engst@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu (Adam C. Engst) (01/06/88)
Well, the information on various disk drive has subsided, so I'll post the
entire archive in another posting. To recap: my drive started to give write
errors, often even refusing to boot. I tried tightening all the connections
and making sure the chips, most notably the DMA chip were seated.
Everything seems to have failed. I now have to possibilities. I can (a)
take it to a repair place 2 hours away, which would be rather difficult
since I work full time during break and don't have a car most of the time.
On the other hand, I could (b) just order a new IBM style 3.5" drive and
hope that it works. I have decided to follow the latter route for several
reasons. First, I can always use the second drive even if it won't work
internally. Second, I'm planning on getting a BMS board set and Seagate 238
30 meg hard disk as well, so I'll have a power supply and case handy. There
also a few possible problems with this route. The drive might be too big,
or might not attach correctly (I asked about the screw holes and it, a
Fujitsu, does have them.), or it might not have the correct input/output for
the write-protect sensor. To protect myself from that possibility, I
ordered from a place that offers a 15 day refund policy. As far as the hard
disk goes, BMS has been highly recommended and I see no reason to go with
ICD instead since it sounds as if they merely copied the BMS board and made
few improvments. I don't mind minor hardware jobs, and the BMS board set
sounds fairly easy to assemble without soldering and all that hard stuff.
(I don't want to buy the Atari or Supra drives because of minor problems
like size, cable length, potential reliability problems etc. I also think
it will be fun to put everything together.) The Seagate drive is cheap and
basic and 30 meg, which is better than the Atari-specific drives for the
same size. So, my system should end up looking like this.
DS/DD internal floppy (Fuijitsu - IBM-style) $115
DS/DD external floppy (old internal drive $000
used only for reading)
needs a cable from E. Arthur Brown $35
BMS board set $250
Seagate 238 30 meg hard disk $275
Power supply and case combo $80
I'm only actually buying the new internal drive for now - I have to get the
ST working well before I invest any more money into it and I still don't
know for sure that the DMA chip isn't the culprit.
Adam
Thanks to all of you who sent information or offered help in one way or
another. Luckily I didn't lose anything in the whole mess and I've sort of
enjoyed the research I had to put in to finally decide. If anyone has any
major problems with what I've decided, please feel free to tell me; I'm
still open to suggestions.
--
Adam C. Engst engst@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu
pv9y@cornella.bitnet
"If it's not interactive fiction, it's not fun."engst@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu (Adam C. Engst) (01/06/88)
From: braner
Hi!
Sorry to hear of your problems. I have always worried about that happening
to me, with the 1040 having only one drive that I excersize a lot. I have
even thought of buying an external drive just too have a spare.
Now that's my suggested solution: buy another drive. Fix the old one later...
You don't have to buy a complete Atari ST type drive, with case and all.
Just get the standard DSDD 720K drive that they now sell for attachment
to IBM clones. They sell for about $130 mail-order. From what I've heard,
they are pretty much standard, including the connectors in the back,
but not so in the location, shape and size of the disk-eject button.
But you can enlarge the hole in the ST case... (or keep that drive outside
of the ST case).
I forget if I told you, but a few days ago I bought Dale's last hard disk,
an Atari SH204 (20 megs). So now my floppy drive gets somewhat less use.
Do you have by any chance a copy of the program that makes the ST boot
from the hard disk? Needless to say, it (and FOLDRxxx) did _not_ come
with the drive...
Good luck. If you find a good solution, tell me.
- Moshe
**************************************************************************
From rochester!kodak!ektools!bruce@cornell.UUCP Mon Dec 14 13:10:48 1987
Subject: Repair place
Aardvark Electronics (honest, that's the name) in Geneva, NY (50 mi N of
Ithaca) was an authorized Atari service place last I talked to him (6 mo.
ago). He used to come to the User Group meetings here in Rochester. Failing
that, Leon's Computer here in Rochester is an authorised service agency.
There's some service places in ads in Antic, Analog, Start, etc. which could
probably do the job and send it back by <pick a fast ie expensive) service.
Hope this helps.
Bruce D. Nelson | UUCP: ...!rutgers!rochester!kodak!ektools!bruce
Eastman Kodak Company | Voice: 716-726-7890
901 Elmgrove Road | Company Mail: Dept 420 Technical Support Services
Rochester, NY 14650 |
****************************************************************************
From: Gerry Wheeler <wheels@mks%math.waterloo.edu>
Subject: disk drive help
I dunno about that. I think internal connections may be your best first
attempt. Mine went away with similar problems. I took it apart and
fiddled with it, and finally it fixed itself. Unfortunately, I never
was able to determine the real cause, but I suspect a bad contact on a
chip pin. Remember when people used to recommend the 4" solution (drop
it 4" onto a desk top)? That is the early cure for this problem. I
recommend opening it up, prying out socketed chips, and using lots of
contact cleaner.
