rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) (04/20/88)
----
thought you'd be interested in this item:
In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes:
->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to
->give me a copy, I was wondering wether or not there are other people on
->usenet who have experience with the ST version. If you have, please mail
->me! Thanx in advance :-)
->
-> Jan Joris Vereijken
->
-> wsinjj@eutrc3.uucp
-> rcst14@heitue5.bitnet
[ from Neth. ]
no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/
have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque
subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling
in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^)
-billgood@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) (04/21/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > > In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes: > ->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to > ->give me a copy, I was wondering wether or not there are other people on > ->usenet who have experience with the ST version. If you have, please mail > ->me! Thanx in advance :-) > -> Jan Joris Vereijken > [ from Neth. ] > > no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/ > have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque > subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling > in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^) > -bill Please be aware of the facts before flaming Atari! [:-)] I suspect that JJV got a bootleg copy from the developers, since he lives in Holland. Atari also has an advance copy, thanks to the kind cooperation of Andy Tanenbaum himself. There is no question of Atari "holding back" Minix from the US market - Atari has absolutely no control over Minix. As Andy Tanenbaum recently informed all readers of this topic, Minix has been handed over to Prentice-Hall, who have sole rights to distribute the product. Minix/ST is, I believe, to be released by P-H in the summer, at which time anyone is free to buy a copy from your friendly P-H distribution outlet. As a separate comment, yes, sure, Atari IS pulling in mega$$$ (was a pun intended here?) from Europe. And thanks to the mega$$$ also pulled in from sales in the US, business is good all over! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Roy J. Good Product Development, Atari Corporation Views expressed are my own. Atari may agree or disagree; they have the right. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) (04/22/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > ---- > > thought you'd be interested in this item: > > > In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes: > ->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to > ->give me a copy, I was wondering wether or not there are other people on > ->usenet who have experience with the ST version. If you have, please mail > ->me! Thanx in advance :-) > -> > -> Jan Joris Vereijken > -> > -> wsinjj@eutrc3.uucp > -> rcst14@heitue5.bitnet > > [ from Neth. ] Yes I said this... Although some people *do* have ST Minix, it is not available (yet?) to the masses. It was kinda stupid from me to put this out in the public, but I was only trying to find some fellow-ST'ers using it. I was *NOT* announcing "ST Minix has arrived, go get it". So please don't mail me to get it, especially don't mail Tanenbaum, because he lives quite nextdoor to me (that's why I got it in the first place :-) and he might kill me or do other compatible nasty things..... - *SORRY* folx! _my_ fault... - Jan Joris Vereijken wsinjj@eutrc3.uucp rcst14@heitue5.bitnet Ps: Maybe, just maybe, I'm allowed to tell all you Minix-hungry ST'ers that Minix might, just might, be available soon. (maybe)
neil@cs.hw.ac.uk (Neil Forsyth) (04/22/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM> rosenkra@alliant.UUCP (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: >no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/ >have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque >subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling >in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^) No disrespect here either but when I bought my ST I thought that because it's a US computer I would see very little info/products/hacks/etc. I was pleasantly surprised. Even more so when we saw the Atari Laser Printer,PC and the all American "Gauntlet" (I laughed until a boulder hit me on the head :-). But who got Landon Dyer's MADMAC assembler and Allan Pratts ALN Linker first? I spent the best part of a year trying get these. When Allan's new ROMs finally appear who'll have them first? The USA probably. I am chewing the carpet here waiting for them (any chance of an ETA Allan). Also unless you understand German most of the great ST info/.. is nbg anyway. (No doubt the above comments are a flameable offence :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "I think all right thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I'm certainly not and I'm sick and tired of being told that I am!" - Monty Python Neil Forsyth JANET: neil@uk.ac.hw.cs Dept. of Computer Science ARPA: neil@cs.hw.ac.uk Heriot-Watt University UUCP: ..!ukc!cs.hw.ac.uk!neil Edinburgh Scotland -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
