cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) (09/20/89)
I don't understand what all the hoopla about the somewhat limited capabilities of the TT is all about? Here in NYC, you can buy a brand new Mac IIcx for $2999. If you want a 68030 environment, this path seems to be a bit more logical as you'll have tons of software to choose from, more expansion slots and the support of a company that releases real products in a timely manner. Sorry for the flame Atari people, but you've just lost a customer. The vapor games finally got to be a bit too annoying. I don't think the TT will be a match for the Mac IIcx or Mac SE/30 anyway (speedwise or supportwise). I will keep my lil' ST around for the occasional game though. :-) Chris (future <gulp> Apple owner) Mauritz ------------------------------+--------------------------- Chris Mauritz |Everything tastes better cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu |when it sits on a (c)All rights reserved. |mauRITZ. 8-> Send flames to /dev/null | ------------------------------+---------------------------
exspes@gdr.bath.ac.uk (P E Smee) (09/20/89)
In article <CMM.0.88.622236156.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu> cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: >I don't understand what all the hoopla about the somewhat limited >capabilities of the TT is all about? Here in NYC, you can buy a brand >new Mac IIcx for $2999. The hoopla in Europe probably stems from the relative pricing policies of Atari and Apple. Atari seem to charge approximately the same price for things everywhere. That is, for example, something that costs 200 pounds in the UK will go for about $320 in the US (because the pound is worth about $1.60 US) and so on. Apple costs, on the other hand, seem to be based solely on a 'what's a nice sounding number' philosophy. Typically, an Apple machine in the UK costs more IN NUMBERS than an identical machine in the States. E.g. a $3000 Apple in the States might become something like a 4000 pound Apple in the UK -- or about twice as expensive when the exchange rates are factored in. (This is also why Apples haven't caught on in Europe as home machines to the same extent that they have in the States. Apple UK, at least, seem to say that that's fine by them, they'd really rather only support the 'serious business' market anyway.) Without going into debates about the 'fairness' (whatever that is) of 'what the market will bear' pricing, it's still clear at least that it will affect the relative perceived cost-effectiveness of the various machines. (There are rumours that Apple may be cutting its European prices, but it looks like they still aren't going to come down to parity.) -- Paul Smee | JANET: Smee@uk.ac.bristol Computer Centre | BITNET: Smee%uk.ac.bristol@ukacrl.bitnet University of Bristol | Internet: Smee%uk.ac.bristol@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk (Phone: +44 272 303132) | UUCP: ...!mcvax!ukc!gdr.bath.ac.uk!exspes
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (09/21/89)
in article <CMM.0.88.622236156.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu>, cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) says: > I don't think the TT will be a match for the Mac IIcx or Mac SE/30 > anyway (speedwise or supportwise). Apple's support is excellent; better than most companies. And they have a decent base of software in many areas. But the Atari folks would have to try really, really hard to make a ~16MHz 68030 machine as slow as the IIx/IIcx machines. > Chris (future <gulp> Apple owner) Mauritz -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
solomon@boulder.Colorado.EDU (SOLOMON AMY BETH) (09/21/89)
In article <CMM.0.88.622236156.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu> cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: >I don't understand what all the hoopla about the somewhat limited >capabilities of the TT is all about? Here in NYC, you can buy a brand >new Mac IIcx for $2999. If you want a 68030 environment . . . Yeah, I bet that this system comes with a wopping 1 Meg and does not include: 1) A hard disk 2) A keyboard 3) A monitor 4) A/UX I would highly suggest that you look into how much Apple charges for these little goodies before you buy. I think that you will find that a Mac which is equivalent to the TT ( if it ever gets here ) will easily cost you over $5000.
