ignac@electro.UUCP (Ignac Kolenko) (09/06/89)
hooray, hooray! i received my discount coupon for pc ditto II yesterday.
only $150 + $8 for airmail/shipping. not bad for a 10 MHz pc clone! (or
so i've heard).
it says offer expires oct 31/89. it also says it takes 4-6 weeks for
delivery. hopefully that doesn't imply that they will ship after
the closing date of the offer.
has anyone actually SEEN pc ditto II????? has anyone received it yet??
how many people have ordered it??? it would be nice to know.
--
=====Ignac A. Kolenko (The Ig) watmath!watcgl!electro!ignac=====
co-author of QuickST, and the entire line of Quick Shareware!!!!
"I don't care if I don't win, 'cause I don't care if I fail"
from 'Youth Of Today' by SUBURBAN DISTORTION NEWSTV1@CARLETON.CA (09/22/89)
I have just read the blurb on PCDitto II, the internal board for STs that gives you a PC. It says that the board only works on "unmodified" STs. If I read that correctly, it means that if I have just upgraded my 1040 to four megs with a Datafree or Aerco board, I can now pay $300 for the privilege of ripping outmy four meg ST so I can own a 640K PC. Is this correct? I'd like Avant Garde's comment on this. A cartridge system would have presumably allowed you to leave your ST functioning with whatever memory it had, and would not prevent you from turning your 520 into a four meg monster. The Spectre system, for example, gives you a bigger Mac if you put in more memory. It seems to me that PCDitto freezes you at whatever memory you have and i see no way of even expanding the PC side beyond 640k. Am I reading that pamphlet correctly?
clf3678@ultb.UUCP (C.L. Freemesser) (09/22/89)
In article <890921.12375165.090594@CU.CP6> NEWSTV1@CARLETON.CA writes: > > I have just read the blurb on PCDitto II, the internal >board for STs that gives you a PC. It says that the board >only works on "unmodified" STs. If I read that correctly, it >means that if I have just upgraded my 1040 to four megs with >a Datafree or Aerco board, I can now pay $300 for the >privilege of ripping outmy four meg ST so I can own a 640K >PC. Is this correct? I'd like Avant Garde's comment on this. My understanding was that if you have put in an upgrade that somehow effects the 68000 itself, such as an accelerator or the JRI 4096 color expander, you can't install the PC DITTO II. All of these upgrades sit atop, or require the socketing of, the 68000 itself. So if you have already modified your 68000 by putting something atop or underneath it, you can't put in a PC DITTO II. Your memory upgrade should not effect the PC DITTO. However, you may run into a power problem. 4 megs certainly pulls alot of power, and the PC DITTO II may overtax your power supply. Personally, I would not put in both unless I knew my power supply was strong enough. Chris Freemesser, Rochester Institute of Technology | What I like : BITNET: %clf3678@RITVAX GEnie: C.FREEMESSER | 1) My Atari ST USENET: Just reply and hope it gets through | 2) My '77 Mercury Call the ACORN BBS (716)436-3078, 300/1200 baud | 3) Coke Classic
bob@cmpfen.UUCP (Bob Breum) (09/23/89)
NEWSTV1@CARLETON.CA writes: > I have just read the blurb on PCDitto II, the internal >board for STs that gives you a PC. It says that the board >only works on "unmodified" STs. If I read that correctly, it >means that if I have just upgraded my 1040 to four megs with >a Datafree or Aerco board, I can now pay $300 for the >privilege of ripping outmy four meg ST so I can own a 640K >PC. Is this correct? I'd like Avant Garde's comment on this. I called their tech support number and inquired about this. My 520ST has a Tech Specialties memory upgrade board with an additional 2MB of DRAM, and I had the same concern. They said that pc-Ditto II would not interfere with memory upgrades. I think their concern was for 16MHz upgrades. -- Computer Fenestrations Bob Breum Post Office Box 151 {uiucuxc|hoptoad|petsd|ucf-cs}!peora!cmpfen!bob Lake Monroe, FL 32747 USA +1 407 322-3222 (if a modem answers, try 322-2002) "C is the new BASIC"
Bob_BobR_Retelle@cup.portal.com (09/24/89)
Chris Freemesser says:
>Your memory upgrade should not effect the PC DITTO.