---
Gerry Wheeler Phone: (519)884-2251
Mortice Kern Systems Inc. UUCP: uunet!watmath!mks!wheels
43 Bridgeport Rd. E. BIX: join mks
Waterloo, Ontario N2J 2J4 CompuServe: 73260,1043
****************************************************************************
From braner Tue Dec 15 10:40:43 1987
Hi.
A 3.5" DS drive, just bare drive, costs about $120-140 in the ads in the
back of BYTE. Power-supply I'm not sure how much, personally I would get a
cheap 12VDC plug-in sort of thing, and add a little 3-pin 5V regulator chip.
Radio Shack was selling, for $5, surplus Coleco Adam power supply modules.
They give 12V and + and - 5V. Real good buy - I bought 2! See if they
still carry those. Good for lotsa uses (but NOT big enough for a hard
disk...). I don't know where would you get a suitable enclosure for the
drive, though. Must be around somewhere. Then you need the cable, with the
wierd ST plug (VERY hard to get). If you can get the whole works for $200
it's probably the best way to go. All that's assuming you want to connect
it as a 2nd drive, not just keep it on the shelf as a spare.
With hard disks becoming so cheap, you could consider that too. I saw
some mail-order ads selling ST HDs for < $600.
- Moshe
****************************************************************************
From: rochester!rutgers!bu.edu!brianb@cornell.UUCP (Brian Bresnahan)
Subject: Re: general info on disk drives wanted
I own the Atari SH204 and while it may be big, it is quite reliable
and quiet, I have been running a bbs on it for over a year now and it
has not been shut off for more than a week total.
When looking for a hard disk, Astra has a nice reliable system that includes
a floopy drive, i would tend to avoid the supra models under 30 meg
because there have been problems with reliablility. Or you can build
one yourself, there is a California company that sells the interface, it
would be large, but you can build it any way you like(number of drives,
sizes etc.)
Brian Bresnahan
brianb@bucsf.bu.edu
engf0ic@BOSTONU.BITNET
*****************************************************************************
From: mpsimon@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (M. Patrick Simon)
Subject: Re: general info on disk drives wanted
Adam Engst--
I have been waiting for the ASTRA hard drive/floppy system to come down
in price. I am very impressed with the system. I saw one demo'd at a recent
Atari fair: the man was rolling the thing around, while at the same time, a
demo was running on the ST, reading pictures off the hard disk and displaying
them on the monitor. The system comes with a one year warranty. Unfortunately,
it is still way out of my price range (list price $995.00, I have seen it for
as low as $850).
I have seen ads recently for a two double-sided floppy drive. I am not
sure how this works with the ST OS (is it as easy as install disk drive?). You
might also want to find out more about the Berkeley Micro Systems boards
which are supposed to turn the dma port into a scsi port. I can try to
find more specific information on either of these if you are interested.
Good luck. Please post to the net whatever info you find out, or at
least save your messages in one big archive and mail me a copy in a few
weeks.
--Patrick Simon mpsimon@phoenix.princeton.edu
*****************************************************************************
From: dragon@olivej.ATC.OLIVETTI.COM (Give me a quarter or I'll touch you)
Subject: Re: BMS controller package
Adam, I'm using a BMS controller with a Seagate ST251. No problems
encountered. The BMS+Adaptec controller combo is $250, I believe. One
just hooks everything together, and runs the software. Pretty foolproof,
as long as one sticks to the hard drives listed in the documentation (which
covers quite a few hard discs). Being an officer in our local Atari group
(which is close to BMS) I've met Chris and have worked with him at shows.
He's quite helpful in setting systems up when a customer has problems.
(Chris is the president of the company.) If you choose to go with the
board, I believe you'll be most happy with it!
--Dean
***************************************************************************
From: Lee Dickey <ljdickey@water.waterloo.edu>
Subject: Re: general info on disk drives wanted
I have heard of people using the BMS controller, and I think that I saw
a posting on the net about that controller, about a year ago. I do not
*know* anyone who has one. The article mentioned hooking up a largish
disk that was "surplus" around the shop.
When I was a Case Western Reserve, Mr. Bammi showed me the inside of a 20 Meg
hard disks. It had a gray plastic box with the name Atari or Supra on the
outside. Inside, there two things: one was a small printed circuit board
and the other looked like it was a refugee 20 Meg hard disk from an IBM PC.
The Atari Twist:
With two hands, one at each end of the keyboard, pick up the unit
until it is about two inches above the desk. Rotate one had forward,
one hand backward, so as to "flex" the case. Do the same thing in the
opposite direction. I guess this could move chip pins in their sockets.
