meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) (11/01/88)
Hi! Yesterday I had a brief glance on a german magazine called "68000 ST magazin" or something like that. They had a 2 page article on the TT and TT/X, together with a functional schematic with the name Roy Good on it. The specs were as follows: Two different machines: the TT being the low entry model, the TT/X being the Unix box. Only difference I saw wat that the TT had 2 MB ram and the TT/X had 4 MB ram. The rest seemed alike. The figures: 68030 processor at 16 Mhz optionally 68881/2 Yamaha sound chip. DMA port (ACSI) SCSI port MIDI interface same multifunction chip VME bus with 5 free slots (on all models?) extendible to or with 8 MB (internally without using a slot). Some slow lan (not a 10 Mhz Ethernet). Monochrome monitor: 1280 * 960 pixels. Als 6 or 7 different color res. 3.5" floppy wiht 2MB raw date (1.44 MB formatted) Software (Unix box) BSD 4.3 ksh NFS X/Windows NOT PRESENT (despite all rumours) Signal processor, A/D D/A converter Delivery: to selected developers: end '88 customer introduction: in Germany at the Cebit (March/April '89) Unknown: price customer delivery Miscellaneous: The memory path to the video was 64 bit wide. My questions: Can someone (perhaps from Germany) supply additional info. Will atari (Roy, Allen?) confirm/deny this? (And perhaps fill in the details) Will there be a different tos/030, or will the same os run on both ST and TT? Is this thing running tos 1.4 or should we expect another version soon? Will this box be shown at Comdex/Fall? Wrap-up: I don't have any more info, so PLEASE don't ask. I just scribbled this on the back of an envelope from the mag. PS: anyone interested in bying a 1040 with 68020/68881 ?? -- Frans Meulenbroeks (meulenbr@cst.prl.philips.nl) Centre for Software Technology ( or try: ...!mcvax!philmds!prle!cst!meulenbr)
good@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) (11/03/88)
in article <252@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: > > Yesterday I had a brief glance on a german magazine called > "68000 ST magazin" or something like that. > They had a 2 page article on the TT and TT/X, together with a > functional schematic with the name Roy Good on it. [rest of posting deleted] The only 'block diagram' that I have produced (via EasyDraw!) for the TT is one which was given to certain subsidiaries as a preliminary view of current architectural thinking at the time. Specs' have changed since that draft, so as I said last week, don't believe what you read in the press!! As a VERY important aside, that diagram (as with all my similar documentation) was very clearly marked: "Atari Corporation - Company Confidential". Its reproduction is clearly a betrayal of that confidentiality, and of the trust with which I released it to the subsidiaries. I will certainly follow up on how this information could be published, and it must make you realize why I am so reticent to post or release ANY preproduction information. It is no wonder that Atari, and others, get a poor image in public when journalists publish preliminary or confidential information which has every right to be changed without notification. I have tried to keep this net, at least, reasonably well informed without making details or schedules public which I do not feel certain are yet definitive. Even if the information was obtained through apparently legitimate channels, I believe that the writer should by now be sensitive to the effect of publishing prerelease data, and should therefore have taken the step of verifying its accuracy and timeliness with Atari Sunnyvale. I realize I may be having a stronger reaction to this than may be warranted, but I see so much traffic on the net spreading and modifying rumors which are unsubstantiated (and more than often flat out misleading or totally wrong). The energy which we expend in trying to straighten out the mess could be much more usefully applied in resolving some of the issues of product development and support which REALLY need addressing. By all means read these articles, but please do not accept them as gospel (or whatever your personal religious equivalent may be) unless and until an official product announcement is generally released by Atari Sunnyvale. Roy Good/Atari Sunnyvale
meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) (11/04/88)