jsp@sp7040.UUCP (John Peters) (04/23/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > thought you'd be interested in this item: > > In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes: > ->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to > ->give me a copy, I was wondering wether or not there are other people on > ->usenet who have experience with the ST version. If you have, please mail > ->me! Thanx in advance :-) > -> > no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/ > have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque > subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling > in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^) > > -bill This may be true but there is a reason for this particular situation. Minix was and is still being developed at the University of Amsterdam by Andrew Tanenbaum. If there is a copy of ST-Minix floating around there I am sure it is still a beta copy. When I asked in December about ST-Minix Andrew sent a message to me saying it will be out sometime in the late spring. I eagerly await its arival but I would rather have one with most of the bugs fixed and not a beta version. As a side note, I got a file of of comp.os.minix awhile back that had a lot of fixes in it for the PC version. In it it stated that they were fixes that were discovered while doing the ST port. Give it just a couple more months and then we can do away with TOS. Hope this information helped. -- Johnnie --
wes@obie.UUCP (Barnacle Wes) (04/24/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes: > ->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to > > no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/ > have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque > subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling > in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^) Atari had little or nothing to do with Minix for the ST. ST Minix was written by Andy Tanenbaum and his students at VU Informatica (which is in the Netherlands, BTW) and so it would obviously work its way into users hand there first. M. Vereyken's friend might well be one of the developers! On the other hand, I do agree about Atari's strategies regarding Europe and the USA. I don't mind them announcing everything at the Hannover Fair, as opposed to Comdex or the CES, but to sell everything in Europe for MONTHS before it comes out here is irritating. Perhaps the Tramiels don't realize part of the reason the US market is so unfriendly to their company is that their company is so unfriendly to the US market! -- /\ - "Against Stupidity, - {backbones}! /\/\ . /\ - The Gods Themselves - utah-cs!utah-gr! / \/ \/\/ \ - Contend in Vain." - uplherc!sp7040! / U i n T e c h \ - Schiller - obie!wes
wes@@@e.UUCP (Barnacle Wes) (04/24/88)
In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > In article <203@eutrc3.UUCP> wsinjj@eutrc3.UUCP (Jan Joris Vereyken) writes: > ->Because of friend of mine has Minix for the Atari ST, and promised me to > > no disrepect intended but how come the people in europe always seem to know/ > have more info/products/hacks/etc for the ST than us poor picturesque > subhumanoids in the brain-drain states? sheesh, atari must REALLY be pulling > in mega$$$ from across the swamp. at least it helps our GNP/trade deficit :^) Atari had little or nothing to do with Minix for the ST. ST Minix was written by Andy Tanenbaum and his students at VU Informatica (which is in the Netherlands, BTW) and so it would obviously work its way into users hand there first. M. Vereyken's friend might well be one of the developers! On the other hand, I do agree about Atari's strategies regarding Europe and the USA. I don't mind them announcing everything at the Hannover Fair, as opposed to Comdex or the CES, but to sell everything in Europe for MONTHS before it comes out here is irritating. Perhaps the Tramiels don't realize part of the reason the US market is so unfriendly to their company is that their company is so unfriendly to the US market! -- /\ - "Against Stupidity, - {backbones}! /\/\ . /\ - The Gods Themselves - utah-cs!utah-gr! / \/ \/\/ \ - Contend in Vain." - uplherc!sp7040! / U i n T e c h \ - Schiller - e.Ue!wes #
bw0i+@andrew.cmu.edu (Bryan Wu) (04/25/88)
Is there any way of hooking up the ST to AppleTalk networks while using
Magic Sac?
& Is there any student programs for the ST - cause Macintosh does, a lot
of people have Macs here.
& since talent is coming out of colleges, if they use STs when they
come out, they'll write for STs
later.. eh? - a cheaper Mac than a college bought Mac is what we need.rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) (04/27/88)
-----
just a followup to my original post regarding minix/ST:
a) i kinda figured the pre-pre-announcement about minix on the ST was either
from a close contact to the developer(s), and obviously not the _REAL_
thing. i just wanted to let everyone know that "it's on its way..."
b) there was no ill thoughts whatsoever on my part in this matter with
respect to either atari, our friends in europe, or anyone else for that
matter. i'm actually glad that the ST is doing so well in europe, since
that means that ST developers can make some $$$ of their own, if their
products get to europe.
c) i know that atari probably has no ties at all to andy tannenbaum, other
than perhaps interest in the project.
d) i, and alot of other people out there _STILL_ have legit gripes with
atari on other matters.
e) i really like my ST. it generally runs circles around my more expensive
XT clone (512k, 20 MB HD, 360k floppy, no 8087). it has to be the best
buy around, still. we just want it better, that's all (so there,
mr. good!!!)
looky here, smiley faces {:-> !:^) [8-o so no flames, pls...
