CHIASSA@UDEM.BITNET (Alyre CHIASSON) (01/11/89)
I've had a 1040ST at home now for 2 years and with the arrival of Wordperfect and dBase am thinking of acquiring 3 units for an office setup, two 1040ST and a Mega 2. With the Mega 2 I want to have a BBS for my clients with the appropriate software and a 60 Meg hard drive. The information to be exchanged will be text files not programs. My main concern is that clients who have IBM systems will not be able to retrieve and send information to a BBS run under an Atari system. I assume that the Atari arc programs cannot unarc an IBM arced file nor arc a file so that it can be unarced by an IBM arc program. Question Is there an arc program that can shuttle between the IBM world and the Atari world? If not, are there other options? I am not a super programmer. Secondly, I am not sure if IBM telecommunications software programs can successfully communicate with an Atari BBS. Question Since the standard in modems appears to be Hayes compatible am I right to assume that this means that all software based on this standard must send the same ascii codes to get a BBS to upload and download files? I would greatly appreciate any advice and words of caution before I spend all this money only to find that the vast majority of my clients will not be able to access the BBS. If there is a software dependency as to whether such a system would work I would appreciate your recommendations. Alyre Chiasson Moncton, N.B. Canada
ecs40hw036@minnie.ucdavis.edu (0000;0000049881;3200;250;205;ecs40hw) (01/12/89)
It depends. How loyal are you to Atari? (J/K) It doesn't matter which computer is used as a BBS; all computers can store files from other computers in ASCII. You can also store IBM arc files across the modem directly on your ST, since the ST can read and write IBM files. Later, you can unarc them with pc-ditto, the software IBM emulator for the ST, which at $70 is one heck-of-a-deal. Hope that helps. ***INTERNET: ahsiung@ucdavis.edu
ugbell@sunybcs.uucp (William Bell) (01/12/89)
>***INTERNET: ahsiung@ucdavis.edu
Well I have run a BBS for 4 years, and I always had a file section
on the BBS for IBM Programs. The callers can dowload the programs and
upload them onto the BBS. As an added bonus the IBM programs
on the ST can be saved onto a ST disk, and put into IBM
computer directly. This format capability is nice for
IBm companies etc.
Hayes is the standard. Hayes compatible means the program
will work with Hayes type modems.
I think my ST worked fine for IBM people as well as ST.rich@lakesys.UUCP (Richard Dankert) (01/12/89)
In article <ID7141.D890110.T145542.CHIASSA@UDEM> CHIASSA@UDEM.BITNET (Alyre CHIASSON) writes: > > With the Mega 2 I want to > have a BBS for my clients with the appropriate software and a 60 > Meg hard drive. The information to be exchanged will be text files > not programs. My main concern is that clients who have IBM systems > will not be able to retrieve and send information to a BBS run > under an Atari system. There are a variety of BBS programs available for the Atari ST such as Michtron, FoReM, Express and others. There is also available other P/D programs that will do the same, at of course lessor cost, one of which is STadel (I run such a system) > I assume that the Atari arc programs cannot > unarc an IBM arced file nor arc a file so that it can be unarced > by an IBM arc program. ARC 521 is available for the ST, which will allow exactly this. For the ST there are shell (GEM) programs to make the task a little easier over the normal command line style. > Question > > Is there an arc program that can shuttle between the IBM world and > the Atari world? If not, are there other options? I am not a super > programmer. Answered above . > Secondly, I am not sure if IBM telecommunications software > programs can successfully communicate with an Atari BBS. Procomm on the IBM will do this task quite nicely. Mainly, most BBS software is set for either vt-52 or vt-100 terminal set ups. Being so, communication between the two is quite painless. > Question > > Since the standard in modems appears to be Hayes compatible am I > right to assume that this means that all software based on this > standard must send the same ascii codes to get a BBS to upload and > download files? Modems based on Hayes compatability have virtually nothing to do with how the files/programs are sent as this is almost always controlled by the the BBS