Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (08/25/89)
Michael Fischer mentioned, in answer to a question about the advisability of buying an ST in Europe with the idea of eventually bringing it back to the States: >You should also be aware that the German TOS and keyboards are >different. The German keyboard has an extra key at the left end of >the bottom row that is not present on U.S. machines, the letters "y" >and "z" are interchanged, and many of the special characters are in >different positions. Also, the desktop's menus, error messages, etc. >are in German. It is possible (with appropriate software) to redefine >the keyboard translation tables so that the keyboard works more or >less like the US keyboard, but then the keycaps will be wrong. Now... everyone has been assuming that Atari Corp. has just been diverting production of STs to the European marketplace, instead of importing them into the US... that they all come off of one big assembly line, and could just as well be sent to the local Iowa computer store, if only Atari cared to sell to the US... From the above information though, it's apparent that's not true... the STs being shipped to Germany are NOT the same product that potentially could be sent to Iowa, but a specialized derivation of the generic ST product. Their keyboards (and related firmware) and TOS are specifically engineered for that specific marketplace. Thus, it's NOT just a matter of Atari Corp. "diverting" machines into the US, as Sam Tramiel said in that long-ago CompuServe online conference, but they have to *specifically* decide to BUILD machines for the US marketplace. The question is, HAVE they? BobR
hase@netmbx.UUCP (Hartmut Semken) (08/27/89)
In article <21577@cup.portal.com> Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com writes: [...] >From the above information though, it's apparent that's not true... the STs >being shipped to Germany are NOT the same product that potentially could be >sent to Iowa, but a specialized derivation of the generic ST product. Their >keyboards (and related firmware) and TOS are specifically engineered for that >specific marketplace. Not true. The machine is the same. The ROMs are not, and neither are the keyboards. There is a british, french, german, US and probably a spanish(?) version of the machine. All versions are assembled on the same assembly line ('cause they are the same...) with different Parts (ROM, keyboard and packing). I would not call a different packing and different keycaps (the keyboard subsystem/processor ist the same with all national keyboards) "specifically engeneered". hase -- Hartmut Semken, Lupsteiner Weg 67, 1000 Berlin 37 hase@netmbx.UUCP Dennis had stepped up into the top seat whet its founder had died of a lethal overdose of brick wall, taken while under the influence of a Ferrari and a bottle of tequila. (Douglas Adams; the long dark teatime...)
f-leoe@IFI.UIO.NO (LarsErik0sterud) (08/28/89)
Infact there are swedish ROM versions too (it used too be norwegian too) Lars-Erik / ABK-BBS +47 2132659 / ____ ______ 0sterud / larserio@ifi.uio.no / /___ / ____________/ _______________________/ ____/ /
walkerb@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Brian Walker) (08/29/89)
In article <21577@cup.portal.com> Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com writes: >Michael Fischer mentioned, in answer to a question about the advisability of >buying an ST in Europe with the idea of eventually bringing it back to >the States: > >>You should also be aware that the German TOS and keyboards are >>different. The German keyboard has an extra key at the left end of >>the bottom row that is not present on U.S. machines, the letters "y" >>and "z" are interchanged, and many of the special characters are in >>different positions. Also, the desktop's menus, error messages, etc. >>are in German. It is possible (with appropriate software) to redefine >>the keyboard translation tables so that the keyboard works more or >>less like the US keyboard, but then the keycaps will be wrong. > [stuff deleted...] > >... the STs >being shipped to Germany are NOT the same product that potentially could be >sent to Iowa, but a specialized derivation of the generic ST product. Their >keyboards (and related firmware) and TOS are specifically engineered for that >specific marketplace. > Well, yes and no. The US and overseas versions of the ST are essentially the same machine. In fact, about the only things which differ are in the ROMs, the keyboard and the power supply. The differences in the keyboard are superficial. Inside, you will find the same board, the same processor and, yes, the same 'firmware'. The keyboard isn't very intelligent. All it does is report key strokes and mouse movement back to the 68000. The key strokes are reported in terms of position. The ROM code determines how they will be interpretted. The extra key found on European keyboards goes in a position on the right side of where the oversized left shift key appears on the US keyboard. The differences are minor. It would be more accurate to say that the ST has been GENERALLY engineered for ALL markets. Brian Walker walkerb@tramp.colorado.edu "If we imagine no worse of them than they of ..!ncar!boulder!tramp!walkerb themselves, they may pass for excellent men." University of Colorado at Boulder
Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (08/30/89)
Talking about the US version of the ST being different from the European versions of the ST, Harmut Semken says: >Not true. >The machine is the same. The ROMs are not, and neither are the >keyboards. >There is a british, french, german, US and probably a spanish(?) version of >the machine. In another posting, he says: >Comparing a german and a british ST (520 STMs), I would say, the german >one is shielded somewhat better (filter circurits on all lines to >external connectors; missing in british model etc.) Lars-Eric Osterund says: >Infact there are swedish ROM versions too (it used too be norwegian too) The point is, while the basic design of the machine is the same, the end product is not. Someone at Atari has to sit at a desk and say, "This month we'll manufacture 10,000 STs. In 4,000 we'll install German ROMS and keyboards, install all the "Stoerfestigkeit" and "Hochfrequenzabstrahlung" RF shielding and put them in boxes printed in German, with German manuals and include disk with software specifically selected for the German marketplace, including a nifty version of BASIC. In another 4000, we'll include the British versions of all the above. In maybe 1,000 or so, we'll install the Swedish ROMs and keyboard firmware, manuals and software. Then, let's see, that leaves 1,000 STs for the US marketplace, with FCC shielding and US manuals, power supplies and software, and put into boxes printed for the US market." It is NOT a matter of "diverting product" to the US marketplace. The German STs would be virtually useless in the US if "diverted" here. Atari Corp. has to make specific decisions about which models to produce, which was the point of this "food for thought." BobR