-billgood@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) (04/28/88)
In article <1655@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > > ----- > just a followup to my original post regarding minix/ST: > > [deleted, not because they weren't good points, but to save space] > > looky here, smiley faces {:-> !:^) [8-o so no flames, pls... > > -bill My sincere thanks for your posting, Bill. Your comments are appreciated, and Atari wants to improve the products too. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Roy J. Good Product Development, Atari Corporation Views expressed are my own. Atari may agree or disagree; they have the right. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
kimes@ihlpe.ATT.COM (Kit Kimes) (04/28/88)
In article <165@obie.UUCP>, wes@obie.UUCP (Barnacle Wes) writes: > In article <1615@alliant.Alliant.COM>, rosenkra@Alliant.COM (Bill Rosenkranz) writes: > > On the other hand, I do agree about Atari's strategies regarding Europe > and the USA. I don't mind them announcing everything at the Hannover > Fair, as opposed to Comdex or the CES, but to sell everything in > Europe for MONTHS before it comes out here is irritating. Atari doesn't announce everything in Europe. Below is an article that appeared in EE Times (printed without permission) that came out of a desk top publishing show right here in good old Chicago, USA. ATARI ADOPTS IMAGEN POSTSCRIPT SOFTWARE CLONE FOR LASER PRINTER "Desktop publishing for Atari computer users got much easier last week, with Atari's public showing of a PostScript laser printer software clone. The software, dubbed UltraScript, enables Atari's laser printer to produce documents that are formatted and structured in Adobe's PostScript page description language. Insiders say that Adobe normally demands a royalty of about $100 per printer for PostScript licensees. That was too steep for Atari, which markets an under-$2000, 300-dpi laser printer. But because Atari's printer receives its pixel-page generation commands from the 68000-based ST or Mega host, a PostScript-like interpreter can command the printer to act like a PostScript hardware device. That's where Imagen (San Jose, CA) comes in. The QMS subsidiary has long had its own proprietary text and graphical rotation routines. Now, it has developed a fast interpreter which Atari engineers say is actually faster than Adobe's own in many instances. The UltraScript package comes on a single Atari diskette, allowing the computer to perform PostScript-like image on the fly. Normally, PostScript is licensed in ROM form, as pioneered in Apple's Laser- Writer printer three years ago. A RAM-image UltraScript interpreter works for Atari because its laser-printer commands stem from the host computer. That allows Atari--and third-party desktop publishing companies--to exploit PostScript's curve-generation prowess. Third-party desktop publishing was the theme at Atari's Corporate Electronic Publishing Systems booth last week. Several publishers said they intend to offer UltraScript support this summer. Atari will show the UltraScript system at Comdex this spring, and hope to ship the software "at low cost" in mid-summer." Kit Kimes AT&T--Information Systems Labs ...ihnp4!ihlpe!kimes
wheels@mks.UUCP (Gerry Wheeler) (05/06/88)
In article <382@sp7040.UUCP>, jsp@sp7040.UUCP (John Peters) writes: > I think I hear another vote for a "comp.os.minix.atari" sig on > the net. Your sentaments are stongly echoed here. I would like to propose > not only the new sig but maybe a group to coordinate developement of public > domain utilities under Minix. I seems to me that the ST-Minix community would > benifit from coordinated development instead of 15 people working on versions\ > of the same thing. I agree 100% about ST Minix, but do you really think we need a new group already? Shouldn't we co-exist with the IBM Minix users for a while so we can learn from them? There isn't so much traffic in comp.os.minix that we need separate groups, I don't think. The IBM folks might get a little jealous of our "large model" compiler though :-). Maybe this discussion should be repeated in the minix group before doing anything. -- Gerry Wheeler Phone: (519)884-2251 Mortice Kern Systems Inc. UUCP: uunet!watmath!mks!wheels 35 King St. North BIX: join mks Waterloo, Ontario N2J 2W9 CompuServe: 73260,1043
bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu (Jwahar R. Bammi) (10/09/88)
FYI: For all who have been waiting (with baited breath) for ST Minix,
Prentice Hall is now shipping.