That's true, as far as connecting to the 68000, but what I'm still wondering
is where the PC-DITTO II board is supposed to *FIT* inside the ST...
My AERCO upgrade board takes up a LOT of space inside my 520ST...
I wonder just how much room will be needed to cram a PC DITTO II in there
too...
BobRdepeche@quiche.cs.mcgill.ca (Sam Alan EZUST) (09/25/89)
In article <890921.12375165.090594@CU.CP6> NEWSTV1@CARLETON.CA writes: > > I have just read the blurb on PCDitto II, the internal >board for STs that gives you a PC. It says that the board >only works on "unmodified" STs. If I read that correctly, it >means that if I have just upgraded my 1040 to four megs with >a Datafree or Aerco board, I can now pay $300 for the >privilege of ripping outmy four meg ST so I can own a 640K >PC. Is this correct? I'd like Avant Garde's comment on this. Strange - as it is the original pcditto emulates a PC with 703k memory free - which is (my guess) different depending on how much memory is on-board on an st. I can't imagine new restrictions being imposed on the new version which weren't imposed on the original... Now what I would like to know is, I am just about to get tos 1.4 installed on my 1040st. Will that make it incompatible?
FRAJKOR@CARLETON.CA (10/12/89)
Can someone (preferably someone from Avant Garde if they monitor this line) answer thequestion as to whether installing PC DittoII in an At ari 1040 ST precludes upgrading the 1040s memory to more than it originally had? The plamphlet advertising PC Ditto II says it works with "unmodified" STs. I take this tomean that if I have a 1040 with one meg now, I cannot upgrade it to 4 meg and still intall PC Ditto. Am I correct? Does t it mean that to get a 640K IBM clone I have to give up a 4meg ST? They say I am a skeptic, but I do not believe them-- old Slovak proverb
ignac@electro.UUCP (Ignac Kolenko) (11/15/89)
well, just the other day, i got a bit of mail from avante garde. it seems
like pc ditto ii won't be shipping until late november. at least the
company took the time out to mail me a notice of the delay. i was beginning
to wonder where my $150 went.
--
=====Ignac A. Kolenko (The Ig) watmath!watcgl!electro!ignac=====
co-author of QuickST, and the entire line of Quick Shareware!!!!
"I don't care if I don't win, 'cause I don't care if I fail"
from 'Youth Of Today' by SUBURBAN DISTORTION lawrence@techpub1.iscs.com (Lawrence Kelley 99) (11/20/89)
In article <1184@electro.UUCP> ignac@electro.UUCP (Ignac Kolenko) writes: > >well, just the other day, i got a bit of mail from avante garde. it seems >like pc ditto ii won't be shipping until late november. at least the >company took the time out to mail me a notice of the delay. i was beginning >to wonder where my $150 went. > Yes, I got a postcard from them too. But, they also promised that they would "ship" some third-party reviews of PC Ditto II. Has anyone out there even seen this product?
kirk@gpstwr.UUCP (Kirk Bradford) (12/16/89)
Does anybody no where PC Ditto II stands? I don't have an account with GENIE or Compuserve and I can not get through to them over the phone. Any info would be very much appreciated. Please Email any responses. Thanks # Kirk Bradford tektronix!gvgpsa!gpstwr!kirk # or # kirk@gpstwr.uucp # Graham-Patten Systems, Grass Valley, CA # Phone 916-273-8412
BAKAY1B@UREGINAV.BITNET ("No one here gets out alive...") (02/05/90)
I have been considering purchasing pc ditto II, but I need to know a few things first. What level of IBM graphics does it support (ie EGA, CGA, etc)? Does it read atari joystick ports? Is there going to be a PC Ditto III in the near future? How difficult is it to hook up? Answers to any of these questions would be greatly appreciated. Brook M. Bakay Bakay1b@ureginav.bitnet
psurge@cs.utexas.edu (Troy Carpenter) (02/07/90)
I have heard that with the switch of board designs that AG has pumped the
PC Ditto II up to Norton SI of 4.0, has anyone else heard that?
