range view that could be taken here... when these kids grow up, they may form a large market base for the company. Remember when big blue put its boxes into universities and colleges. I think that everybody understood that when the students graduated and found their place in the business world, they would be positively inclined towards blue computers. Lee -- L. J. Dickey, Faculty of Mathematics, University of Waterloo. ljdickey@water.UUCP ljdickey%water@waterloo.CSNET ljdickey%water%waterloo.csnet@csnet-relay.ARPA ljdickey@watdcs.BITNET UUCP: ...!watmath!water!ljdickey
pes@ux63.bath.ac.uk (Smee) (07/09/87)
In article <5330001@hpccc.HP.COM> blevins@hpccc.HP.COM (David Blevins) writes: >... I read something this weekend about Atari "not >wanting a 1040 to be hooked up to a TV and used as a game machine" ... To be fair, I believe that what Atari mean when they say things that get reported like that is: We don't want the 1040 to get the reputation of being a machine which people only buy to hook up to a TV etc... The problem is that if the world-at-large gets the idea that 1040's are primarily games machines, they won't consider them for serious use. May not be right or fair, but that's how the market works. Speaking of which, the 1040 probably *is* a games machine. I WANT a 1-MegaST; anyone from Atari listening?
pes@ux63.bath.ac.uk (Smee) (07/16/87)
In article <1394@bath63.ux63.bath.ac.uk> pes@ux63.bath.ac.uk (Smee) writes: > >Speaking of which, the 1040 probably *is* a games machine. I WANT a >1-MegaST; anyone from Atari listening? Yeah, quoting myself. Ouch. I should have put a smiley face on that, cause I've been soundly leapt on (e-mail) by various people who I can't work out a reply address for, given the sinuous routes involved and my limited auths. Hey, everybody, I've got a machine. A mere 520ST, no F, no M, colour and mono, ss and DS disks, printer, modem, ... I KNOW it's a good machine. I know there are good serious things you can do with it. I *do* have plans to upgrade this box come the Autumn, probably to 1 Meg and turn the SS drive into a DS. But, I want a second one. For personal reasons, all of my own, and with full understanding of the similarities and differences (as far as announced) I would VERY MUCH prefer the second machine to be a Mega box rather than a normal box. I'm not gonna tell you why, nothing to do with you. (And besides, I doubt I could explain it totally rationally and coherently, but it revolves around a basic concept that I'd prefer being at the low end of the high range than being at the high end of the low range.) And, for PURELY MONEY reasons, I'd like the Mega to be a 1-Mega so's I can afford it and some added goodies -- like a second colour monitor -- instead of having only the naked machine. So, I WANT A 1-MEGA !!! (P.S. Currently, rumoured marketing plans in the UK indicate that the 520/1040 is going to be sold by the historically 'home entertainment' computer shops; and that the Mega is going to be pushed thru the historically 'business machine' dealers. So maybe I was half right anyway.) :-) (just in case)...
view3b5@ihlpe.ATT.COM (Kit Kimes) (07/20/87)
In article <1436@bath63.ux63.bath.ac.uk>, pes@ux63.bath.ac.uk (Smee) writes: > I *do* have plans to upgrade > this box come the Autumn, probably to 1 Meg and turn the SS drive into a DS. > But, I want a second one. For personal reasons, all of my own, and with full > understanding of the similarities and differences (as far as announced) I > would VERY MUCH prefer the second machine to be a Mega box rather than a > normal box. > > And, for PURELY MONEY reasons, I'd like the Mega to be a 1-Mega so's I can > afford it and some added goodies -- like a second colour monitor -- instead > of having only the naked machine. > > So, I WANT A 1-MEGA !!! > According to the July/August issue of Current Notes you will soon be able to upgrade your old 520ST to a Maga ST style by changing the case. I quote from the article entitled "ST Update": "Coming soon will be a Mega St case for your 520. Remove the 520's mother- board and install it in the new thin-line box. What does it do for you? Moves all the serial, parallel, DMA, disk drive and monitor connections to the box to unclutter your keyboard. Also gives ample room for 4-Meg boards, the Blitter and other add-ons. Deluxe version has built-in fan, power supply, and set of AC power switches on the front panel like a power master control box--spike, surge and noise protection, et al. The hitch! You must also buy a new slim-line keyboard with single telephone-type cord connection. Another heads-up product if the price is right." They didn't mention a company's name or release timeframe. Might be a good way to get a 1 Meg Mega ST if that is what you want. Kit Kimes AT&T-ISL Naperville, IL ...ihnp4!iwvae!kimes
csrobe@ICASE.ARPA (Charles S. Roberson) (07/24/87)
In Info-Atari16 Digest Volume 87 : Issue 287 <ihnp4!ihlpe!view3b5@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> (Kit Kimes) writes: >"Coming soon will be a Mega St case for your 520. Remove the 520's mother- >board and install it in the new thin-line box. What does it do for you? >They didn't mention a company's name or release timeframe. Might be a good >way to get a 1 Meg Mega ST if that is what you want. >...ihnp4!iwvae!kimes 520? hmmmm. What about the 1040? I think I would like to change cases. Considering I have already had a heat problem with my Supra, and I plan an memory upgrade + blitter chip, having a fan and and surge protector built in would be some nice insurance. Also, a detachable keyboard would make my desk more usable that just a computer stand. Unfortunately, some things that I have read in CN (ages past) have yet to come true. They *are* a quality publication, but they don't always verify the content of their articles. It seems that they receive articles from guest authors all over the country, and they don't have the resources to play super-sleuth. Has anyone heard about this from a different source? Especially for the 1040? I would feel better if I had an address and a date. There's alot of vapor floating around out there... -chip -------------------------------------------------------------------- Chip Roberson ARPANET: csrobe@icase.arpa 1105 London Company Way BITNET: $csrobe@wmmvs.bitnet Williamsburg, VA 23185 UUCP: ...!seismo!gmu90x!wmcs!csrobe -------------------------------------------------------------------- "Must I tell the story of a thousand rainy days since we first met? It's the same ole big umbrella, But it's always me who ends up getting wet." -Sting Outlandos d'Amor Zenyatta Mondatta Ghost in Machine Synchronicity (any more?)