kbad@atari.UUCP (Ken Badertscher) (09/22/89)
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) writes: | [...] the Atari folks would have to try | really, really hard to make a ~16MHz 68030 machine as slow as the IIx/IIcx | machines. Thank you, Dave, for bringing a smile to my face. TT is fast. And I can neither confirm nor deny, but I strongly suspect that it will be _considerably_ less expensive than any 68030 Macintosh. -- ||| Ken Badertscher (ames!atari!kbad) ||| Atari R&D System Software Engine / | \ #include <disclaimer>
Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (09/22/89)
Chris Mauritz sez: > ... Sorry for the flame Atari >people, but you've just lost a customer. The vapor games finally got >to be a bit too annoying. I don't think the TT will be a match for the >Mac IIcx or Mac SE/30 anyway (speedwise or supportwise). Chris... why not invest a 25cent stamp and send your comments to Jack Tramiel... You never know when you might be able to help make a difference in their attitudes... BobR
ramsiri@blake.acs.washington.edu (Enartloc Nhoj) (09/22/89)
In article <1703@atari.UUCP> kbad@atari.UUCP (Ken Badertscher) writes: >daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) writes: > >| [...] the Atari folks would have to try > >> And I can neither confirm nor deny, but I strongly suspect that it will be >> _considerably_ less expensive than any 68030 Macintosh. >> ||| Ken Badertscher (ames!atari!kbad) But the Mac II is available. Ken, you must be able to satisfy our curiosity and tell us what is holding up the TT's release... -ramsiri
w-darekm@microsoft.UUCP (Darek Mihocka) (09/23/89)
In article <11892@boulder.Colorado.EDU> solomon@boulder.Colorado.EDU (SOLOMON AMY BETH) writes: >In article <CMM.0.88.622236156.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu> cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: >>I don't understand what all the hoopla about the somewhat limited >>capabilities of the TT is all about? Here in NYC, you can buy a brand >>new Mac IIcx for $2999. If you want a 68030 environment . . . > > >Yeah, I bet that this system comes with a wopping 1 Meg and does not >include: > 1) A hard disk > 2) A keyboard > 3) A monitor > 4) A/UX Since when is 1 megabyte considered "wopping"? That's pretty standard on most Mac's and PC's these days, and most 286 and 386 machines have at least 2 meg so they can boot up <grin> >I would highly suggest that you look into how much Apple charges for these >little goodies before you buy. I think that you will find that a Mac which >is equivalent to the TT ( if it ever gets here ) will easily cost you >over $5000. Gimme a break! The days of being able to claim Power Without the Price are over. If you're gonna buy a 68030 machine, then what difference does it make if you spend $3000 or $5000. It's safe to say you're not buying it for video games. Most likely it will be used for development or in some business application. Perhaps CD-ROM. Or signal processing. In any case, it's some application that is being used to generate income. A super cheap TT bundled with a hard disk, a keyboard (must we ask for a keyboard???), and monitor is USELESS to you and will not generate any INCOME if it doesn't exist! Atari has already proven many times that their press releases and announcements are fiction, therefore any information you may have about the price and features of the TT can't be taken seriously. We are now one week away from October, and I have still not seen any activity to indicate that Sam Tramiel will honor his promise to ship everything in October. The business world simply does not work the same way as the consumer market. They do not wait until Christmas to buy their computers. The Apple IIx has a 68030, has CD-ROM players, has multitasking, has excellent sound and graphics, has excellent business software, and best of all you can buy one, today. And it's almost a sure thing now that Apple will be the first to release a portable. I wouldn't be surprised if Atari starts coming up with excuses to cancel some of these new machine. The only people that are going to buy them are hard core Atari loyalists like yourself. And all that will accomplish is make the Tramiels richer, and you'll end up with inferior computer equipment. Suit yourself. My next computer is definately not going to be an Atari. If I were Jack Tramiel, I'd buy Nintendo stock to keep from losing everything. - Darek ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Darek Mihocka ST Xformer II CIS: (out of order) Box 2624, Station B Quick Utilities GEnie: DAREKM Kitchener, Ontario MegaBlit SSG SPX DELPHI: DAREKM N2H 6N2 Shareware, not Vaporware BIX: darekm Canada Blitter chip sucks! CheapNet: ...!uw-beaver!microsoft!w-darekm (519)-747-0386 A mind is a terrible thing to waste, so JUST SAY NO TO TOS. Opinions expressed are my own and not those of anyone not named Darek Mihocka. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
depeche@quiche.cs.mcgill.ca (Sam Alan EZUST) (09/25/89)
In article <7810@microsoft.UUCP> w-darekm@microsoft.UUCP (Darek Mihocka) writes: >In article <11892@boulder.Colorado.EDU> solomon@boulder.Colorado.EDU (SOLOMON AMY BETH) writes: >>In article <CMM.0.88.622236156.cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu> cmm1@CUNIXA.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: > >Gimme a break! The days of being able to claim Power Without the Price are over. >If you're gonna buy a 68030 machine, then what difference does it make if you >spend $3000 or $5000. It's safe to say you're not buying it for video games. >Most likely it will be used for development or in some business application. [stuff deleted] Yeah that is what they said about the Apple Lisa when it first came out... it had a whopping 256k of RAM and ran on an 8mhz 68000 ("that's not a micro- it's a mini! No home user could ever take advantage of all that power"). ah yes, the times, they are a-changing..... And by the way, Mac has just released the portable....