[Sorry, I could not let this pass. I've trimmed Roy's article. read the original if you want all the details] WARNING: flames ahead. In article <1216@atari.UUCP> good@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) writes: >in article <252@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: >> >> Yesterday I had a brief glance on a german magazine called >> "68000 ST magazin" or something like that. >> They had a 2 page article on the TT and TT/X, together with a >> functional schematic with the name Roy Good on it. >[rest of posting deleted] >The only 'block diagram' that I have produced (via EasyDraw!) for the TT is Ah! So there is really such a thing as a TT! [...] >As a VERY important aside, that diagram (as with all my similar documentation) >was very clearly marked: "Atari Corporation - Company Confidential". Its It did not say so in the magazine. [...] >It is no wonder that Atari, and others, get a poor image in public when >journalists publish preliminary or confidential information >which has every right to be changed without notification. I have tried to >keep this net, at least, reasonably well informed without making details >or schedules public which I do not feel certain are yet definitive. There is no way, for me to determine whether or not the information was confidential. Also recall that I added the string "rumour?" to the subject line. I just thought Germany was a little ahead of us (like often happens with Atari stuff). >Even if the information was obtained through apparently legitimate channels, >I believe that the writer should by now be sensitive to the effect of >publishing prerelease data, and should therefore have taken the step of >verifying its accuracy and timeliness with Atari Sunnyvale. I just reported what I read elsewhere, mentioning my source. I am NOT and I don't feel obliged to verify this with Atari Sunnyvale. I don't know for your side of the big water, but at THIS side has something constitutional called freedom of press and speech. In other words: next time I probably will do the same. [...] >By all means read these articles, but please do not accept them as gospel >(or whatever your personal religious equivalent may be) unless and until >an official product announcement is generally released by Atari Sunnyvale. How do I know when it is an official announcement. Atari did never ever send me something after sending in my warranty card, so I'll have to use the press & Usenet to get info. > >Roy Good/Atari Sunnyvale Some more: I quoted one magazine, but saw several other articles in the (German) press (with related info). Fact is that we all know that atari is working on something with a 030 or related. Fact is also that they have a large? boot at Comdex. (so perhaps something will be happening) Fact is that Germany is very often well and early informed. I'd suggest atari to stop the rumours by giving some info. (If they really have a product out at comdex they must have some basic info by now). For instance, I for me have one question. Will the -perhaps non-existing- 68030 box use tos 1.4, or are we to expect another version of tos (and is that version compatible with the 68000 version). I'd really *want* a tos which could also run on my 68020! -- Frans Meulenbroeks (meulenbr@cst.prl.philips.nl) Centre for Software Technology ( or try: ...!mcvax!philmds!prle!cst!meulenbr)
danscott@atari.UUCP (Dan Scott) (11/06/88)
in article <253@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: > Fact is that Germany is very often well and early informed. Thats not exactly true, all Atari's subsiduaries are just as informed as Atari Germany is. > > I'd suggest atari to stop the rumours by giving some info. > (If they really have a product out at comdex they must have some basic > info by now). > > For instance, I for me have one question. > Will the -perhaps non-existing- 68030 box use tos 1.4, or are we to > expect another version of tos (and is that version compatible with the > 68000 version). I'd really *want* a tos which could also run on my > 68020! Any information that you may have heard up now is just that rumors. Nothing official has been announced by Atari Sunnyvale, where all the announcements will come from. Untill something is officially announced, be it through COMDEX this net or ads on NBC, we cannot comment on anything that anyone says we are working on. This policy has been in effect for about a year now partly to stop the 'vapor-ware' ideas that were floating around from 86-87. Dan Scott Atari Corp. Sunnyvale
peter@sugar.uu.net (Peter da Silva) (11/07/88)
I have a question about TOS on the 68020. I have been told there are a number of "Line-A" or "Line-F" type traps that actually use illegal rather unimplemented opcodes. These opcodes are used for real instructions on the 68020. If this is true, then there is little chance for 68020 TOS. Any comments? -- Peter da Silva `-_-' peter@sugar.uu.net Have you hugged U your wolf today? Disclaimer: My typos are my own damn business.
