rjung@nunki.usc.edu (Robert allen Jung) (12/24/88)
Some time before Christmas Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com writes: >Among people who DO own Atari computers, you'll ALMOST NEVER hear them >criticize the MACHINE itself... Exactly. Almost all the Atari users I know tend to love the machine, but hate/are dissappointed with/loathe the management. Very, VERY few think they got stuck with a "dog". That's probably why we're all the more sensitive to delayed TOS/Blitter upgrades, and more than somewhat skeptical of new products and promises. Nevertheless, if we actually HAVE the machines, we don't seem to really hate them too much (the only exception I can think of would be the SLM804 Laser). Does anyone else who's read Atari's plans for 1989 get the feeling that it's a "put up or shut up" year in the US? Notice that at the Winter CES, Atari has pledged increased US advertising/support, and declared the DRAM shortage over. If Atari does NOT deliver through 1989, where do they run? What's the excuse? Of course, if Atari _does_ deliver in '89, I doubt anybody would be complaining... B-) --R.J. B-) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Disclaimer: These are my views, and mine alone. # ## # Mailing address: Beats me, just reply to this message # ## # (rjung@nunki.usc.edu?) ## ## ## #### ## ####
Thomas_E_Zerucha@cup.portal.com (12/29/88)
I have to agree - it is a year of reconing for Atari. They cannot go much farther on the intertia of the 520STs, and even the Megas are more like a "fat" 1040 than a really new computer. Even if every other computer can be upgraded with blitters (i.e. the 520STFM), it won't make too much difference (the blitter chip is nice, but not essential). Commodore is not sitting still, and I suspect that if Atari does nothing, I may trade in my ST by the end of '89 for something else, potentially an Amiga. Then there is Macintosh, and a lot of the faster clones are getting cheaper. The portable (STacey?) will make a big difference and I hope they will have versions of this as fully expanded as the Megas (i.e. 4 Megabytes, with larger, fast disk drives, e.g. the 80 Meg quantum). I don't think there is any high powered portable out there in the price range this would fall into (i.e. a Turbo AT portable with fat disk). Then put a Spectre 128 on it and see what happens. They also should increase the speed. Even more significant may be the 68030 box. It seems like most of the NeXT, but for a lot less money. This opens up more markets where something more powerful is needed (desired), but not generally affordable. Then they should continue improving the ST - First they should go to SIMMs so a memory upgrade is swapping a small board. Then they should allow 12 meg ram space (with video and DMA). 16+ Mhz would be nice too. And more colors and resolution. And an expansion bus. And they should do more with peripherals - the Laser Printer was a good idea, now the CD should make other things easier. But if they continue to ignore the american market, they shoudl move their headquarters to Europe.
paone@aramis.rutgers.edu (Phil Paone) (12/30/88)
I am very curious about the STacey. From where I am sitting there really doesn't seem to be a market for it. The only reason I can see for a portable is to take your work with you. Well, in the US, very few companies use the ST at all. Now granted, I can see where it might be worth it in Europe where the ST has its buisness image, but even there enough ST's (only 1million) have not been sold to justify it. Just on a side note. There are no hardware flaws with the ST. All the bugs are in software. I remember reading in another article that the hardware was hacked. I don't get it. THe hardware is all off the shelf, the system never crashes or behaves unpredictably due to hardware problems. -- Phil Paone paone@topaz.rutgers.edu !rutgers.edu!topaz.edu!ppaone
peter@sugar.uu.net (Peter da Silva) (12/30/88)
In article <13011@cup.portal.com>, Thomas_E_Zerucha@cup.portal.com writes: > Even more significant may be the 68030 box. It seems like most of the > NeXT, but for a lot less money. This opens up more markets where something > more powerful is needed (desired), but not generally affordable. The NeXT is really not that exciting on a pure "specs" basis. What makes it amazing is the integration... which is still in the process of going together. And the new Atari is not known for well-integrated products. -- Peter "Have you hugged your wolf today" da Silva `-_-' Hackercorp. ...texbell!sugar!peter, or peter@sugar.uu.net 'U`
Thomas_E_Zerucha@cup.portal.com (01/01/89)
If the STacey (aka portable ST) has an impact it might be because there will be a lot more applications for an inexpensive but portable computer with a lot of power. I would like to have one now - I brought in my ST to work, and can do a lot of nice things having it cross between the PC and Mac worlds. But my setup (worse since I have the old ST with the wire nest in back) doesn't travel well. If you have seen those Macintosh ads where people bring their computer to work with them you may get the idea. Several people "lug" their Macintoshes in and out regularly. The ST could displace some of that. Remember that adding portability creates NEW applications where they didn't exist before, and generally enhances the ST's strong points. The only hardware complaint which I may have for the ST is that it isn't very easy to expand. Their video memory is limited to 4 Megabytes (which is a lot, but applications grow to fill up available capacities). There is no expansion bus and only a single slot on the Megas. You can't easily gain resolution (If I wanted to create something that did 16 million colors I would have to redo the hardware almost completely). And faster processors have the same problem. These are lessened to a great extent since the ST has so much built in, and that is done fairly well (separate processor for mouse and keyboard, DMA (though the FIFO's and byte sized sector register could be done better), and all the ports).
rosenkra@hall.cray.com (Bill Rosenkranz) (01/04/89)
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In article <Dec.29.12.32.36.1988.3546@aramis.rutgers.edu> paone@aramis.rutgers.edu (Phil Paone) writes:
=Just on a side note. There are no hardware flaws with the ST. All
=the bugs are in software. I remember reading in another article that
=the hardware was hacked. I don't get it. THe hardware is all off the
=shelf, the system never crashes or behaves unpredictably due to
=hardware problems.
=--
=Phil Paone
=paone@topaz.rutgers.edu
=!rutgers.edu!topaz.edu!ppaone
good point, phil. the ST non-mechanical hardware is very solid. heavy use
of drives will cause them to (eventually) fail, but that is true across the
board (ibm, ST, amiga, etc).
TOS 1.0 and 1.2 (and equivalent european versions?) suffer from bugs, most
of which only cause grief to developers: i wager the "average" ST user
rarely sees any bombs (provided his application software is relatively
well behaved). i doubt if that type of user (one who does not do "significant"
programming in C/basic/et al) even sees the 40 folder bug.
please don't start a debate as to what "average" or "significant" means.
there are a million or so STs, probably 500-2000 professional developers
(i.e. those makeing $$ writing software on and for the ST), and probably
50% or more of the ST owners never even write a basic program. i admit
i am just guessing, but it seems reasonable to expect the ST to have a user
profile not much different than any other comparably priced ($200<price<$5k)
system. most users of software in my particular market niche (music) only
run applications from the desktop. the software in that market is generally
robust and free from catastrophic bugs, albeit heavily copy protected (:^(.
-bill
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