program itself. Hayes compatability basicly makes it easier for the layman to set up a system, without virtually any knowledge of how to make the modem work with the BBS program. Be aware that not all modems are fulley Hayes compatable. Hayes compatability ranges from 'compatable with the Hayes AT command set' to full Hayes compatability inside and out. I use the Practical Peripherals PM2400sa, as this modem uses the same Intel chip that the Hayes uses. > I would greatly appreciate any advice and words of caution before > I spend all this money only to find that the vast majority of my > clients will not be able to access the BBS. If there is a software > dependency as to whether such a system would work I would > appreciate your recommendations. > > Alyre Chiasson > Moncton, N.B. > Canada Hope that this help clear up a few misnomers. rich..... UUCP: rich@lakesys.lakesys.COM {always .... }
Robert_Bob_Mulholland@cup.portal.com (01/13/89)
IBM and Atari ST BBSs can very easily communicate with one another (I call IBM BBSs to acquire IBM software to use with PC Ditto all of the time). Also, I know IBM users who call Atari ST BBSs in a similar fashion. The program ARC is a standard and therefore different computers which use ARC can unARC files from other computer systems. To date I have used ARC521.TTP & ARC Shell 1.97b to unARC Atari ST, IBM and Amiga ARCed files successfully. Even the disk formats for Atari ST and IBM disks are nearly similar enough. Enough that you could stick a 3.5" IBM disk right from the IBM software package into an Atari ST disk drive and have it work with PC Ditto or be able to read text files on that disk. All ASCII codes are the same between the IBM and the Atari ST except for the graphics characters which are different on all systems but won't affect telecommunications at all.
Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (01/13/89)
Alyre Chiasson asks: > Is there an arc program that can shuttle between the IBM world and > the Atari world? Yes, luckily most of the implementations of ARC are interchangable among differing machine types. With the exception of the Commodore-64, files ARCed on one machine can be unARCed on another. > Secondly, I am not sure if IBM telecommunications software > programs can successfully communicate with an Atari BBS. In most cases, the machine that a BBS is run on has no real effect on the user of the BBS. IBM files can be stored and retreived on a BBS run on an Atari ST with no problems. The file transfer protocols are standardized enough that IBM telecommunications software should have no problems communicating with an Atari BBS. > Since the standard in modems appears to be Hayes compatible am I > right to assume that this means that all software based on this > standard must send the same ascii codes to get a BBS to upload and > download files? No, actually the modem itself has no real bearing on the operation of the BBS from the caller's viewpoint. The only time the modem "standards" would be of importance is when the BBS needs to command its modem. The caller shouldn't have to worry about what kind of modem the BBS uses. (Since most modems today adhere to the "Hayes standard" closely enough for most BBSs, the question is largely moot..) There used to be "oddball" protocols, mostly in the "formative years" of telecommunications, but those have generally either died out, or are very specifically limited to certain machines. The IBM and Atari worlds have luckily been part of the standardization process. You shouldn't have to worry about interaction between your IBM users and your Atari BBS...! BobR
dsmythe@cup.portal.com (dave l smythe) (01/14/89)
ARC will create and manipulate files that can be used on an IBM PC; there is no compatibility problem (small caveat -- there may be some ARC files that have been compressed in a non-standard form called 'squashing', popularized by Phil Katz's PKARC variant of the SEA ARC program, but there are variants of ARC that run on the ST that will handle these files as well. You can store either binary or ASCII files for any type of computer on the Atari. As long as you treat all the files involved as BINARY files, you won't have any problems handling EBCDIC files on an Atari. You are much more likely to have trouble on the Flintstones-era VM machine, but if you are careful you should be OK. I know that my company keeps its PC BINARY archives on a VM machine. Good luck.