Order # 013584391
(201)767-5937 ((800)223-2336 i think - lost my little slip)
US price: $79.95 + shipping
--
--
usenet: {decvax,sun}!cwjcc!bammi jwahar r. bammi
csnet: bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu
arpa: bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu
compuServe: 71515,155bds@lzaz.ATT.COM (B.SZABLAK) (10/10/88)
In article <126@cwjcc.CWRU.Edu>, bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu (Jwahar R. Bammi) writes: > FYI: For all who have been waiting (with baited breath) for ST Minix, > Prentice Hall is now shipping. Great! Would someone be kind enough to do a review for the net? I have some basic questions: What does $79.95 buy you? Is it useable on a 520 (.5 Meg with single sided floppy)? Does it support hard disks (and if so with any restrictions)? Does the compiler support 32 bit pointers; 32 bit integers? What are differences between the ST version and the PC version? How long does it take to rebuild the system (please mention the configuration used). How robust is it? Thanks in advance for any info.
n62@nikhefh.hep.nl (Klamer Schutte) (10/11/88)
In article <241@lzaz.ATT.COM> bds@lzaz.ATT.COM (B.SZABLAK) writes: >In article <126@cwjcc.CWRU.Edu>, bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu (Jwahar R. Bammi) writes: >> FYI: For all who have been waiting (with baited breath) for ST Minix, >> Prentice Hall is now shipping. > >Great! Would someone be kind enough to do a review for the net? I have >some basic questions: > What does $79.95 buy you? > Is it useable on a 520 (.5 Meg with single sided floppy)? > Does it support hard disks (and if so with any restrictions)? > Does the compiler support 32 bit pointers; 32 bit integers? > What are differences between the ST version and the PC version? > How long does it take to rebuild the system (please mention the > configuration used). > How robust is it? I have a pre-release of MINIX-ST; I don't know about difference's For $79.95 you get the running system with a lot of commands ( as pc version 1.2) ( I think ). It is usable with 520k & single floppy ( it says ). I run it on a 1040 with 1 720k floppy; because of MINIX i am thinking about buying a hard disk ( but i am a poor student ... ). It does support hard disks, but standard only standard atari. The compiler does support 32 pointers; 16 bit int, 32 bit long, float & double ( length not checked ). He produces really object files, not assembly as MINIX-PC. The main differences with MINIX-PC: support large model; different fork. The fork in MINIX-ST is strange: you make a copy of your text segment and this text segment is 'swapped' in memory between parent and child process; this is no problem supposing the child does quickly a exec() or the parent does a wait(). The time to rebuilt the system: On my system for the kernel some hours; the second change-compile-link-restart about 1/2 hour. rebuilding all the commands will take very long ( I haven't tried ). The system is robust, I have not seen it crash. -- ________________________________________________________________________________ Klamer Schutte mcvax!nikhefh!n62 n62@nikhefh.hep.nl
jw@owf.UUCP (Juerg Wanner) (10/14/88)
In article <547@nikhefh.hep.nl> n62@nikhefh.hep.nl (Klamer Schutte) writes: >a poor student ... ). It does support hard disks, but standard only standard I run MINIX with a vortex hard disk which is not really standard although it understands the same commands (and some more ..). No problems with that. >The main differences with MINIX-PC: support large model; different fork. >The fork in MINIX-ST is strange: you make a copy of your text segment and this >text segment is 'swapped' in memory between parent and child process Well, this should obviously say data+stack NOT text. The text segment can be shared. >The system is robust, I have not seen it crash. I can second that. Juerg Wanner OWF AG
hyc@math.lsa.umich.edu (Howard Chu) (10/18/88)