And has anyone actually gotten theirs yet (that works).
Troy Carpenter
Computer Sciences
THE University of Texas, Austin
psurge@cs.utexas.edu haacke@exunido.uucp (Ralf Haacke) (02/07/90)
>I have been considering purchasing pc ditto II, but I need to know a few >things first. What level of IBM graphics does it support (ie EGA, CGA, etc)? pc ditto II supports CGA, Hercules, Hercules(640x400), ATT and PC monochrome. >Does it read atari joystick ports? the Atari-Mouse and the serial PC-Mouse are supported by pc-ditto II >Is there going to be a PC Ditto III in the near future? I think: NO! Dieter Fiebelkorn
dhe@uafhcx.uucp (David Ewing) (02/15/90)
Since there hasn't been any mention of this subject for awhile I though
that I'd ask....What's the current status on PCDITTO II? The last I heard it
was halted from shipping because of a bug that make it fail on certain ST's. I
apologize to anyone who is getting tired of seeing these messages, but I could
really use PCDITTO II.
-Dave
==============================================================================
dhe@uafhcx.uark.edu David Ewing, University of Arkansas
dhe@uafb15.uark.edu "DON'T PANIC!!!" Computer Science Engineering
==============================================================================whoffman@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Walt Hoffman) (02/15/90)
I received my PCDitto II about 2 weeks ago. I installed it into my 1meg 520ST
and it didn't work. It hung right after the point where it asks for a DOS
disk. By scanning GEnie messages, I found that my problem was not all that
unique. The problem seems to be timing differences in the MMU chip in the ST.
There is a fix for the problem to change out two PAL chips (in sockets). I
have included a copy of the message from Avante-Garde Systems retrieved from
GEnie.
Now if we only had the 2-way GEnie hookup active, it could have been here a lot
sooner. :-) (I just had to do that, Dave(GBS))
--- following message retrieved from GEnie ---
Category 19, Topic 2
Message 73 Mon Feb 12, 1990
AVANTGARDE at 16:54 EST
Dear pc-ditto II owners,
We are happy to announce we have found the problem with pc-ditto II hardware
not working with some STs. We were correct about the changes in timings of
some machines being the heart of the problem and our correction widens the
tolerance for machines with different timings. We can discuss our findings at
a later time in detail, if there are any engineers interested. For now,
however, the following describes what to do to receive an update:
1. Correction involves replacement of two socketed chips on your pc-ditto
II board. The chips are labeled: U27 GLUPAL (part TIBPAL 20L8-25CNT)
and U15 EMSPAL (part TIBPAL 16R4-25CN).
2. Please carefully remove these chips (a flat-edge screwdriver under
the end of each chip works best). CAUTION: Please observe static
discharge procedures (as noted in the pc-ditto II Installation Manual)
to prevent damage to your board.
3. Then, wrap the two chips in a soft packing material and return to
Avant-Garde Systems at the following address:
Avant-Garde System
381 Pablo Point Drive
Jacksonville, Florida 32225
(You may call (904) 221-2904 9am to 5pm Mon-Fri if you have questions.)
4. Please include your name and return address.
5. We will return two new replacement chips immediately along with
instructions on replacing them.
For owners with pc-ditto II that are already working, replacement of these two
chips will not help you. Therefore, we would not recommend "fixing your
product if its not broken".
We are now working on a blitter fix and standardized Mega expansion port
fixture and will post a message soon about those items.