Variation:
Drop the unit to the desk top. I do not recommend this. This might
have the same effect as pressing chips into the sockets.
**************************************************************************
From: umn-cs!viper.Lynx.MN.Org!john@cs-gw.D.UMN.EDU (John Stanley)
Hello Adam. I've had problems reciently very similar to the ones
you described, so I may be able to help... I'm going to give you more
than one suggestion. You should probably try the 2nd suggestion first
because it doesn't require doing anything but booting a disk.
The problem with my system (same configuration and machine as yours)
turned out to be a bad DMA chip. This is one of the chips that,
fortunatly, Atari put in sockets in all the STs I've ever heard of.
The cost was around $50 to have it replaced at my local service
center.
The first thing to try is the "drop fix". Take your machine, lift
it about 2-3 inches above the table and drop it. This offen has the
desired effect of reseating loose chips.
If that doesn't work, try booting a ramdisk. You did mention that
you can occasionaly get a disk to boot. If so, you may (with -lots-
of patiance) be able to get a ramdisk program to boot. Once this is
done, you then can probably get your text files moved to the ramdisk
although you should check the files for glitches. If you can get
this far, you can probably take a 3.5in disk (formatted on an IBM)
and get copys of your text files copied to a form an IBM-PC can
use.
If that doesn't work, you can try removing the top of the case and
looking for a single large socketed chip normaly found under the
internal disk drive. VERY gently, pry both ends of the chip up about
1/32 of an inch and then push it back into the socket. While you've
got the case open, it wouldn't hurt to loosen and then then reconnect
the cables to the drive (be sure to try both ends)...
If that doesn't work you can, if you want, send me the disk with
your files. I'll copy them to an IBM format disk and return them.
(This is obviously a last-ditch suggestion, but if you really need
the files, I'm willing to go this far to help.) If you decide to go
this route, please be sure to specify 3.5" or 5.25" IBM disks. The
3.5 inch size is obviously easier, but I can if necessary drive about
15 miles to a friends place to get files onto a 5.25" disk.
Please let me know how this turns out.... Good luck..
---
John Stanley (john@viper.UUCP)
Software Consultant - DynaSoft Systems
UUCP: ...{amdahl,ihnp4,rutgers}!meccts!viper!john
*****************************************************************************
From utzoo!utgpu!water!watmath!mks!wheels Sun Dec 20 13:00:22 EST 1987
There have been two requests for hard disk info recently, and since I
can never figure out how to email to bitnet, I'll post a common
answer to both...
> I am interested in building a hard disk system based on something like
> the BMS ACSI to SCSI DMA converter. I would like to know what one would
> need besides the board (such as cables and type of hard disk system) to
> get a disk going. Also, what other boards are there like the BMS board?
>
> Bob
> also known as UD138985 at NDSUVM1.
> Has anyone had any experience with BMS and the package they sell that allows
> one to use a cheap IBM-PC style drive to hook to an Atari ST? I'm
> interested but would like more details about the BMS hardware and the prices
> and the difficulty involved in hooking everything up (oh and what other
> hardware, power supply, case, etc is needed)? Thanks . . .
> Adam
> engst@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu
I built my hard disk system this way because I already had most of the
parts. If you're going to buy everything from scratch, then the cost
may exceed that of the commercial hard disks. However, the home-built
type may be more flexible.
All the hard disks work like this: (this paragraph is open to correction
by more knowledgeable people!): the DMA output of the ST, known as ACSI,
feeds to an adapter board. This board converts the protocol to SCSI, a
standard disk interface protocol. The SCSI cable connects to the disk
controller. The Adaptec 4000-series controllers is usual. The
controller then connects to the disk. If you look inside the commercial
units, I think you will find this arrangement packed in there.
The disk drive can be almost any unit that uses the st406 or st512
interface. (Is that the right number? Anyway, same disks used by IBMs.)
You may be able to use a disk with an SCSI interface by omitting the
Adaptec controller, but I haven't seen it done.
By the way, the BMS adaptor board includes a battery operated clock,
and I haven't had to set the time since I put it together.
So, total parts are: ACSI cable from ST to adaptor, adaptor board
($140), 50-conductor SCSI cable to controller, controller board ($125?),
34- and 20-conductor cables to hard disk, disk ($300?), power supply
($50?), cabinet.
As mentioned in the posting, adaptor boards are available from Berkeley
Microsystems. I have also seen the adaptors from the commercial drives
available. Adaptec controllers are available from BMS and others.
Power supplies and cables can usually be found locally.
By the way, the Adaptec controller will support 2 hard disks. They must
be very similar, as there are some jumpers on the board which affect
both drives. Just make sure your power supply has enough reserve if you
plan to go this route.