In article <241@lzaz.ATT.COM> bds@lzaz.ATT.COM (B.SZABLAK) writes: >In article <126@cwjcc.CWRU.Edu>, bammi@dsrgsun.ces.CWRU.edu (Jwahar R. Bammi) writes: >> FYI: For all who have been waiting (with baited breath) for ST Minix, >> Prentice Hall is now shipping. > >Great! Would someone be kind enough to do a review for the net? I have >some basic questions: > What does $79.95 buy you? > Is it useable on a 520 (.5 Meg with single sided floppy)? > Does it support hard disks (and if so with any restrictions)? > Does the compiler support 32 bit pointers; 32 bit integers? > What are differences between the ST version and the PC version? > How long does it take to rebuild the system (please mention the > configuration used). > How robust is it? > >Thanks in advance for any info. You might want to start reading comp.os.minix from now on... A few observations - I have a Supra 20 meg hard drive, (Miniscribe 8425S) which I am now using with Minix. The software release (Supra's) is 3.20. I used to have a much older release, which created partition information that Minix was unable to recognize. This is no longer a problem with the latest formatter & such from Supra. The hard disk driver supports up to 4 partitions per disk, up to 8 controllers, two disks per controller. The distributed system only supports SCSI 0, unit 0. You must rebuild the system to support additional drives. The floppy driver supports 2 single or double sided drives. The driver is written such that it reads regular TOS formatted disks at highest speed; I've been using Twister format disks but they read much more slowly. (However, I suspect the boot disk uses TOS to load, because it loads much more quickly in Twister format.) The driver seems to be able to read any format TOS will, i.e., 82 track, 10 sector/track works just fine. Other people have answered the other questions, so I'll stop here... -- / /_ , ,_. Howard Chu / /(_/(__ University of Michigan / Computing Center College of LS&A ' Unix Project Information Systems
jeff@polyof.UUCP (A1 jeff giordano ) (10/18/88)
[hey Mr Line Eater, try to snort this line!!!] I have a 1040st color system, BMS SCSI board, and a seagate ST506 hard disk. Does any one know if ST MINIX will work with the BMS board? Please E-mail replies, I will post a summary. Geoffrey Giordano Student at the hell that is known as Polytechnic. INET: jeff@polyof.poly.edu UUCP: ...!trixie!polyof!jeff
jeff@polyof.UUCP (A1 jeff giordano ) (10/25/88)
[Mr Line Eater, try to snort this line] A week or so back I posted a question asking if the BMS hard disk board would work with ST-MINIX. I got two replies, both have good news, they are as follows: (edited of course) >From Vance Chin of Berkley Microsystems: > We have not tried Minix ST with the BMS-100. Our board emulates >the SH204 hard drive host adapter so it should work. > The only thing I'm wondering about is if Minix has it's own formatter >or if it just uses the format the ST uses. > >Vance Chin @ Berkeley Microsystems >From Gerry Wheeler >Yes, it works fine. I'm using a 520 with 1 meg, colour monitor, BMS >controller with two ST225 drives. As supplied, MINIX knows about 1 SCSI >controller with one drive having up to four partitions. However, by >altering a couple of constants and recompiling it will handle up to >eight controllers with two drives each. > >At the moment, I have four partitions on my first drive -- 2 meg for >GEM's C: drive (for accessories, etc.), 1 meg for GEM's D: drive, 1 meg >for MINIX root file system, and 16 meg for MINIX working. My other disk >has two partitions for GEM. By installing disk icons for only drives C, >D, G, and H, I can prevent GEM from writing on the MINIX partitions. > >MINIX does not have any 16 meg limit on partition sizes, but the BMS >software won't create a partition larger than that. However, one of >MINIX's devices references the entire (unpartitioned) disk, so I think >I'll make the changes to MINIX, and then dedicate my whole second drive >to it. > -- > Gerry Wheeler Phone: (519)884-2251 >Mortice Kern Systems Inc. UUCP: uunet!watmath!mks!wheels > 35 King St. North BIX: join mks >Waterloo, Ontario N2J 2W9 CompuServe: 73260,1043 > Vance and Gerry: Thank you very much for your input. Geoffrey Giordano INET: jeff@polyof.poly.edu UUCP: ...trixie!polyof!jeff Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder. Line counter fodder.
meulenbr@cst.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) (10/26/88)
I also can confirm that Minix/ST runs in combination with the BMS-100 controller. However, I'd like to access the clock from the BMS-100 from within Minix. Does anyone have such a program, (or source from a TOS program) or can anyone supply info about how to achieve this? Many thanks! -- Frans Meulenbroeks (meulenbr@cst.prl.philips.nl) Centre for Software Technology ( or try: ...!mcvax!philmds!prle!cst!meulenbr)