(Also, if you have already called or written, you will be receiving a letter
concerning the above, as well).
Thanks!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, 4800 Oak Grove Dr., Pasadena, CA 91109
"It better work 'cause after launch, service calls are quite expensive.
It's only $40 for the call but it's the mileage that kills you."
Walt Hoffman, Real-time Analyst, Galileo Orbiter Engineering Team
------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
- if it GLISTENS, gobble it!!lawrence@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM (Lawrence Kelly) (02/15/90)
In article <3703@uafhp.uark.edu> dhe@uafhcx.uucp (David Ewing) writes: > >that I'd ask....What's the current status on PCDITTO II? The last I heard it >was halted from shipping because of a bug that make it fail on certain ST's. As far as the bug is concerned, you heard correctly. Avante Garde recently (2-12-90) posted a message on Genie confirming a timing problem between the PCD II and the 68000 on the ST. The proposed solution is to replace two PALS on the PCD II board (U27 and U15). These are socketed and shouldn't be a problem. They want those with problems to remove them, mail them to AG and *then* they will send replacement chips. I think they have it backward. They should send out the fix first. PALS are dirt cheap and readily available. Since I don't have my PCD II yet, I'm hoping that it will arrive soon with the new PALS and will run fine. If you want an exercise in frustration, try calling AG at (904) 221-2904 9:00 a, to 5:00 pm M-F. I did. It took me two days to get through. Thos few who have a working PCD II say it's worth the wait. Let's hope so. SuperCharger is looking real good, but it's $399. Shalom, lawrence
lawrence@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM (Lawrence Kelly) (02/17/90)
In article <2848@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov> whoffman@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Walt Hoffman) writes: >I received my PCDitto II about 2 weeks ago. I installed it into my 1meg 520ST >and it didn't work. Can you tell me when you sent in your card so I can estimate when I might get mine? I waited until 10-15-89 to send mine in. AG is sending the PCD II out in the same order the cards were received. Thanks, lawrence
whoffman@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Walt Hoffman) (02/20/90)
In article <2749@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM> lawrence@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM (Lawrence Kelly) writes: >In article <2848@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov> whoffman@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov (Walt Hoffman) writes: >>I received my PCDitto II about 2 weeks ago. I installed it into my 1meg 520ST >>and it didn't work. > >Can you tell me when you sent in your card so I can estimate when I might get >mine? I waited until 10-15-89 to send mine in. AG is sending the PCD II out >in the same order the cards were received. > >Thanks, lawrence I sent my order in around September 2. A copy of my order form was packed with my board and had a number 643 written on it. That probably was my number in the queue for my order. (I don't remember the exact number but it was in the mid-600's.) AG encountered problems of their boards not working on all STs due to differences in timing between machines. They have a 2-chip fix for it, and maybe they will install it on yours before they ship it. That could save you some time. I have a 520ST with 1 meg and it was quite a job getting it to fit. I had to cut the center post off the ST case so I could install it without interfering with the keyboard electronics. It does fix but takes some creativity and determination to find the right spot. If it works as well as PCditto I only faster, I will be extremely happy. -- Were these parsnips CORRECTLY MARINATED in TACO SAUCE?
ericco@stew.ssl.berkeley.edu (Eric C. Olson) (02/28/90)
I got PC DITTO II in the mail last week. The installation was easy. However, it doesn't work. The software indicates that the board is not properly connected. Does this message indicate that the new chips are required. Eric ericco@ssl.berkeley.edu Eric ericco@ssl.berkeley.edu
lawrence@isc-br.ISC-BR.COM (Lawrence Kelley) (02/28/90)
In article <1990Feb27.171030.6687@agate.berkeley.edu> ericco@stew.ssl.berkeley.edu (Eric C. Olson) writes: >I got PC DITTO II in the mail last week. The installation was easy. >However, it doesn't work. > >The software indicates that the board is not properly connected. Does >this message indicate that the new chips are required. > According to messages that Avant Garde has posted on Genie, it probably means that the connector really is not properly seated on all pins. AG says the only way to really know you have good connections is to do a continuity check of each pin. All reports that I've read on genie indicate that it's a pain to get seated. If you verify all pins and it still doesn't work, I'd suspect the PALS. You can mail them to AG or send them email on genie if you have an account. Good luck. I'm still waiting on my PCD III. When did you send your card in? Shalom, lawrence
ignac@electro.UUCP (Ignac Kolenko) (03/05/90)
hey guys. i thought the world was a great place friday when i finally!!!