My system started out as an outboard drive for IBM PC's. It included
the Adaptec controller (possibly damaged), and an Ampex Pyxis 13 10-meg
disk, and a blown power supply. I added a new supply, had the
controller checked out by Adaptec, bought the BMS board, and voila. I
have since upgraded to a Seagate ST238 20-meg drive, and I have enough
space and power to add another. (That's what I meant about being more
flexible.)
If seeing the insides of a computer makes you queasy, don't go this
route. If you think you can plug things together, this may be for you.
--
Gerry Wheeler Phone: (519)884-2251
Mortice Kern Systems Inc. UUCP: uunet!watmath!mks!wheels
43 Bridgeport Rd. E. BIX: join mks
Waterloo, Ontario N2J 2J4 CompuServe: 73260,1043
*************************************************************************
From !atari!daisy!turner Sun Dec 20 13:00:37 EST 1987
> Has anyone had any experience with BMS and the package they sell that allows
> one to use a cheap IBM-PC style drive to hook to an Atari ST? I'm
unless I'm sadly mistaken (and often I am) the BMS board set allows you
hook up any ST506 or ST224 (also mistakenly called SCSI) style disks to
the ST. The board set will work with disks with or without builtin SCSI
controllers. I presently use a single 64Mbyte disk with my BMS board set
but in the past I have hooked up 2 drives to the same board set and it worked
with no problems
--
Laissez les bons temps rouler - Queen Ida
...{decwrl|ucbvax}!imagen!atari!daisy!turner (James M. Turner)
Daisy Systems, 700 E. Middlefield Rd, P.O. Box 7006,
Mountain View CA 94039-7006. (415)960-0123
**************************************************************************
From !uw-entropy!dataio!pilchuck!ssc!fyl Wed Dec 23 22:02:36 EST 1987
I have tme BMS controller. It works fine (once we found the bugs but
that was almost a year ago). The only question I have about it is does
it actually cost less. You need to buy the interface and controller
($250, I think), then get a drive, box and power supply.
No problems putting it together but when you are done you probably
could have bought a Supra or Atari drive.
--
Phil Hughes, SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549, Seattle, WA 98155 (206)FOR-UNIX
uw-beaver!tikal!ssc!fyl or uunet!pilchuck!ssc!fyl or attmail!ssc!fyl
****************************************************************************
From !husc6!cmcl2!brl-adm!umd5!eneevax!iarocci Wed Dec 23 22:03:19 EST 1987
In article <3217@batcomputer.tn.cornell.edu> engst@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu (Adam C. Engst) writes:
>
>Has anyone had any experience with BMS and the package they sell that allows
>one to use a cheap IBM-PC style drive to hook to an Atari ST? I'm
I have seen the various replies to this original query and am amazed that
nobody even mentioned an alternative to BMS. Well... here goes:
Being the owner of two BMS kits (one for a Micropolis 1325 on a 1040, and one
for a Seagate ST506 on a 520+), I have seen how Berkley Microsystems has
improved over the last year or so. I think their present-day package is well
put together and easy to build. I have only had two reservations about the
kit: 1) The non-standard format used on the disks, and 2) THAT SHORT CORD!!
Until a recent (fairly) Atari Fest in the area, I was under the impression
that the BMS kit was the only one out there. At this fair, I was introduced
to ICD, Inc. (I don't know what it stands for.) and their ST Host/Controller
Kit. Among its advertised features are:
- built in battery backed-up clock
- 7 SCSI devices and daisy chaining
- 100% compatible with Atari and Supra
- built in verify and error retry
They answered my "short cord" problem with their three (3) foot cord!
Anyway, I was quite impressed with their presentation and brochures.
(If only I had known about them earlier...)
Finally, I'm not really knocking BMS. I'm letting you people out there
know there is an alternative.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Iarocci I am not affiliated with any company
Aerospace Engineering mentioned in the body of the message
University of Maryland above.
College Park, MD, USA
UUCP: [seismo,allegra]!umcp-cs!eneevax!iarocci
ARPA: iarocci@eneevax.umd.edu
*****************************************************************************
From: rochester!ames!atari!neil@cornell.UUCP (Neil Harris)
Subject: Re: Atari Repair Centers
Ooops, spoke too soon. The dealer in your area I know best is Software City
in Syracuse: 315-446-5321. According to my list, a store called Personal
Computers in Ithaca, 607-272-2831, is a 1040ST dealer -- not s
true?