walkerb@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Brian Walker) (11/07/88)
In article <2962@sugar.uu.net> peter@sugar.uu.net (Peter da Silva) writes: >I have a question about TOS on the 68020. > >I have been told there are a number of "Line-A" or "Line-F" type traps that >actually use illegal rather unimplemented opcodes. These opcodes are used for >real instructions on the 68020. > >If this is true, then there is little chance for 68020 TOS. Any comments? On the 68020, line-F opcodes are used for co-processor operations. The line-A opcodes, however, are permanently available for use. You may note that the Macintosh uses line-A calls for all of its system calls so line-A is not a problem. On the ST, TOS uses the line-F for internal calls. But that can be changed in any revision of TOS because those calls are "subject to change without notice." That, of course, means that Atari may, at their choosing, write a TOS/GEM implimentation for a 68020 system by moving the line-F calls and performing some basic rewrites to facilitate operation on a 68020. Brian Walker, University of Colorado at Boulder|| printf("Say please:] \n"); walkerb@tramp.colorado.edu=======|| if (say_please(user)) {ncar,nbires,sunybcs}!boulder!tramp!walkerb====|| be_nice(random());
cmcmanis%pepper@Sun.COM (Chuck McManis) (11/08/88)
In article <4494@boulder.Colorado.EDU> (Brian Walker) writes: > On the ST, TOS uses the line-F for internal calls. But that can be > changed in any revision of TOS because those calls are "subject to > change without notice." That, of course, means that Atari may, at their > choosing, write a TOS/GEM implimentation for a 68020 system by moving > the line-F calls and performing some basic rewrites to facilitate > operation on a 68020. >Brian Walker, University of Colorado at Boulder|| printf("Say please:] \n"); Hmm, this leads to two questions. One, has TOS 1.4 fixed this problem ? If it has then the Atari folks might get in on the 68020 bandwagon that that Amiga folks have been riding for some time. There is even a PD PC board that converts the 68000 socket to a 68020 + 68881 socket. Bringing the number of '020 conversion products up to 5 (Ronin, CSA, Hurricane, Commodore, PD). Two, if not could it be made part of 1.5 or is the rewrite such that it would have to wait until 2.0. Has the '030 project carried TOS with it or is it a UNIX-only box? --Chuck McManis uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis BIX: cmcmanis ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you.
good@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) (11/08/88)
in article <253@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: > > WARNING: flames ahead. > In article <1216@atari.UUCP> good@atari.UUCP (Roy Good) writes: >>in article <252@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: > [...] >>Even if the information was obtained through apparently legitimate channels, >>I believe that the writer should by now be sensitive to the effect of >>publishing prerelease data, and should therefore have taken the step of >>verifying its accuracy and timeliness with Atari Sunnyvale. > I just reported what I read elsewhere, mentioning my source. > I am NOT and I don't feel obliged to verify this with Atari Sunnyvale. > I don't know for your side of the big water, but at THIS side has > something constitutional called freedom of press and speech. > In other words: next time I probably will do the same. > [...] The "writer", in my posting, is not you, Frans, but the person who published the original magazine article. I cannot (and do not) complain at your reiterating words you have read in a freely available (or maybe DM x.xx?) publication. And my comment had nothing to do with 'freedom of speech'. It is more related to such apparently dying concepts as trust and cooperation - again, not directed at you, Frans. I believe the publisher should really have contacted myself or someone at Atari Sunnyvale, especially since, it seems, my name appears as part of the article. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Roy J. Good Product Development, Atari Corporation Views expressed are my own. Atari may agree or disagree; they have the right. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
poole@forty2.UUCP (Simon Poole) (11/10/88)
In article <1219@atari.UUCP> danscott@atari.UUCP (Dan Scott) writes: >in article <253@cstw01.UUCP>, meulenbr@cstw01.UUCP (Frans Meulenbroeks) says: > >> Fact is that Germany is very often well and early informed. > >Thats not exactly true, all Atari's subsiduaries are just as informed as >Atari Germany is. Except that Atari Germany is probably the biggest single leak in the whole computer industry (may I remember Atari US about the various times 'unreleased' software has been 'pirated' by Atari Germany). > >Any information that you may have heard up now is just that rumors. Nothing >official has been announced by Atari Sunnyvale, where all the announcements >will come from. Except that 'STmagazinsaid d they had the information from the Atari 'Geschaeftsleitung' (not saying if this is supposed to be Atari US or Germany management) and have an interview with Sam Tramiel (with some talk about the TT) in the same issue. If anybody from Atari US is interested in my copy of the magazin, I'll gladly send it to Sunnyvale......(BTW I normally DON'T buy STmagazin). -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- UUCP: ...mcvax!cernvax!forty2!poole Simon Poole BITNET: K538915@CZHRZU1A ----------------------------------------------------------------------------