bruce@ektools.UUCP (Bruce D. Nelson ) (07/26/87)
In article <ihnp4!ihlpe!view3b5@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> (Kit Kimes) writes: >"Coming soon will be a Mega St case for your 520. Remove the 520's mother- >board and install it in the new thin-line box. What does it do for you? > >They didn't mention a company's name or release timeframe. Might be a good >way to get a 1 Meg Mega ST if that is what you want. The company is Diverse Data Products. No price/schedule was mentioned. Bruce D. Nelson, Sr. Appl. Analyst: Software Maint., Tech. Support Svcs. EASTMAN KODAK COMPANY, 901 Elmgrove Rd., Rochester, NY 14650, (716)726-7890 UUCP: {allegra, seismo}!rochester!kodak!ektools!bruce ARPA: kodak!ektools!bruce@rochester.ARPA
csrobe@ICASE.ARPA (Charles S. Roberson) (07/28/87)
i had heard that with the advent of the mega-st's that Atari was going to cut production costs on the ST's. to do so, they were going to start putting 520s into 1040 boxes, and stop producing two casings. that would explain why a 520 now has (f)loppy disk inside of it and why a 1040 now has a frequency (m)odulator in it. i haven't seen any of these new beasts but that is my guess. how about it Atari? is this correct? i don't want start any wild rumors, so let's just say that this is speculation until we hear some "official voice" on the matter. (hallo? hallo? Atari?) -c -------------------------------------------------------------------- Chip Roberson ARPANET: csrobe@icase.arpa 1105 London Company Way BITNET: $csrobe@wmmvs.bitnet Williamsburg, VA 23185 UUCP: ...!seismo!gmu90x!wmcs!csrobe --------------------------------------------------------------------
neil@atari.UUcp (Neil Harris) (07/29/87)
In article <8707281133.AA11417@work1.icase>, csrobe@ICASE.ARPA (Charles S. Roberson) writes: > i had heard that with the advent of the mega-st's that Atari was going > to cut production costs on the ST's. to do so, they were going to > start putting 520s into 1040 boxes, and stop producing two casings. > that would explain why a 520 now has (f)loppy disk inside of it and > why a 1040 now has a frequency (m)odulator in it. i haven't seen any > of these new beasts but that is my guess. There are no modulators in the current 1040ST's. There are a few 1040ST's in this world with modulators, produced as special items, and some of these may have "leaked" out to consumers. There is still no plan to include modulators in production 1040ST's. -- --->Neil Harris, Director of Marketing Communications, Atari Corporation UUCP: ...{hoptoad, lll-lcc, pyramid, imagen, sun}!atari!neil GEnie: NHARRIS/ WELL: neil / BIX: neilharris / Delphi: NEILHARRIS CIS: 70007,1135 / Atari BBS 408-745-5308 / Usually the OFFICIAL Atari opinion
billw@wolf.UUCP (Bill Wisner) (07/30/87)
In article <798@atari.UUcp>, neil@atari.UUcp (Neil Harris) writes: > There are no modulators in the current 1040ST's. > There are a few 1040ST's in this world with modulators, produced as special > items, and some of these may have "leaked" out to consumers. There is still > no plan to include modulators in production 1040ST's. Curiouser and curiouser. I am, as you may understand, quite curious as to how I became one of the lucky few to get a 1040STfm. I mail ordered it from Lyco computers, and that very company told me (before my purchase) that a 1040 would NOT have a modulator.. -- Copyright (C) 1987, Bill Wisner. Redistribution prohibited if redistributor does not permit further distribution. UUCP: ..{ihnp4,sdcsvax}!jack!wolf!billw Unison: WABE
Sheldon_Hijacker_Chang@cup.portal.com (08/06/87)
What's a frequency modulator???? I have one of the earlier 1040's and
I want to know if I have one.
SHELDON CHANG
sun!cup.portal.com!sheldon.hijacker.chang