Some others: Brighton Sound in Rochester, 716-328-1220; Amherst, Computer
Service Group. 716-839-1139; Fairport, Software House, 716-223-7658;
************************************************************************
From !seismo!uunet!mcvax!diku!iesd!judas Mon Dec 28 13:43:35 EST 1987
This is partially a retransmission of an earlier posting, but since I'm
not sure that the first posting got around, and there's been some talk
on the subject since then, here goes again.
In message <236@xrns.UUCP> Tom Love writes:
>hello out there... i hope i am not adding to the clamor of people
>crying out for help with 5.25" drives; this is actually a different
>question. i would like to have an external 3.5" DSDD floppy drive
>to go along with the one already inside my 1040ST. i do not, however,
>desire one bad enough to pay the $200 plus which atari dealers seem to
>want to charge. i do not mind a little hardware hacking, and don't
>mind scabby looking assemblies with wires hanging out all over them.
In message <8712211937.AA0147@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> Gregory Welych writes:
>I have had one of my disk drives die on me, and rather than try to get
>it fixed, (it was only a single sided drive anyways) I decided to
>buy a cheap(er?) double sided drive. I hooked the new drive into
>the little converter card inside an Atari drive, and connected
>the power supply up. It works fine except for one slight problem
>which can cause MAJOR problems with certain software.
>The problem is this:
> Say I boot up with disk A in drive A, and disk B in drive B.
> ( drive B is the new drive )
> Then after I get the desktop, I change drive B's disk to disk C.
> ( I have a window automatically opened for drive B on the desktop)
> Then I hit ESC to get the new directory, but it doesn't know
> I changed the disk. I am assuming that the disk drive has not reported
> media change to the ST so it doen't think that there might have been
> a switch.
>
>Now to my main question:
> What in the Atari drives senses the change of media?????????!!????
> And how does the drive signal this to the ST?????
>
>Thanks in advance for any help,
>
>Greg Welych.
A couple of months back, my 1040ST suddenly blew its internal
doublesided floppydrive. Since this was the only drive connected, it
was a disaster ! My beloved Babs was (almost) dead. She would
eventually boot, and come up with an empty desktop. That's a boring
game (it wasn't so :-) at the time). What went wrong, I don't know, I
tried plucking everything apart to check for any loose connections
etc., but no luck. A custom chip in the drive did get awfully hot
though.
To summarize, I found myself in a situation somewhat similar to yours:
I had to get a new drive somehow. Not wanting to pay for an original
Atari-drive, I came up with a reasonably cheap solution. A little
research revealed that the internal drive used a standard Shugart
interface (both in terms of signals AND connectors). So the problem
could be reduced to finding a (cheap) bare drive equipped with the
Shugart interface. That's easy enough. I picked a NEC-drive type
1036A, a drive known for its reliability and quiet operation. It's
also smaller than the original Ataridrive (which seems be from
Hitachi), so with a little fiddling I managed to get it crammed into
place. (I had to make some minor changes to the ST-case). The proof of
the pudding ? Well, I removed the old drive, plugged in the new one,
turned on the power, and Babs made a successfull boot from disc and
has been happily humming ever since.
So to connect another external drive, all it seems one has to do is:
A) Buy a bare drive.
B) Pick up the floppysignals from the ST's external floppy
interface. The connections are as shown (seen from the rear):
11 10 PIN SIGNAL INPUT/OUTPUT
1 read data i
9 8 2 side select o
13 12 3 gnd n.a
7 6 4 index i
14 5 drive 0 select + i
5 4 6 drive 1 select + i
7 gnd n.a
3 2 8 motor on o
1 9 direction o
10 step o
11 write data o
12 write gate o
13 track 00 i
14 write protect i
+ : On the 1040's external floppy interface, only the drive 0 select is
active. It carries the actual drive 1 select signal. That way
the external drive automatically becomes drive B.
The standard Shugart interface (again as seen from the rear) looks
like this:
___________________________________________________
/////////////////////////////////////////////////// <- Edge of
--------------------------------------------------- PCB
| 33 . . . . . . . . 1 |
| 34 . . . . . . . . 2 |
|----------------------|
PIN SIGNAL INPUT/OUTPUT PIN SIGNAL INPUT/OUTPUT
2 motor on 1 * i 18 direction i
4 in use * i 20 step i
6 drive select 3 * i 22 write data i
8 index o 24 write gate i
10 drive select 0 + i 26 track 00 o
12 drive select 1 + i 28 write protect o
14 motor on 2/ * i 30 read data o
drive select 2 32 side select i
16 motor on 0 i 34 ready * o
PIN 1-33 are all connected to ground (gnd).
*: Not used by the ST. +: Only one of these should be used. It
might be jumper-configurable which is the active input.