received pc ditto II. well, i finally got around to installing it today, and
hey, what do you know, it don't work worth a damn. my major concerns are:
the installation manual refers to a user's manual, which was not in the
box, and there is no user manual info in the installation manual. sheesh.
the installation manual refers to a program called PCD2DIAG.PRG which is
supposed to be on the master disk, but again, no such luck. just the
same sort of files from pc ditto I (ie: pcdmenu (which hasn't even been
updated since pcdI, or at least it looks that way). this is disturbing since
i wouldn't mind knowing what is wrong with the installation (i am assuming
that it is the pal problem since it gets as far as reading the ibm boot
sector, and then it dies)
other observations:
my god, what a big bloody board they're using!!!!! it might as well be a
complete ibm for its size! i originally heard that it was supposed to be
the size of the clip to the 68000. of course the manual doesn't say how or
where it's supposed to mount inside the ST since i can't seem to find
a natural place for this monstrosity.
the cables are skewed and twisted over one another. sheesh. double sheesh.
well, until i get them updated pals, i guess the old st will have to be in
this opened, dishevelled state. unfortunately for avante garde, the whole
deal looks quite unprofessional, and the problems with leaving out entire
manuals/programs mentionned in the installation guide leaves a lot to be
desired!
just a few disgruntled thoughts ...
--
=====Ignac A. Kolenko (The Ig)=====watmath!watcgl!electro!brasoft!ignac======
co-author of QuickST, and the entire line of Quick Software!!!!
Branch Always Software Box 2624, Station B, Kitchener, Ont. CANADA N2H 6N2
=============================================================================GINGRICH-T@osu-20.ircc.ohio-state.edu (Tyler S Gingrich) (07/20/90)
For Sale:
PC Ditto II - unused (my 68000 has a factory mod soldered to the chip!!)
Price - $120 + shipping
Contact - Tyler Gingrich
5441 Dexter Falls Rd
Columbus OH 43221
(614)771-9187
Tylerssmith@ac.dal.ca (09/04/90)
I have a friend who has installed PC DITTO II in his atari. He said he has been trying to make it work for a month now. I have no experience with atari products but know somthing about ibm stuff. Does anybody know if there are any tricks to making this product work. Are there any jumper or switch setting to be concerned about? Any hints or basic concerns (ie interrupts, dma, etc) wouldm be appreciated. Please post to this list Thanks, G. James
hcj@lzsc.ATT.COM (HC Johnson) (09/05/90)
In article <1935@ac.dal.ca>, ssmith@ac.dal.ca writes: > I have a friend who has installed PC DITTO II in his atari. He said he has > been trying to make it work for a month now. I have no experience with atari > products but know somthing about ibm stuff. > Does anybody know if there are any tricks to making this product work. > Are there any jumper or switch setting to be concerned about? > Any hints or basic concerns (ie interrupts, dma, etc) wouldm be appreciated. > Please post to this list > > Thanks, G. James The scheme used by PC Ditto to clamp the header on the 68000 chip is awful. SOLDER it to the 68000. This is not trivial, but is necessary for consistent performance. I used a Weller constant temp iron with a very long tip. Also, Don't forget the jumper on the Math Chip socket of the PCD II board. It absolutely necessary. Howard C. Johnson ATT Bell Labs att!lzsc!hcj hcj@lzsc.att.com
fsdmb3@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (BRAUN DAVID M) (09/06/90)