covertr@gtephx.UUCP (Richard E. Covert) (01/17/89)
In article <ID7141.D890110.T145542.CHIASSA@UDEM>, CHIASSA@UDEM.BITNET (Alyre CHIASSON) writes: > > Question > > Is there an arc program that can shuttle between the IBM world and > the Atari world? If not, are there other options? I am not a super > programmer. > There is an ST version of ARC for the ST, the two most common are ARC5.12 and ARC5.21. The later has some bugs in it but will de-ARC IBM files that were SQUASHED. I use ARC5.12 all of the time. IT is very well debugged. > > Question > > Since the standard in modems appears to be Hayes compatible am I > right to assume that this means that all software based on this > standard must send the same ascii codes to get a BBS to upload and > download files? Answer There are many other vendors of DC Hayes compatible modems. I use a 2400 baud modem made by Supra Corp. It is about 1/3 the physical size of a DC Hayes modem and cost $150 retail. something that wasn't asked was what software to use on his ST. I would recommend FOREM by Commnet. It sells for about $60 (US). There are two versions, one for the Atari ST and another for the IBM PC. It supports ARCed files, and has many IBM style file transfer protocols. You can have up to 20 message bases, have online databases, quizes, games, and upt to 20 file sections. Callers can have individual privileges. I am using Forem ST on my part time bbs. > > I would greatly appreciate any advice and words of caution before > I spend all this money only to find that the vast majority of my > clients will not be able to access the BBS. If there is a software > dependency as to whether such a system would work I would > appreciate your recommendations. > > Alyre Chiasson > Moncton, N.B. > Canada another nice thing about the ST is that you can read/write standard IBM 3.5" floppies. So, you can exchange files with your clients that have the new 3.5" floppy drives. The file structure of the ST is almost identical to that of the IBM. Ask someone at Atari for more details, but I understand that the new TOS operating system ROMs will make the ST even more compatible with IBM floppies. all in all, I can't see any problem with using an ST ,as a bulletin board for your IBM callers. It has a lot more power then a simple IBM PC/XT class computer for about the same price.
covertr@gtephx.UUCP (Richard E. Covert) (01/19/89)
I would like to repeat in the strongest terms: DON'T USE ARC 5.21 DON'T USE ARC 5.21 ARC 5.21 has a serious bug which causes it make an ARC file larger then the sum of the individual files. ARC 5.12 doesn't have this problem. In fact, for a 400K ARCed file you can save about 50K by re-ARCing it with 5.12. so, don't use ARC 5.21 for new archives. Only use it if you have to de-ARC an IBM file arced with the IBM ARC 5.21. I only use ARC 5.12 myself!!! Richard (ARC 5.21 is BADDD!!) Covert
Mike_Schmidt@CMR001.BITNET (Mike Schmidt) (01/23/89)
Alyre CHIASSON writes: >.... My main concern is that clients who have IBM systems >will not be able to retrieve and send information to a BBS run >under an Atari system. I assume that the Atari arc programs cannot >unarc an IBM arced file nor arc a file so that it can be unarced >by an IBM arc program. >Question >Is there an arc program that can shuttle between the IBM world and >the Atari world? If not, are there other options? I am not a super >programmer. In fact, there is no problem at all. They are the SAME arc programs, and I regularly use ARC on my AT to de-arc ST stuff, and vice-versa. In fact, the ARC on UNIX, VAXen, and other large systems is also compatible. >Secondly, I am not sure if IBM telecommunications software >programs can successfully communicate with an Atari BBS. Again, the only problem is in making sure that both ends have the same file transfer protocols, which are usually supported by all BBS systems; things like XMODEM, YMODEM, and KERMIT. Even non-text files transfer quite happily. In my own case, I use whatever computer I happen to be sitting at when I contact BBSs, and don't take any care what kind of a system is running the BBS. This all depends on the BBS software you run, not the machine. >Question > >Since the standard in modems appears to be Hayes compatible am I >right to assume that this means that all software based on this >standard must send the same ascii codes to get a BBS to upload and >download files? The modems only determine the 'electrical' standards, and the commands that the modems need to do dialing, etc. The codes required to upload and download files are determined by your BBS SOFTWARE, as are the fiule transfer protocols it supports. I don't think you need to worry about your clients on IBM systems not being able to access your BBS. *********************************************************************** Mike Schmidt bitnet: schmidtm@cmr001 Honeywell Bull Ltd arpa: schmidtm%cmr001.bitnet@cunyvm.cuny.edu (until they change the name, again) ************************************************************************ As usual, my opinions are entirely fictional; any resemblance to other persons, real or corporate, living or dead, is purely coincidental. Mike Schmidt <schmidtm@cmr001.bitnet>