C) Supply the drive with some power. I'm not sure if an 1040's
internal supply can cope with two drives. However, since
3.5 inch drives have a low powerconsumption (my 1036A is
rated at 1.8 W), a simple 5/12 volts powersupply shouldn't
be so costly. The connections looks like this
_______________________
/////////////////////// <- Edge of PCB
-----------------------
| ____|-----|____ | 1: +5 v dc
| O O O O | 2: GND
------------------- 3: GND
1 2 3 4 4: +12 v dc
D) Add cabinet to your taste.
There's a tiny fly in the ointment, however. (There had to be, right?)
The VBL-interrupt routine in the ST, uses the status of the
WRITEPROTECT-line from the drive to check if the disc has been
ejected. Since the level of this signal is reflected in the
statusregister of the floppydisc-controller, all the VBL-routine has
to do is read the contents of this register from time to time. For
this system to function, the drive has to toggle its WRPROT-line in
some fashion (which i haven't bothered to figure out), whenever the
disc is ejected. This represented no problem in my case, since the
latest version (which was the one I used) of NEC FD1036A, is fully
"ST-modified" and thus plug-in-and-go compatible. I bought my drive in
W-Germany and payed around 220,- DM, which is VERY cheap by danish
standards. (#include<standardcomplaint.tax> :-( ).
Well, I have to stop rambling. Let's hear more about homebrewed
hardware-projects on this group. See you next time on the Newsshow.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
| "I hate silly citations" "The opinions expressed above are |
| Steen Kroyer hopefully not mine alone. Should |
| that however, be the case, it |
| only goes to show that I'm smar- |
| vWWWv ter than the rest of you. (:-)" |
| vWWWWWWWv |
| |/^^ ^^\| |
| O @ @ O judas@iesd.uucp (Steen Kroyer) |
| O L O |
| ( <O> ) <- I don't really look that silly !! |
| \_____/ |
|____________________________________________________________________|
***************************************************************************
From !ucbvax!decvax!decwrl!sgi!daisy!turner Mon Dec 28 13:43:59 EST 1987
>From article <945@ssc.UUCP>, by fyl@ssc.UUCP (Phil Hughes):
>
> I have tme BMS controller. It works fine (once we found the bugs but
> that was almost a year ago). The only question I have about it is does
> it actually cost less. You need to buy the interface and controller
> ($250, I think), then get a drive, box and power supply.
> No problems putting it together but when you are done you probably
> could have bought a Supra or Atari drive.
> --
> Phil Hughes, SSC, Inc. P.O. Box 55549, Seattle, WA 98155 (206)FOR-UNIX
> uw-beaver!tikal!ssc!fyl or uunet!pilchuck!ssc!fyl or attmail!ssc!fyl
agreeded, I alway felt the advantages of the BMS solution were:
1. It came with a battery backed-up real time clock
2. It supports two hard disks on the same controller
3. If and when i wanted to upgrade to a larger disk, i just unplugged
the old one and plugged the new one in
as to cost, be creative, most cities support at least one good used
electronic surplus/salvage store
--
Laissez les bons temps rouler - Queen Ida
...{decwrl|ucbvax}!imagen!atari!daisy!turner (James M. Turner)
Daisy Systems, 700 E. Middlefield Rd, P.O. Box 7006,
Mountain View CA 94039-7006. (415)960-0123
*************************************************************************
From rochester!bbn!uwmcsd1!lakesys!rich Mon Dec 28 13:44:49 EST 1987
In article <1606@brahma.cs.hw.ac.uk> neil@cs.hw.ac.uk (Neil Forsyth) writes:
>
>Boo hoo the disk drive on my 1040ST is not working. I know it is the drive
>because I have swapped it in other machines and the problem moved with the
>drive. The symptoms are strange in that it reads every track on a disk fine
>but has trouble writing. I say trouble because sometime it formats a track
>ok sometimes not, but never a whole disk. I had a look at a track it had tried
>to format and found corruption (gap bytes inconsistant & data damaged ie $E5
>corrupted.) If I can't fix this drive I will have to buy a replacement and
>that will kill my slim chance of being able to afford a hard drive.
>I phoned a company that upgrades the internal SS drive in a 520STFM to DS and
>asked if the same drive could be fitted inside a 1040. They said no, which I
>think is pretty strange since I thought (as most do) that the 520STFM was
>just a 1040 with a lesser drive and some RAM missing. Has anyone else put a
>different drive in their 1040 or repaired the original one?
>If so please advise me.
>(Note: Our machines will be down(ish) from 24th Dec to Jan 5th)
I have replaced the 1040 drives with the newer mech's that are
currently shipped as external drives. Have had no problem with doing this
at all.
If I were you, I would clean the head with Freon TF, and get all the
dust that usually seems to collect inside the drive. This is the main problem
that I have seen in the internal drives, other than the eairly drives having
the write protect to go out, in which case I replaced it with a small micro
toggle switch.