In article <1935@ac.dal.ca>, ssmith@ac.dal.ca writes... >I have a friend who has installed PC DITTO II in his atari. He said he has >been trying to make it work for a month now. I have no experience with atari >products but know somthing about ibm stuff. >Does anybody know if there are any tricks to making this product work. >Are there any jumper or switch setting to be concerned about? >Any hints or basic concerns (ie interrupts, dma, etc) wouldm be appreciated. >Please post to this list > >Thanks, G. James I got my PC-ditto working the first try when I installed it, it died a month later but that is a different story. Make sure that the pins of the 68000 piggyback connecter are tight, bend the pins inward (EVENLY!) so that it snaps on tight. make sure you put in the jumper if you don't have a coprocessor. re-check the lines on the cables, they should be oposite on either end, they cross in the middle. If it is installed correctly it should come up with the main screen fairly quickly after running the program (on a hard drive). That is about all I can think of right off hand, the PCDMENU program has OK defaults, just check which drive is designated as A and B. Hope this helps. 8-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- David M. Braun FSDMB3@ALASKA.BITNET Samurai and Lizards, Reptiles and Samurai. fsdmb3@acad3.fai.alaska.edu --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Christopher M Mauritz) (09/08/90)
[much advice on how to coerce PC Ditto II to work]
Frankly, I'm amazed that people still purchase PC Ditto II.
The problems are well documented and there are more stable
products available at similar prices. Am I missing something?
Cheers,
Chris (temporarily computerless) Mauritz
------------------------------+---------------------------
Chris Mauritz |D{r det finns en |l, finns
cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu |det en plan!
(c)All rights reserved. |
Send flames to /dev/null |
------------------------------+---------------------------psurge@cs.utexas.edu (Troy Carpenter) (09/11/90)
In article <1990Sep8.140933.29490@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: > > Frankly, I'm amazed that people still purchase PC Ditto II. > The problems are well documented and there are more stable > products available at similar prices. Am I missing something? > Avant Garde offered PC Ditto II to those who had the original PC Ditto program and were registered users a deal on the PCD II. With the special coupon send by them, PCDII only cost $150, which is much less than the other pc boards. Now all that ordered one when it came out are receiving their boards and now the plethora of problems is arising. (yep, I got hit too, my cables are bad and need to have new ones made...) . Troy Carpenter Department of Computer Sciences THE University of Texas, Austin psurge@cs.utexas.edu
fsdmb3@acad3.fai.alaska.edu (BRAUN DAVID M) (09/12/90)
In article <12373@cs.utexas.edu>, psurge@cs.utexas.edu (Troy Carpenter) writes... >In article <1990Sep8.140933.29490@cunixf.cc.columbia.edu>, cmm1@cunixa.cc.columbia.edu (Christopher M Mauritz) writes: >> >> Frankly, I'm amazed that people still purchase PC Ditto II. > >Avant Garde offered PC Ditto II to those who had the original PC Ditto program >and were registered users a deal on the PCD II. With the special coupon send >by them, PCDII only cost $150, which is much less than the other pc boards. >Now all that ordered one when it came out are receiving their boards and now >the plethora of problems is arising. > > Troy Carpenter Yep, I got in on this, great deal, right? My PC-Ditto II worked fine for three weeks, since then I have been trying to get it fixed, lately they havn't been answering the phone, and today I got a letter back from them marked: AVANT GARDE MOVED & Left no address, Unable to Forward, return to Sender!! the Address I used is for: 381 Pablo Point Drive, Jacksonville, FL 32225. Does anyone have a newer Address, I was never notified of the change in my other corrispondances with them... Any sugestions? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- David M. Braun FSDMB3@ALASKA.BITNET Samurai and Lizards, Reptiles and Samurai. fsdmb3@acad3.fai.alaska.edu --------------------------------------------------------------------------------