I have seen drives that were running slow, and still read the data
onthe disk fine, but didn't write for ^%$#*( . Also have seen some drives
that didn't write well either and the cause was due to a mechanical problem
with a lever mounted for upper head pressure. Problem was due to this lever
being a little loose and thus making alot of noise (like ball bearings inside)
and just getting this a little tighter lessened the vibrations allowing the
drive to again work well.
One other thing that I noticed was that some drives, lost the
ability to turn the disk at proper speed *if the drive was sitting in the
correct position. When I went and turned the drive over (upside down) to
further look at the problem, the problem was gone! Turn the drive back over
and the problem returned, turn it upside down, and the drive worked fine
again. Weird problem. Unfortunatly, the direct drive motor for turning the
media is not available from Atari, so a new drive was installed. One of the
newer external ones. Problem solved....
>
> Neil Forsyth JANET: neil@uk.ac.hw.cs
> Dept. of Computer Science ARPA: neil@cs.hw.ac.uk
> Heriot-Watt University UUCP: ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!neil
> Edinburgh
> Scotland
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
UUCP: {Ihnp4,uwvax}!uwmcsd1!lakesys!rich
Discalimer: The words,ideas,and expressions are my own, and not nessasarily
always correct, but I wouldn't say that I have done it if I didn't.
****************************************************************************
From: percival!actor@uunet.UU.NET (Clif Swinford)
Subject: Re: general info on disk drives wanted
From my experience, the Astra is a loser. I work in a store where we sell
Atari, Supra, and Astra hard drives; that's my order of preference, too.
The Astra (at least in our store) sells for the same price as an Atari hard
disk and a separate Atari SF314 drive. We've had nothing but trouble with
the Astra's floppy, so much so that we've taken to leaving the floppy on our
floor model unconnected so as to keep it from destroying disks. The hard disk
is a good one, but so are the others, and you can get an Atari or Supra 20
meg drive plus an Indus floppy for less money, and if one dies you don't
have to take both into the shop.
--
Clif Swinford
..!tektronix!reed!percival!actor fnord
*****************************************************************************
From !seismo!uunet!portal!atari!apratt Thu Dec 31 12:32:29 EST 1987
in article <8712211937.AA01474@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>,
gjwelych@SUNRISE.ACS.SYR.EDU ("Welych, Gregory J.") says:
> What in the Atari drives senses the change of media?
> And how does the drive signal this to the ST?
The media-change sensing is done using the write-protect signal from the
drive. The assumption is that when you take a write-enabled disk
out of the drive, the write-protect sensor will pop up, and the drive
will signal "write protect" to the controller. When you put another
disk (or even the same disk) in the drive, the write-protect sensor
will be pushed down again and signal "not write protect."
When a disk is really write protected, of course, there will be no
transition on the line. Because of this, write-protected disks go
into the "maybe changed" state 1 sec (I think) after the last disk
access. (The assumption is that you won't change from one write
protected disk to another within one second).
When a disk is in the "maybe changed" state, the next access (through
RWABS or maybe Floprd) will check the serial number of the disk in the
drive. If it hasn't changed, then the disk hasn't changed, either.
This is another assupmtion: you should not have two disks with the same
serial number.
If your drive suppresses write protect changes when there is no disk
present, then switching from one write-enabled disk to another will not
cause the transition, and the BIOS will not sense media change.
Sorry. Nobody said it would be easy.
============================================
Opinions expressed above do not necessarily -- Allan Pratt, Atari Corp.
reflect those of Atari Corp. or anyone else. ...ames!atari!apratt
****************************************************************************
From !husc6!mit-eddie!apollo!weber_w Thu Dec 31 12:32:42 EST 1987
In article <1147@eneevax.UUCP> iarocci@eneevax.umd.edu.UUCP (John Iarocci) writes:
>
>Being the owner of two BMS kits (one for a Micropolis 1325 on a 1040, and one
>for a Seagate ST506 on a 520+), I have seen how Berkley Microsystems has
>improved over the last year or so. I think their present-day package is well
>put together and easy to build. I have only had two reservations about the
>kit: 1) The non-standard format used on the disks, and 2) THAT SHORT CORD!!
>
>Until a recent (fairly) Atari Fest in the area, I was under the impression
>that the BMS kit was the only one out there. At this fair, I was introduced
>to ICD, Inc.
I, too, am a VERY SATISFIED customer of BMS. My opinions of the ICD offering
differ somewhat from yours, however.
I saw ICD's product at the Worcester AtariFest, and while I think they have
an acceptable product, I believe that their methods are less than acceptable.
My local Atari dealer (exclusively Atari for the last 4+ years) tells me that
ICD has been present in the 8-bit marketplace for a considerable time.
My contact at BMS, however, told me that ICD initially contacted BMS with a
great deal of interest in the BMS board, and assured BMS that ICD was not
going to get into that business. A short while later, ICD released a board
which has a strong resemblance to the BMS board with a few modifications.
Note that I am NOT advocating sole-sourcing of add-ons for the ST line -- I
just do NOT like the idea of an "established" company staying out of the ST
marketplace until (or unless) they can piggyback off of the efforts of a
fledgling operation by misrepresenting their intentions.
As to your first reservation (above), BMS follows the Atari standard of only
allowing 4 partitions per drive, while Supra established an "extended
format" which permits 8 partitions per drive, but is NOT compatible with
Atari's AHDI. ICD follows the Supra extended format. I think if you go
back to Tom Love's excellent article in a back issue of Current Notes you
will find that BMS did not have a disk driver of their own, and that users
would just use Atari's formatter (format.prg?) and driver (ahdi.prg).
...walt...
--
Walt Weber PHONE: (617) 256-6600 x7004
Apollo Computer GENIE: W.WEBER
Chelmsford, People's Republic of Massachusetts
***********************************************************************
From rochester!rocksanne!xrxns!xerox12!toml Thu Dec 31 12:32:51 EST 1987
re: bugs in bms package -
i've been running a bms-based hard disk system since last january.
the only bugs i have ever encountered were software bugs. recall that
the bms adapter board has a battery-backed clock. it seems that chris
rhodin, the guy who runs bms and does the development, made a very small
but important error in the clock-setting program (settime.prg, i think -
the one that goes in your auto folder) which screwed up on february.
actually it was kind of humorous. never affected hard disk use at all.
he found the problem feb. 1 1987, and had updated software out in the mail
to everyone shortly thereafter.
i'm mainly posting this to stop what could be a harmful rumor. i am a
very satisfied customer of berkeley microsystems. their product is
reasonably priced, in my opinion, and their telephone support is superb
(of course, before they had any documentation, it had to be! :-)
the bms-100 adapter has evolved somewhat; it is supposedly laid out more
attractively on the board, it is pretty well documented, the software has
all been rewritten. it's a pretty mature product now.
if there were hardware bugs, i would be interested in hearing about them.
if not, please don't do bms any disservice by spreading such rumors.
one more note: i wrote an article for ST Applications magazine last spring
detailing the construction of a bms-based hard disk system for the ST.
it covers all the details of a single-HD system, and vaguely addresses
the double-HD system too (at that time i only had one HD). it appeared
in march 87, i think. at that time i offered to mail out copies, in
either electronic or paper form, to anyone who requested one. that
offer still stands. note that the electronic form omits the graphics
(done on my cad system at work, not on the st), so if you want the whole
thing you should buy the magazine or request the paper copy from me.
if you want electronic, mail me at the address below; if you want paper,
send me a self-addressed stamped envelope to the postal address below.
tom love
Xerox Engineering Design and Documentation Systems
Leesburg, VA 22075 (703)729-8000
{cornell, kodak, ritcv, rutgers, cmcl2, llxn}!rochester!
rocksanne!xrxns!toml
{rocksvax, sunybcs}!
rt 2, box 277
sterling, va 22170
*****************************************************************************
From !mnetor!utzoo!yunexus!gen1!chris Thu Dec 31 12:39:26 EST 1987
I have noticed a few requests on the net for information regarding
hard drives, hard drive kits, and the like for the ST. I have just
purchased a "TAMI-HD40" hard drive system from FutureDOS, and am *very*
happy with it so far.
I own an Atari Mega-2 ST and required a larger disk capacity in order
to run GEM, Magic Sac, and OS-9/68000 efficiently. The single drive system I
received from FutureDOS is in a long enclosure that is designed to accommodate
a second half height drive.
Since the system is custom made, I ordered the 44 Mb (formatted) hard
disk configuration, for which I paid $1400 Cdn.. Other capacities are
available upon request. Also, all of the hard drive systems are fully
assembled and tested, so reliability is assured.
If you are looking for a high quality/high capacity hard drive system
at a reasonable price, then this may be the thing for you. You can
reach the folks at FutureDOS by writing them at
FutureDOS,
1207-120 Torresdale Ave.,
North York, Ontario,
CANADA, M2R 3N7.
Tel. (416) 736-0321
Christopher Parkinson
yunexus!gen1!yuplanet!chris
BTW-Standard disclaimer...I am in no way affiliated with FutureDOS, I am
just another happy customer!!!
*************************************************************************
--
Adam C. Engst engst@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu
pv9y@cornella.bitnet
"If it's not interactive fiction, it's not fun."